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Old 12-03-2012, 07:49 PM   #85
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Yes, cause the memories we are making as a family is priceless!
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Old 12-04-2012, 05:41 AM   #86
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Clearly there is a difference between borrowing money as a tax maneuver and borrowing it for the purpose of spending money you don't have. As I look for a used DP, I see people that are trying to sell because they are upside down in their RV loan. They bought with money they didn't have on the assumption that their income stream would increase or at least remain constant for the duration of the loan. Now they are forced to come up with a pile of cash out of thin air (in addition to the RV sale) just to climb up to zero and stop the monthly payments they can't afford in the first place.

Sadly, some will go into denial and continue to look for the magic buyer that fully appreciates the sentimental value of their RV. My neighbor bought his boat from a fellow that had it at the brokerage for a year, turning down offers and incurring about $20,000 in dockage, depreciation, interest, insurance, etc. He then had to come up with an additional $25,000 to cover the difference between the outstanding loan and the real-world value.

Yes, you can call it a lifestyle, but first and foremost an RV or boat is a depreciating luxury item, which the buyer must fully understand. On the other hand, an RV was a much better "investment" than the stock market a few years ago.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:18 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by TwelveVolt View Post
Clearly there is a difference between borrowing money as a tax maneuver and borrowing it for the purpose of spending money you don't have. As I look for a used DP, I see people that are trying to sell because they are upside down in their RV loan. They bought with money they didn't have on the assumption that their income stream would increase or at least remain constant for the duration of the loan. Now they are forced to come up with a pile of cash out of thin air (in addition to the RV sale) just to climb up to zero and stop the monthly payments they can't afford in the first place.

Sadly, some will go into denial and continue to look for the magic buyer that fully appreciates the sentimental value of their RV. My neighbor bought his boat from a fellow that had it at the brokerage for a year, turning down offers and incurring about $20,000 in dockage, depreciation, interest, insurance, etc. He then had to come up with an additional $25,000 to cover the difference between the outstanding loan and the real-world value.

Yes, you can call it a lifestyle, but first and foremost an RV or boat is a depreciating luxury item, which the buyer must fully understand. On the other hand, an RV was a much better "investment" than the stock market a few years ago.
A lot of those selling we're in good financial shape when they bought there rv's, but things have changed for them big time, homes with little to no equity now, loss of jobs. Very easy to judge now since hindsight is 2020, but very few expected or could predict the total collapse that happened.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:33 PM   #88
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I like to get my toys the way I want them........ So, NEW works for me.
As GaryKD basically said, if you're going to keep the thing, depreciation only matters if you recognize it. If it bothers you, go buy someone else's stuff second-hand, no problem. But 'buying new" is perfectly fine as well. It's all about what you value.
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Old 12-04-2012, 02:24 PM   #89
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A lot of those selling we're in good financial shape when they bought there rv's, but things have changed for them big time, homes with little to no equity now, loss of jobs. Very easy to judge now since hindsight is 2020, but very few expected or could predict the total collapse that happened.
You are completely correct
No matter what state or country we have all been affected by the GFC.
The flip side is if you saved a bucket load of money to buy your RV outright you may not have a mortgage but you bucket is still empty and not much to show for it.
I was told by a respectable dealer that finance for motorhomes is becoming more available so we should see a reversal of the downward pressures in the near future.
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Old 12-04-2012, 04:43 PM   #90
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I was told by a respectable dealer that finance for motorhomes is becoming more available so we should see a reversal of the downward pressures in the near future.
My respectable realtor friend has been saying that about the real estate market year after year after year. Always consider the personal motivation of the source.
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Old 12-04-2012, 08:45 PM   #91
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I have very little trust for salesmen, dealers, realitors, bankers and most investment brokers.

Now that leaves me to do my own planing for all the above, meaning retirement, taxes, money for the DW after I am gone. So far So good.

I do not plant money in cans in the back yard, have thought about it.
Being 71, and being a realist, I am not saving anything for the wifes next buffalo. As long as the dw keeps her money clear of him, she will be very fine for 30+ years, so I smile and spend alot of time in the Foretravel burning diesel fuel waiting for the undertaker.
Life is good
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:09 PM   #92
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I'd be thrilled to have enough money to justify having a financial adviser.

As a mid-thirty-something middle class male with a wife and 2 little kids and a very average income, a used entry level DP was clearly the affordable route for us... and even at that, the cost of fixing up this old girl has been quite a bit more than I had expected.

When we started looking for our first RV, I had a couple rules to try and stick to... #1 - No monthly payment. Technically we don't have a payment, but I cheated... we refinanced the house to a lower rate and cashed out some equity. The new rate was good enough that our monthly mortgage did not go up at all, nor did our timeframe for payback change. Depending on how you want to look at it... we got a (nearly) free motorhome. lol... that's what I tell myself anyways... so I can feel good about our decision. #2 - I wanted to buy something that if by chance we fell on hard times, we would be able to get our money back out of it. I'm not sure #2 is panning out for us given the cost of repairs thus far (even doing all the work myself) but we made a noble attempt.

I never expected RVing to be free, but I did try to minimize the cost and maximize value and enjoyment, all in relationship to our budget. If I was in a different tax bracket, I would still do the same... just with larger numbers... and perhaps even a new DP if our level of income would support it.

At the end of the day, if you can part with the money necessary to own a new DP... and if you feel confident you can absorb the hit should you be forced to sell it one day... then by all means... enjoy. We're all pretty much in the same boat when you think about it... no one has limitless resources, and we all have the human tendency to want just a little bit more than what we already have. The guy looking at the 20 year old motorhome (me) is thinking the same thing that the guy buying the brand new 40' DP... "Maybe we should get something a little better... can we afford it?... this is crazy... etc etc..." lol

One of the keys to finding true joy in this life is learning to be content with what you have. If you're not content with where you're at, you won't likely be content with wherever it is you think you want to be.

Just my $.02.

cheers
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:37 AM   #93
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Think of it this way....
Some of us fools who like new equipment and don't realize or care about the depreciation, gotta buy spanking new, so there will be some quality used products which have already taken the big depreciation hit, for those wiser folks who like to enjoy the life but not take the hit. This is a WIN-WIN situation!
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Old 12-07-2012, 05:39 PM   #94
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Think of it this way....
Some of us fools who like new equipment and don't realize or care about the depreciation, gotta buy spanking new, so there will be some quality used products which have already taken the big depreciation hit, for those wiser folks who like to enjoy the life but not take the hit. This is a WIN-WIN situation!
Well if you could buy a '14 Anthem I would buy it in '15. Just an initial offer
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:11 PM   #95
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Think of it this way....
Some of us fools who like new equipment and don't realize or care about the depreciation, gotta buy spanking new, so there will be some quality used products which have already taken the big depreciation hit, for those wiser folks who like to enjoy the life but not take the hit. This is a WIN-WIN situation!
So how did you acquire all this care-free money...or credit line...if you are one of the so-called fools? Inheritance? Lottery? Crime? Hard work?

I don't think for a moment that I am wiser for having what I have...only fortunate. My whole life I have been struggling just to get where I am and envy no person for what they have.

I find your post facetious and not at all humorous.
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:26 PM   #96
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So how did you acquire all this care-free money...or credit line...if you are one of the so-called fools? Inheritance? Lottery? Crime? Hard work?

I don't think for a moment that I am wiser for having what I have...only fortunate. My whole life I have been struggling just to get where I am and envy no person for what they have.

I find your post facetious and not at all humorous.
I think it was tongue in cheek...
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:39 PM   #97
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I think buying a brand new motorhome was worth every penny.
Growing up we didn't have a lot of money and I wore second hand clothes for years on end...Until I turned 15 and started working full time in the summer.
I bought used cars for years and gave up many other things just to get by....Well when it came time to buy the MH it was a no brainer for me because we could finally afford it, and to pay cash instead of making payments.
We finally are in a position to enjoy the fruits of our labor.
Besides; the wife wanted ONLY A NEW ONE.
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:59 PM   #98
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Think of it this way....
Some of us fools who like new equipment and don't realize or care about the depreciation, gotta buy spanking new, so there will be some quality used products which have already taken the big depreciation hit, for those wiser folks who like to enjoy the life but not take the hit. This is a WIN-WIN situation!
Fools or not, the rest of us appreciate your contributions to the used market. I believe I will get as much satisfaction out of fixing it as I will from traveling in it.
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