Community Forums

cb1000rider · 06-25-2012, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VanDiemen23

If the engine temp gets over 180 I'd guess the oil dilution would not be that big a deal - the gas should boil off. But - at idle the engine makes minimum oil pressure and flow rate and it's generally not enough to adequately protect the cam and mains. That's why you see warranty disclaimers about police and taxi service.

Are you guys serious? It can't idle for long periods due to rings not sealing and it can't idle for long periods due to minimum oil pressure?

Sorry, I'm having trouble buying it. Modern oil pumps and motors easily put at 20-30psi of idle. More than enough to lubricate modern parts. Look at the wear spec on V8s oil pressure specs are ridiculous, usually considered "OK" as low as 10psi per 1000 rpm.

Pull the valve cover on a vehicle at idle, it'll sling oil everywhere...

I'll bet they idle for months just like police and taxi vehicles w/o incident...

Mikeflyme · 07-08-2012, 07:12 PM

I recently ran the xB toad idling in Neutral and no Brake Buddy and the results were normal, no tugging and no xB brakes fighting the Brake Buddy...ran it for 5 miles roundtrip to 45 mph and no problems at all...Next I will tow the toad in same format for about 25 miles and recheck results.

The owners manual states the engine should not be allowed to idle for longer than 20 mins at a time...could this be due to the possible fuel leakdown into the oil, as mentioned earlier in a previous post?

Since the Scion xB engine 1.5L with VVT-I sips fuel at around .15 gal/hour while idling, I have trouble thinking the fuel leakdown could be that quick, if any...comments?

Again, the Remco pump has now been proven and available for this engine (at $1095 plus 5-6 Hrs install..OUCH), but I've been told multiple times I can do the above idling-in-Neutral procedure for 100 miles or an hour without any trans/engine damage.

Mikeflyme · 07-30-2012, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikeflyme

I recently ran the xB toad idling in Neutral and no Brake Buddy and the results were normal, no tugging and no xB brakes fighting the Brake Buddy...ran it for 5 miles roundtrip to 45 mph and no problems at all...Next I will tow the toad in same format for about 25 miles and recheck results.

The owners manual states the engine should not be allowed to idle for longer than 20 mins at a time...could this be due to the possible fuel leakdown into the oil, as mentioned earlier in a previous post?

Since the Scion xB engine 1.5L with VVT-I sips fuel at around .15 gal/hour while idling, I have trouble thinking the fuel leakdown could be that quick, if any...comments?

Again, the Remco pump has now been proven and available for this engine (at $1095 plus 5-6 Hrs install..OUCH), but I've been told multiple times I can do the above idling-in-Neutral procedure for 100 miles or an hour without any trans/engine damage.

I recently did the Mobil 1 oil change and filter on the xB toad so I'd have new synthetic oil in th engine for the future extended trips with the xB in tow.

I ran the coach/toad for a 25 mile run with the 2006 Scion xB with engine idling and the FWD automatic in Neutral today...Checked brake temps at each wheel and all 4 below 109*, with the outside temps around 94*.

I did not install the Brake Buddy as the xB only weighs under 2500 lbs with full fuel.

Also, the fuel gauge on the xB started the trip a a hair under 3/4 tank and when done, it was slightly over the 3/4 mark....HMMM, must have been the car sitting off-center in the swale before the trip.

Didn't notice any braking issues as I use the Jake Brake along with the coach brakes.

stephen44 · 07-31-2012, 12:01 PM

It may be they are worried about damage to the catalytic converter - as it may not reach full temp - just at idle.
I remember there was a long discussion about this on one of the ford forums years ago.

Stephen

Mikeflyme · 08-15-2012, 11:44 AM

Update:

Towed the xB toad one-way a total of 165 miles from Naples, FL to Lazydays in Seffner, FL last week.

Weather was steady to torrential downpours with the Engine idling in Neutral and stopped twice enroute to check the toad...no problems...fuel used was less than 1/8 of a tank, or probably less than 2 gals.

Drove the xB around while in Tampa area with no problems, so this combo appears to work for the short runs.

Brockx · 08-18-2012, 05:09 AM

Many years ago (80's) I read an article in a Popular magazine about towing with engine, running in gear, above idle with a servo. Supposedly the overall fuel consumption was less and protected the transmission. We were interested in a MH at that time and experienced a job change that negated that desire. Finally got an MH this summer and always wondered about the "live tow". I found this thread as a search today and was amazed, I had not heard of towing "running toads" thought it was dead or hidden.

topdownman · 08-22-2012, 07:18 AM

I've never done this myself, but was once behind a motorhome flat towing a late model Caddy Deville. I know the engine on the Caddy was running because it was winter and you could see the condensation steam coming from the exhaust pipes. They were from out-of-state, so I assumed at that time it was possible and was intriguing.

BFlinn181 · 08-22-2012, 08:13 AM

Another option no one else has raised... Use a tow dolly with brakes. I know people don't like them, but for the price of the Remco pump plus installation, the Brake Buddy, wear on idling engine, it seems like a cheaper way to go. Solves the braking problem, I would not tow without brakes. In many states its against the law, not to mention the law of physics. A dolly can be backed up (short distances) 4 down towed can't. I've read on here about transmission pumps failing, not an worry with a dolly. Just something to think about.

Mikeflyme · 08-23-2012, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topdownman

I've never done this myself, but was once behind a motorhome flat towing a late model Caddy Deville. I know the engine on the Caddy was running because it was winter and you could see the condensation steam coming from the exhaust pipes. They were from out-of-state, so I assumed at that time it was possible and was intriguing.

Assuming an automatic trans, the question of whether the Caddy was FWD or RWD remains...if RWD, then a driveshaft disconnect was probably their answer, but the FWD would mean this option could work...but the weight of the car would definitely dictate the need for a brake system, etc.

I had a 2002 FWD Deville and a 2005 RWD STS, which I considered at first...the STS was RWD but a driveshaft disconnect was not doable, per Blue Ox since there was minimal steel in the frontal area to build a base plate for.

The FWD Deville was discounted since it had 150K miles on it and I wanted a reliable future vehicle as the toad...finally settled on the 2006 Scion xB as it gave me close to the same storage area inside as my previous 2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee, and I get almost 2.5 times the MPG when I'm using it compared to the JGC, and it's my daily driver when I'm home.

The fact it idles in Neutral with only 0.15/gallons/hour fuel burn was a pleasant surprise that I found out later...plus it weighs 2390 lbs so it doesn't require the aux brake system.

It's not for everybody, just another alternative...

Mike

Mikeflyme · 01-20-2013, 06:59 PM

An update on towing the Scion xB in Neutral with engine idling.

I have now clocked over 2,000 miles using this setup above and the Scion xB just keeps driving away after being towed with no side effects.

I do stop every 100 miles and check the connections and insure the engine is still idling, but there's only about a gallon or less used on a 250 mile trip to Florida Grand Motorcoach Resort near Webster, FL in December, 2012.

We used the xB for our travels to Orlando, Wildwood, The Villages and Lutz areas over a week...then towed the xB back to Naples, FL on another 250 mile return leg.

Mikeflyme