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Old 05-08-2012, 07:05 AM   #15
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lajuene,

Thanks for the photo. Looks like it was an easy fix. Flexible conduit is a good idea. On my install, I used it everywhere there was a possibility of rub.
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Old 05-08-2012, 06:50 PM   #16
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OK, so bottom line guys; is the Invisi Brake worth all this hassle?
I have just bought a new Wrangler Unlimited after 5 years with a 2 door as our dinghy. I was optimistic in thinking that all the Roadmaster stuff I'd had on it would transfer seamlessly to the new ride. Wrong!
Nothing fits, not even the MX mounting bracket kit. Jeep has changed the front bumper internally, tho' outside it looks the same.
As well, my EvenBrake is now not recommended for installation because of Jeep says that ALL electric must be turned OFF, i.e. battery disconnected because the ECU electronics on this Jeep will apparently fry if left turned on.
So Roadmaster advises an all new setup on the Jeep, and a new hard-wired LCD for the motorhome dash monitor, and a automatic toad battery disconnect with a trickle charge that would be sent via the coaches headlight system, which is OK 'cause I have daylight running lights anyway. (The only good news in this lot!)
Which all seems a huge shame after two different motorhomes, many years and miles with what had been a perfectly good package.
So, for sure I need a new mounting bracket kit, but any comments on the EvenBrake being used?
Roadmaster says that the trickle charge would not be enough to run the EvenBrake. There was no suggestion of just pulling more fuses to isolate the ECU, but wonder if that's a possibility so that I could keep the EvenBrake?!
IF I do the big change, I would most likely have Roadmaster do the whole thing at their main facility in Vancouver, WA, so would expect that it would be done right the first time, not like my last instal that almost burned the Jeep; long story!
Comments, please. Thanks, Peter
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Old 05-09-2012, 06:29 AM   #17
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Proyham-- I went to Camping World yesterday to check on getting a tow package for our 2012 Wrangler, scared the sh*t out of me when they gave me the price. They said it needed battery disconect, diodes, and a lot more then my 95' Wrangler.
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Old 05-09-2012, 07:41 AM   #18
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Why did you have to pay for them to fox it the second time, they made the mistake and should have fixed it.
Exactly. I would have them eat the cost.
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:10 PM   #19
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Proyham-- I went to Camping World yesterday to check on getting a tow package for our 2012 Wrangler, scared the sh*t out of me when they gave me the price. They said it needed battery disconect, diodes, and a lot more then my 95' Wrangler.
That's exactly what Roadmaster recommended, as well. I guess if they don't do what Jeep says has to be done then RM would be in deep doodoo. And Jeep says you have to have the battery disconnected and thus the ECU (?) etc not powered up while towing, I think that's what they mean, anyway.
Is there any option? If the EvenBrake I already have will not work in this situation, what are the choices?
Towing the Jeep even without supplemental braking, which is illegal in most jurisdictions now, requires that the key is in the accessory position, which fires up all sorts of electricals. I thought pulling appropriate fuses might be an option, but this was not suggested by RM tech.
Screwed and glued!
Given the apparent complexities of the new Jeep, I will defer to the experts (Roadmaster) for this one. As per my earlier post, too scary to have someone experiment on this vehicle, don't you agree?
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:56 PM   #20
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As for running the wires under the mats. They should always be run along the edge of the running board and not under the feet area. Conduit is not necessary. Many new vehicles have room under the running board area covered by plastic. By running board I mean the inside piece that covers the edge of the carpet. If possible the wires should be run under the passenger side to really ease the foot traffic and damage.

Even as an ET that owns a telecommunications service center with 40 yrs experience in the 12 volt world I found installing my invisibrake challenging. It took a lot of planning and layout to come up with the wiring paths and adding diodes etc. Then when all of that was done I found my backup lights when trying to tow my boat with surge brakes would not work. The extra load from the backup lights on the boat trailer told my fancy new Ford Edge that there was a fault. So no backup lights and worse yet the boat brakes would not unlock so I can back up. I had to install my own relay powered by my backup lights and then battery power through the relay.

And before that my base plate mfgr said an Edge with the front radar system could not be used with their plate. I understand because of liability they cannot endorse my modification. But in any case, installing these things are not for novices. I believe the ready brake might be the solution for the amatuer.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:48 AM   #21
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IS the invisi brake worth the hassle.. I will describe a few different systems from the "hassle" viewpoint.

Invisi brake.. once installed, if done properly, all you do is plug in the lights and hook up the break-away cable.

US-Gear Unified brake decelerator, Once installed, if done properly all you do is plug in the brake control lead (Which by the way includes a system to charge the towed) and hook up the break-away cable, NOTE: This system gives the motor home driver both automatic and FULL MANUAL control of the towed brakes, Same as a Semi Driver has over his trailer, It is in my opinion the best for that reason but read on.

Ready brake, Hook up the brake and break-away cables This is a surge brake system and I'm seriously considering it for my next towed If you believe in KISS (Keep it super simple) this one is about as simple as possible.

Even Brake, Brake Buddy, Apolo and other "Box in the driver's seat" systems.. You have to install them EVERY TIME you tow and uninstall them every time you unhook.. Major hassle, These systems are very clearly NOT worth the hassle. I recommend against.

Now, back to the invisi brake.. it use electronics to control a compressed air activated solonoid.. The US gear uses an electric solonoid.. I keep wondering if the invisi brake is not better for this reason.. NOTE: i'm not sure.. I just keep wondering.. The electric solonoid is a power hog.
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Old 05-10-2012, 11:15 AM   #22
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IS the invisi brake worth the hassle.. I will describe a few different systems from the "hassle" viewpoint.

Invisi brake.. once installed, if done properly, all you do is plug in the lights and hook up the break-away cable.

Now, back to the invisi brake.. it use electronics to control a compressed air activated solonoid.. The US gear uses an electric solonoid.. I keep wondering if the invisi brake is not better for this reason.. NOTE: i'm not sure.. I just keep wondering.. The electric solonoid is a power hog.

On the Invisibrake, it also charges the towed.

My system has worked great so far. Only problem was caused by installer not routing the wire properly and it rubbed until it broke the insulation and then corroded. All better now after I fixed that.
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Old 05-10-2012, 11:16 AM   #23
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As for running the wires under the mats. They should always be run along the edge of the running board and not under the feet area. Conduit is not necessary. ....
Thats where I put them. Laziness on the installers part was the problem for mine. Belts and suspenders for me... conduit AND running under the trim instead of the floor mat and carpet.
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Old 05-10-2012, 12:34 PM   #24
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On the Invisibrake, it also charges the towed.

My system has worked great so far. Only problem was caused by installer not routing the wire properly and it rubbed until it broke the insulation and then corroded. All better now after I fixed that.
The question for me remains; why does Jeep, and possibly other vehicle manufacturers with similar concerns about continuously run electronics, suggest/require that the battery be disconnected, when pulling fuses seems an option?
The noises in my 2012 Jeep start as soon as the key is turned to accessory, i.e the squirrels start running around both in the engine compartment and in the dash area. So there's the primary problem, I suspect, because on the '07 Wrangler ONLY the accessories came on with the key in that position.
How do you deal with that situation? Is your battery disconnected? Is it being trickle charged? Is that enough to replenish the battery if there is still a compressor involved with the Invisibrake's operation?
Why is life so complicated?
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:21 PM   #25
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How do you deal with that situation? Is your battery disconnected? Is it being trickle charged? Is that enough to replenish the battery if there is still a compressor involved with the Invisibrake's operation?
Why is life so complicated?
The 2012 (and maybe 2010, 2011 not sure) do not have a locking steering wheel. I leave the key out. Nothing is powered. However the Invivibrake trickle charges the jeep anyway so if you have an older one with locking steering wheel you can have key on and it will not run the battery down. There is a compressor but it only activates when the brakes are activated (or if you pull out the breakaway switch which activates the brake.) The compressor is a metal tube under the seat next to the device. It can be mounted anywhere as long as the cable bend is not hindered from movement when acticated. I suggest you check into the "Air Force One" system too to compare. I almost got that one. Both seems good.
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Old 05-10-2012, 06:29 PM   #26
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Appears that most of the Invisibrake problems mentioned above flow from either faulty installation by "professionals" or complications with a specific toad model, rather than Invisibrake itself.

I installed Invisibrake on our 2010 Toyota Corolla with no problems or additional devices needed. I did use extra flex conduit on almost all the wiring and small vacuum tubes anywhere they were under carpet, etc. I note that Toyota used conduit on OEM wiring even though it ran in the trace under the doors. Thought they may know something. The Invisibrake instructions were clear and easy to follow. For a roadtrip, we Just hook up the tow bar, 6-pin power cable, 2 safety cables, breakaway cable, toad ignition to the first click, transmission in neutral, hand brake off, lock toad doors and go.

Re: ReadyBrake mentioned above.

It is simple and inexpensive and a lot of people like it, but KISS comes with tradeoffs. Drawbacks I saw when considering a ReadyBrake:

It's a surge brake system and Winnebago does not recommend using surge-style braking systems when towing.
There's no toad braking until the weight of the towed vehicle overcomes both “an oil filled shock absorber and a 250 lbs spring before it will activate.” I believe that smaller MHs (like our Winnie View) need supplemental toad brakes that come closer to negating any extra load on the MH’s brakes.
ReadyBrake does not recharge the toad's power brake vacuum booster so after a few brake applications, you no longer have power brakes on the toad. You can add a vacuum pump for $220 but it works off the toad's battery.

ReadyBrake’s optional breakaway requires adding a second cable to the toad’s brake pedal.

ReadyBrake’s RV-dash-mounted brake indicator only lights up when the actuator arm on the Ready Brake moves far enough to allow the magnetic switch to light the LED light on the motorhome dash. “In light braking situations, the LED may not illuminate as there may not be any movement of the actuator arm.” Also if the toad’s brake pedal cable should become disconnected, the RV dash indicator light will continue to light even though your toad brakes aren't activating.

I don’t feel that InvisiBrake has these drawbacks, but, of course, you pay more.

It’s great that we have so many choices in braking...and they all work well until they don't.
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Old 05-11-2012, 06:44 PM   #27
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Thanks a lot to you both; worth the price of admission to get all that info. Oh, wait, it's free.
Having owned the 2012 Jeep for just two weeks, have still got a lot of figuring out to do. Quite a few new toys to play with, maybe too much for a Jeep!
Had not discovered that the steering wheel does not lock, which is very important to all the questions I had.
On that basis, can't see why I couldn't replicate the 5 wire plug in from my old Jeep that charged the battery from the coach, in which case I could still use the EvenBrake; it was enough charge previously to replenish the battery while the EB was plugged in. I expect that one or more of the power outlets is live, or could be made live with the key off.
Maybe that's the solution, after all!
What do you guys think? Any problem there, IF it's done right the first time, this time.
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Old 05-12-2012, 08:09 AM   #28
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On the Invisibrake, it also charges the towed.

My system has worked great so far. Only problem was caused by installer not routing the wire properly and it rubbed until it broke the insulation and then corroded. All better now after I fixed that.

Yup, I forgot that, (But actually It was the wire to do the job I was pointing out, Invisibrake uses the lights to do that job)

And I might add that the installer on my US-Gear job cost me a brake job rotors and all.. Idiot. Not a lot differnt than the O/P but a different cause.
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