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Old 02-10-2019, 09:25 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Cougarkid View Post
Sorry for the incorrect terminology. This what I installed. They sell these all over the place.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Hopkins-V...MaAiwvEALw_wcB
Mike,

The intended purpose of the kit you referenced is to prevent the 12v (signal) from the MH to back-feed into the Jeep electronics. As we have been posting, if you have that kit installed and you also have an aux braking kit that moves the Jeep's brake pedal, the flashing turn signal from the MH will be eliminated by the Jeep's own brake lights. The ONLY way to solve this problem is to prevent the Jeep's brake light from working while towing - by either disconnecting the battery, removing the brake light fuse, or installing a switch/relay to accomplish this for you.
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Old 02-10-2019, 12:12 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by nota4re View Post
Mike,

The intended purpose of the kit you referenced is to prevent the 12v (signal) from the MH to back-feed into the Jeep electronics. As we have been posting, if you have that kit installed and you also have an aux braking kit that moves the Jeep's brake pedal, the flashing turn signal from the MH will be eliminated by the Jeep's own brake lights. The ONLY way to solve this problem is to prevent the Jeep's brake light from working while towing - by either disconnecting the battery, removing the brake light fuse, or installing a switch/relay to accomplish this for you.
EXACTLY!!!!!!!

As I stated earlier in this thread, you don't see the problem in ALL stationary lighting checks. It's only when you're moving and the toads brake pedal is applied, that the problem crops up. So, rather than getting into a pretzel to bend over and remove and reinstall a fuse every single time you get ready to tow and, each time you disconnect from towing, the smart move is to install a switch or, if you're good enough with electronics, install a relay to take care of this problem. Then, you're good forever.
Scott
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Old 02-11-2019, 04:02 PM   #17
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Seems to have sidetracked a little to a discussion about brake lights.

Is it really such a big deal? I looked at this years ago and decided to leave as-is.

I have a Readybrute Elite that has the surge brake, the Jeep brake lights activate on their own only when the Jeep is pushing the Motorhome. They activate via the Motorhome wiring when I press the brake pedal.

If I indicate a turn the Jeep indicates as well. I slowdown for the turn and for a short time the jeep brake lights come on as it slows down, then once it's at the same speed as the Motorhome (or stopped), the brakes release and the indicators are visible (remember at this point the brake lights could still be activated by the Motorhome wiring if I'm pressing the pedal).

I really can't see anyone following being confused by this, especially when the Motorhome itself is indicating a few feet in-front of the Jeep.

The secondary reason is that the Motorhome wiring does not activate the center high level brake on the Jeep which is a safety concern.

For the short time the Jeep brakes are activated by themselves don't worry about it.

My 2c.

Steve
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Old 02-11-2019, 05:30 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by stevemoores View Post
....Is it really such a big deal?...... I really can't see anyone following being confused....... For the short time the Jeep brakes are activated by themselves don't worry about it.
My two cents...

1. A following vehicle might not recognize the jeep as something being towed and is not making a proper signal, since it cannot see the tow bar.
2. Please do not tell me what not to worry about.

That is all.
.
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Old 02-11-2019, 11:45 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by stevemoores View Post
Seems to have sidetracked a little to a discussion about brake lights.

Is it really such a big deal? I looked at this years ago and decided to leave as-is.

I have a Readybrute Elite that has the surge brake, the Jeep brake lights activate on their own only when the Jeep is pushing the Motorhome. They activate via the Motorhome wiring when I press the brake pedal.

If I indicate a turn the Jeep indicates as well. I slowdown for the turn and for a short time the jeep brake lights come on as it slows down, then once it's at the same speed as the Motorhome (or stopped), the brakes release and the indicators are visible (remember at this point the brake lights could still be activated by the Motorhome wiring if I'm pressing the pedal).

I really can't see anyone following being confused by this, especially when the Motorhome itself is indicating a few feet in-front of the Jeep.

The secondary reason is that the Motorhome wiring does not activate the center high level brake on the Jeep which is a safety concern.

For the short time the Jeep brakes are activated by themselves don't worry about it.

My 2c.

Steve
Well Steve,
Just because you're not too worried about how your lights perform, doesn't mean the rest of us don't. "Is this really such a big deal"? Well, again, it's all a matter of what YOU feel is important or not. There are all kinds of driving conditions out there, sunny, rainy, stop and go, heavy traffic, sun in the eyes and a whole lot more. I prefer that I give correct signaling and braking intentions to any and all drivers behind me, at all times. And that means when I'm slowing down, and either turning or, even just changing lanes. It's just not that hard to take care of this situation.
Scott
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Old 02-12-2019, 04:24 PM   #20
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Chill, just giving a counter opinion. People on here do seem to get their knickers in a twist sometimes.
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:33 AM   #21
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Steve, I think you present a very valid alternative. Ironically, leaving this behavior as-is is probably the most popular implementation in use for the simple reason that most owners may never be aware of the anomaly. As you point out, most of the braking devices are not over-active and these anomaly conditions are typically short in duration. Each owner can make their own decision.
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:59 AM   #22
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Interesting thread. I have seen motorhomes towing wranglers with the lighting issue noted here. I always figured that they were not aware of it. The motorcoach turn signals and brake lights would be fine in those observations.

A little off track, I have a 2014 Wrangler I want to tow behind a family members coach.....for those who know, how much wear is involved using the jeep's brakes without the power brake system working? Is the braking very strong? I have pressed the pedal when the engine is off, and it takes a bunch of effort to slow it down. Not familiar with the tow systems.

Just curious....not trying to hijack the tread. If you can point me to good documentation, that would be great too.

Thanks.
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Old 02-13-2019, 11:23 AM   #23
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Interesting thread. I have seen motorhomes towing wranglers with the lighting issue noted here. I always figured that they were not aware of it. The motorcoach turn signals and brake lights would be fine in those observations.

A little off track, I have a 2014 Wrangler I want to tow behind a family members coach.....for those who know, how much wear is involved using the jeep's brakes without the power brake system working? Is the braking very strong? I have pressed the pedal when the engine is off, and it takes a bunch of effort to slow it down. Not familiar with the tow systems.

Just curious....not trying to hijack the tread. If you can point me to good documentation, that would be great too.

Thanks.
You just reiterated what I stated above. They just don't know it happen's because, you can't check your lighting, WHEN YOU'RE MOVING. Now, also again, it's just a matter of what's important to each individual. As far as the auxiliary braking mechanism in the toad, and just how it's adjusted, well, there's quite a few of them out there and some, depending on the owners adjustments, won't even touch the brake system unless the coach is in a panic braking situation or at least considerably harder braking than normal. I know folks that have them adjusted like that because, they feel the brakes on the toads they tow will be WORN OUT in a very short order if they adjusted the auxiliary brake unit to be more sensitive. Their choice.

As for just how hard an auxiliary braking unit applies your brakes, well, in short, it's a mechanical device. It doesn't care how much effort is needed just because there's no vacuum to the power brake unit. It's still gonna apply the brakes. The makers of M&G braking system, the ones that many, many folks (including myself) use with diesel coaches and towing a toad, make a unit to implement vacuum so the folks that have doubt, can rest assured their unit IS working appropriately. They (M&G) also know that it really doesn't make any difference without it. They just supply it for the folks that think they need it.

Again, this is all a matter of choice. Whenever I set a toad up, be it mine or anyone who's asked for help, I do it the same exact same way each and every time. I take care of all the lighting so it works CORRECTLY. If that means diodes, well, in goes diodes. I've also installed a micro toggle switch right next to the door jamb in many of the toads. That toggle switch is fed from the brake light output on the toad. When towing, the switch is flipped in one direction which, sends the brake light signal from the toads brake light switch, to the coach dash, where an LED is activated when the toads brake pedal is actuated by whatever kind of auxiliary braking device is used.

But, when driving the toad, the switch is flipped the other direction which, allows for the signal from the toads brake pedal switch, to be sent where it's supposed to go, to the toads brake lights. Works slick.
Scott
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Old 02-13-2019, 11:25 AM   #24
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Put you a towed vehicle sign on the back window!
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Old 02-13-2019, 03:32 PM   #25
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I have the NSA Readybrute Elite with surge brakes and can tell you that they're not on very often. I have the recommended 2" cable slack.

I wouldn't want the braking too strong anyway, do you really want the Jeep braking more than the towing vehicle?

If I press the brakes on the Motorhome, the Jeep runs into the back and brakes as well, but as soon as it's at the same speed, the brakes on the Jeep release. At low speeds they don't come on at all.

I've towed a lot in the BC Rockies and the brakes don't come on downhill (unless I brake of course), even when using Tow-Haul on the Motorhome which increases engine braking.

I don't know how the other systems work (more or less braking), but I like the simplicity of the NSA unit.

The Jeep doesn't count mileage while being towed, but other component will see wear such as Tires, U-Joints, Differentials etc..., so you may have to service them more often than the indicated mileage would suggest.


Quote:
Originally Posted by egwilly View Post
A little off track, I have a 2014 Wrangler I want to tow behind a family members coach.....for those who know, how much wear is involved using the jeep's brakes without the power brake system working? Is the braking very strong? I have pressed the pedal when the engine is off, and it takes a bunch of effort to slow it down. Not familiar with the tow systems
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Old 02-13-2019, 05:13 PM   #26
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I will follow up and say I agree with stevemoores on the amount of braking I get from my surge brake.
I actually hooked up the recommended RV dash light to know when the toad brakes are actually being used. Not very often. Activates for HARD stops, off after stop is completed.

I DID check the jeep brakes vs the RV blinker - Fire Up, nota4re - you are correct, jeep overrides RV.

Mea Culpa.

Now, can we move on?
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Old 02-13-2019, 09:15 PM   #27
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Thanks to all for the education on this tread. Time to break out the manuals.

Sorry if I hijacked it.....but it is related info.
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Old 02-16-2019, 12:51 PM   #28
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Roadmaster Brake-Lite Relay Kit for Towed Vehicles

Think this is what some posters have been referring to when they mention a relay to fix the brake and turn signal issue.

Roadmaster Tow Bar Braking Systems - RM-88400

  • Keeps your towed car's brake signal from overriding the turn signal sent by your RV
  • Allows signal lights on towed car to flash in tandem with RV lights even when vehicle's brake pedal is depressed
etralier has them for 30 bucks, https://www.etrailer.com/Tow-Bar-Bra.../RM-88400.html Seems to be a cheap piece of mind whether you use the Readybrute Elite with the surge braking, which I think is best anyway, or all the other braking methods.
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