Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > MOTORHOME FORUMS > Toads and Motorhome Related Towing
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-05-2019, 09:50 PM   #183
Senior Member
 
Robin_M's Avatar
 
Monaco Owners Club
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SE Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,850
Blog Entries: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpinvidic View Post
Robin,
I am keeping my fingers crossed that what FCA did to the 2019 (maybe 2018) Cherokees to allow them to remove the Flat tow harness requirement from the manual, that they also made the same fix to the GC.
Another post indicated that the steering rack on the 2019 Cherokee had a different part number which suggests a design change.
Dan, That would indeed be nice, but I seriously doubt it. I do think that they will make a design change on the GC models at some point to "quietly" address the problem, but that they are not quite ready to do that yet. When they do, we likely won't hear about it (since they won't publicly admit that the condition exists).

Quote:
Originally Posted by dpinvidic View Post
I am at 1500 miles without a wobble...hope it stays that way
I suspect that just your knowing about the potential for the problem, especially when making tight turns from a stop over uneven pavement, will go a long way toward making it possible to avoid the conditions that allow the wobble to initiate - especially if you do some of the things discussed in my long message above. At least, that's what I am hoping for. I'm concerned about the owners who never hear about the problem, and suddenly find themselves driving a motorhome with a violently shaking rear end, and not knowing what the heck is going on.
__________________
Rob.......Links to coaches below
New (to us) 2016 Tiffin Allegro Bus 45 OP
2017 & 2007 Monaco Diplomat Sites
Robin_M is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 10-06-2019, 04:52 AM   #184
Senior Member
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,309
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_M View Post
Dan, That would indeed be nice, but I seriously doubt it. I do think that they will make a design change on the GC models at some point to "quietly" address the problem, but that they are not quite ready to do that yet. When they do, we likely won't hear about it (since they won't publicly admit that the condition exists).
.................................................. ...
You make a good point here. That could explain why, for the 2019 KL Cherokee, Jeep merely said that the 'flat-tow-kit' was no longer specified as necessary for the '19KL.
__________________
... Rick P.
(Currently searching for early 2000s Monaco).
rpasetto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2019, 08:16 AM   #185
Senior Member
 
VP Chianese's Avatar
 
Thor Owners Club
Newmar Owners Club
Freightliner Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: FL
Posts: 1,286
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpasetto View Post
You make a good point here. That could explain why, for the 2019 KL Cherokee, Jeep merely said that the 'flat-tow-kit' was no longer specified as necessary for the '19KL.
Gents,

I have read the last several pages of posts. I spent my life in the automotive business. My misspent youth as a shade tree mechanic in my fathers service station learning the hard way. Went on to be a factory trained Porsche - Audi Tech, Shop Foreman, Service Director and Porsche - Audi Field Service Representative. So I have seen and heard a few stories as to how things happen and who's at fault. Yes the factories do make mistakes but in real life not as much as the misuse of the cars that the consumers do. Low air pressure, bent rims, unbalanced tires, lack of alignment, overloading the vehicle and the list goes on into infinity. Now have any of these JEEP's that experience the wobble been carrying loads in the rear that would bring the front end up due to weight transfer? Have they had the correct amount of air in the tires? Been Aligned lately? Have the correct tow bar angles? I don't know but I can tell you that human nature won't let owners admit it.

I'm not defending JEEP just pointing out that there's three sides to every story. Side A, side B and the Truth. And that is before any lawyers get involved, then there can be five side or six sides depending on how many lawyers are in the mix.

I have a 2017 Grand Cherokee Limited. It has 35 k+ on the odometer and about 25 k being towed. I have not experienced the wobble. My tow bar is well within the 20* (about 10*) slope allowed. I have a 10,000 pound Blue OX tow bar and a Blue OX base plate. I have Nitrogen in the all of the tires of the JEEP, (Coach as well) which helps maintain the correct pressure through out the country with altitude and temperature variations. I replaced the four tires on the Jeep with 4/32" remaining on the original Michelin's due to some evidence of chunking on the fronts. Tires were rotated by actual mileage not by the odometer mileage. I replaced them with Hankook's which now have about 4 k miles on them of which 3 k are from being towed.

I have not experienced the problem. I know it could happen at anytime and maybe the 2020 I have coming will have the problem but that remains to be seen.

We need to be a bit careful here. Yes we need to make sure that JEEP knows the problem exists for sure but we need to make equally sure that we are not the root of the problem at least sometime. JEEP can fix this very simply as others have. They can affix a sticker to the automobile "This Vehicle May Not Be Towed"and remove the little button that allows the transfer case to be disengaged. Let's look back a few years. Honda, Cadillac, Lincoln and a few other SUV's have solved any problems or liabilities they were having by doing that exact same thing. We are limited to just a few presently. I would hate so see it be one less.

One last example of the things we do as consumers. Two years ago we were in Las Cruses, NM all set up in our site. In comes a Newmar Dutch Star just like mine. As it passes I notice that the wife is driving the Ford F-250 Super Duty four door pick up truck with a damaged front end. A quick look at the motor home revels like damage. So I wait for them to settle in their site and being as we both have Dutch Stars I walk over to inquire about the damage. Well he was quick to tell me that that the so and so Blue Ox tow bar isn't worth a dime. This was the second one in six months that was faulty and both of the damn things had broken in two so he was suing them. To be fair he did have a 10,000# bar and his truck only weighed 7,600#. Oh did I forget to also mention the Honda Gold Wing blinged out with scooter trash at about 1,200#'s in the bed of the truck or that the back seat was jam packed with all sorts of things or that it had a fuel tank across the width of the bed for off road equipment and a small welder. It had to be pushing 10 k for sure if not more. His answer was that he know's for a fact that they under rate everything and it should have been just fine. But the second time in six months should be a clue it wasn't going to be. I just told him how sorry I was to see the MH damaged and it was a good thing no one got hurt. Then walked away shaking my head.
__________________
Vinny, Sandy, JD (10.01.13 - 06.20.20) and our present Portuguese Water Dog "Viking"
2016 Dutch Star 4018 Newmar #605899
VP Chianese is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2019, 10:43 AM   #186
Senior Member
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,309
@VP Chianese, I only speak here as a KL-Cherokee owner who has gone through the KL-tow-wobble issue thoroughly. Many on those forums discussing the KL speculated about the cause being tow bar or coach related and everything in between. In the KL case it is resoundingly not any of those other things...

The KL tow-wobble issue was directly attributed to fact that the EPS system was not operational when the car was being towed. Evidence of this is that FCA/Jeep applied for a patent (2012) on the software which runs in their EPS computer. That software compensates for the inherent wobble of the 2014'-18 KL as it is driven down the road. FCA fix, for the '14-'18 Cherokee, was a kit which turns the EPS on while it is being towed.

The GC wobble problems started the MY they moved from an hydraulic PS to EPS. I do not know how the KL wobble and EPS system relates to the design of Grand Cherokee design nor to the 2019 KL Cherokee. Someone in FCA engineering does know but they have been rather tight-lipped about the whole thing.
__________________
... Rick P.
(Currently searching for early 2000s Monaco).
rpasetto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2019, 06:04 AM   #187
Senior Member
 
DrDaveMA's Avatar
 
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lake Wales, FL
Posts: 3,113
New Plan - Jeep Grand Cherokee EPS Wobble

I can tell you it is not as simple as it may seem. I have towed a 2016 GC Limited 4 down since I purchased it in July of ‘16. Since then I have made multiple cross county trips, this summer we left central Florida went to Vermont, Seattle, San Francisco, LA, Las Vegas, Bryce and Zion, Albuquerque and back to Florida, so we have seen just about every altitude, terrain and road condition possible and since our purchase of the GC not had a single case of the death wobble. From Vermont on the GC was packed more like a utility trailer then a car. I also have a Roadmaster Sterling Tow bar that is properly aligned, a MSI Stay and Play brake system and a Toad Charge Kit. We left Albuquerque and I never disconnected the GC until we were home in Florida. We have 27 k on the odo and probably the same or more towing, I need to replace the tires very soon.

There are 19 pages on this thread alone discussing this issue. IMHO I think there are circumstances that will cause the issue and determining the exact set of parameters is not easy, but once that is done it will be found that A, B, C and maybe D must be present for the right circumstances to cause the wobble and I feel lucky that I have not had them occur for me. I feel that determining the specifics of what circumstances must be present to cause the wobble is a statistical nightmare, but it will have to be done to find out the exact set that will cause the problem, but as have said, I am Just glad I have not had it happen yet.
__________________
Dave, Bobbi and Fenway
2005 38' FDTS Alpine Limited, 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited
Lake Wales, FL
DrDaveMA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2019, 07:54 AM   #188
Senior Member
 
VP Chianese's Avatar
 
Thor Owners Club
Newmar Owners Club
Freightliner Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: FL
Posts: 1,286
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpasetto View Post
@VP Chianese, I only speak here as a KL-Cherokee owner who has gone through the KL-tow-wobble issue thoroughly. Many on those forums discussing the KL speculated about the cause being tow bar or coach related and everything in between. In the KL case it is resoundingly not any of those other things...

The KL tow-wobble issue was directly attributed to fact that the EPS system was not operational when the car was being towed. Evidence of this is that FCA/Jeep applied for a patent (2012) on the software which runs in their EPS computer. That software compensates for the inherent wobble of the 2014'-18 KL as it is driven down the road. FCA fix, for the '14-'18 Cherokee, was a kit which turns the EPS on while it is being towed.

The GC wobble problems started the MY they moved from an hydraulic PS to EPS. I do not know how the KL wobble and EPS system relates to the design of Grand Cherokee design nor to the 2019 KL Cherokee. Someone in FCA engineering does know but they have been rather tight-lipped about the whole thing.
Well for a few more facts. VW's had that same problem back in the 60's. Driving down the road and all of a sudden the steering wheel would start to jump out of your hands. The fix was check the King Pin bushings for wear and replace them if needed plus install a damper that was installed mounted from the body to the main tie rod. This stopped the problem. But other cars have experienced the same problems as well.

Caster in an alignment can cause the same thing if it is not correct. There becomes a point as to where it is good and where it isn't. A damaged belt on a Radial tire can cause this same problem. Ride height can effect this as well. But I'm sure the JEEP engineers know all of this. Sometime in building something as complicated as a car with 30 k or more parts when they change one thing that may seem unrelated a problem pops up. The hard part is getting it to repeat itself on demand so they can see what it is.

I don't think it is a simple as powering up the PS unit. Could be but if it was there would be a firmware update and / or a wire harness in everyone's hands at this point that when installed and hooked up and the Quadra Trac is in freewheel the PS would remain powered up. Now this may cause a need for a charge wire from the coach through a circuit board regulator to the B+ of the car battery. Which is easily done. Every Freightliner and Spartan a B+ wire available on the electrical umbilical cord we now use. I'm also sure JEEP knows this as well if it was that simple it would have been done long ago. Maybe not!

We are down to a few vehicles that can be towed. I'm just hoping we don't loose another. I myself am looking forward to the day one of the electrical car or now truck companies just figure out how to reprogram their cars to be flat towed. Apparently one of the new to the market Electric Trucks, Atlis, is doing just that.

https://www.atlismotorvehicles.com/faq.

I think an electric car or truck that can be flat towed is ideal for us. Most of the time when we are at a camp grounds we seldom go anywhere more than 100 miles. If we are going more than say 350 miles which is the range of most electrics we move the MH.
__________________
Vinny, Sandy, JD (10.01.13 - 06.20.20) and our present Portuguese Water Dog "Viking"
2016 Dutch Star 4018 Newmar #605899
VP Chianese is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2019, 09:04 AM   #189
Senior Member
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,309
Quote:
Originally Posted by VP Chianese View Post
... I don't think it is a simple as powering up the PS unit. Could be but if it was there would be a firmware update and / or a wire harness in everyone's hands at this point that when installed and hooked up and the Quadra Trac is in freewheel the PS would remain powered up..................
I do not disagree with your statements about other causes of wobble in other vehicles. I've heard about wobble issues for many years in VW's, Subarus etc.... Long before EPS.

It was exactly Powering up the EPS unit for the KL Cherokee, as I posted earlier. That is necessary to have the "wobble mitigation algorithm" running in the EPS software. FCA knew about this problem as early as 2012, when they applied for a software patent; they probably knew earlier ataking into account the time to have developed that software. They knew the issue in that specific design and they knew that without that software running in the KL's EPS. it was subject to wobble tendency.... at all times when going down the road.

I do not know if powering up the EPS in the GC would solve that wobble issue, nor do I know if the yet-unknown change they made to the MY 2019 KL Cherokee could be applied toi the GC. Back with the 2014 KL, there were many owners reporting tens of thousands of towing miles without a wobble event. Many KL owners thought it was only happening to the other guy because of towbar, motorhome, loose connecting pins, driver error or whatever. Maybe even some now.

To reiterate what I said, I do not know if there's any relationship between the KL Cherokee designs and design of the GC. They are very different vehicles. It is just mighty curious that wobble events were reported with EPS equipped GC but not with the almost-identical predecessors which were equipped with hydraulic PS, regardless of towbar, MH, etc.

Hope you all stay safe!
__________________
... Rick P.
(Currently searching for early 2000s Monaco).
rpasetto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2019, 08:59 AM   #190
Senior Member
 
VP Chianese's Avatar
 
Thor Owners Club
Newmar Owners Club
Freightliner Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: FL
Posts: 1,286
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpasetto View Post
It was exactly Powering up the EPS unit for the KL Cherokee, as I posted earlier. That is necessary to have the "wobble mitigation algorithm" running in the EPS software. FCA knew about this problem as early as 2012, when they applied for a software patent; they probably knew earlier ataking into account the time to have developed that software. They knew the issue in that specific design and they knew that without that software running in the KL's EPS. it was subject to wobble tendency.... at all times when going down the road.

I do not know if powering up the EPS in the GC would solve that wobble issue, nor do I know if the yet-unknown change they made to the MY 2019 KL Cherokee could be applied toi the GC. Back with the 2014 KL, there were many owners reporting tens of thousands of towing miles without a wobble event. Many KL owners thought it was only happening to the other guy because of towbar, motorhome, loose connecting pins, driver error or whatever. Maybe even some now.

To reiterate what I said, I do not know if there's any relationship between the KL Cherokee designs and design of the GC. They are very different vehicles. It is just mighty curious that wobble events were reported with EPS equipped GC but not with the almost-identical predecessors which were equipped with hydraulic PS, regardless of towbar, MH, etc.

Hope you all stay safe!
So I'm confused here a bit. The "wobble" started after the EPS unit was applied to the KL's correct? Also it never "wobbles" other wise after the EPS was installed? In other words if you drive KL all over hell with the EPS it never has had any reports of "wobble" similar to the VW or other cars previously. Makes one wonder how it doesn't "wobble" when being driven but does when it is being towed. What is changing in the dynamic's to cause the problem. Certainly all of the parts are the same yet why would they behave differently between driving and towing? With tight right turns being the cause. One thing that just popped into my pea brain here is that, on a front wheel drive car the toe in is set different that on a rear will drive car. Front wheel drive cars dig in causing the wheels to toe in even more where rear wheel drive cars lift the front and increase the toe out. So maybe we are back to critical toe in or alignment problems.

Also are the amount of GC incidents way less than the reported other KL's yet they are all KL's, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, Grand Cherokee Limited, Overland etc. All the same units built on the Fiat Compact/Compact U.S. Wide platform, co-developed by Chrysler and Fiat. Which is the same platform that the Alfa Romeo Giulietta has as well as the Alfa Stelvio SUV. So it seems strange that the "wobble" would be prominent on some, as in KL's but not others.

To be clear, I'm not saying it doesn't happen and I understand why FCA doesn't want to jump up and admit it and keep it out of the lime light so to speak. No manufacturer is going to freely admit to any problem period, ever. Remember the Pinto and Ford denying it all the way through the law suit. They made a movie about it. It's the way business operates.

I don't think we are going to solve it here by any means but it is interesting to ponder. We do not have all of the facts and to some extent neither does FCA.

I still worry that they, FCA will pull the plug on towing. Especially if it doesn't happen at any other time other than towing. Would love to have seen the Alfa Romeo Stelvio come with a disconnect to free wheel. Great car to tow but have fun driving as well. I have a Daytona Hall of Fame driver that I know that has one and he says it is as much a sports car as an Suv.
__________________
Vinny, Sandy, JD (10.01.13 - 06.20.20) and our present Portuguese Water Dog "Viking"
2016 Dutch Star 4018 Newmar #605899
VP Chianese is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2019, 10:42 AM   #191
Senior Member
 
CWSWine's Avatar
 
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Manhattan (Little Apple) Kansas
Posts: 2,491
Go to the KL manual and requires you to have a towing harness installed prior to towing (not for the lights). To. me, that Fiat admitting there is a problem that a harness HAS TO BE installed to two a KL according to the tow instruction in the owners manual. What the harness does is keeps the EPS on and active when the key is off. To check and see if it is active you turn off the key and check the steer and insure the electric steer is active with the key off.


I have heard people paying Fiat up to 1,000 to the harness and the install.


GC do not have a harness and Fiat will not admit they have a problem. The KL harness will not fit the GC.
__________________
2020 Newmar Baystar 3005 Gas V10 - 2020 Jeep Rubicon
1280 Watts Solar - Victron MultiPlus-II 12/3000/120-50 120V Inverter
300 Amp Lithium Battery
CWSWine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2019, 01:08 PM   #192
Senior Member
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,309
Quote:
Originally Posted by VP Chianese View Post
So I'm confused here a bit. The "wobble" started after the EPS unit was applied to the KL's correct? Also it never "wobbles" other wise after the EPS was installed? In other words if you drive KL all over hell with the EPS it never has had any reports of "wobble" similar to the VW or other cars previously. Makes one wonder how it doesn't "wobble" when being driven but does when it is being towed. What is changing in the dynamic's to cause the problem. Certainly all of the parts are the same yet why would they behave differently between driving and towing? With tight right turns being the cause. One thing that just popped into my pea brain here is that, on a front wheel drive car the toe in is set different that on a rear will drive car. Front wheel drive cars dig in causing the wheels to toe in even more where rear wheel drive cars lift the front and increase the toe out. So maybe we are back to critical toe in or alignment problems.
.................

I thought I was clear before, maybe not. The EPS (electronic power steering) computer in the 2014-18 KL Cherokee has software in it which acts to prevent wobble, any time the engine is running. The KL Cherokee was a new model for 2014. While driving, the algorithm in the KL's EPS software is always acting to stop the vibration. How it does this is thoroughly explained in the patent I mentioned, which is discussed in many threads about the KL wobble, here and in KL Cherokee forums. (All FCA vehicles on the same platform, using this same EPS would be subject to the same conditions, however only the KL Cherokee is advertised as "flat towable", as far as I know.)

The "Tow enhancement kit" for the KL turns the EPS on while it is being towed with engine off so the anti-wobble software is in control.




Quote:

.....
Also are the amount of GC incidents way less than the reported other KL's yet they are all KL's, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, Grand Cherokee Limited, Overland etc. All the same units built on the Fiat Compact/Compact U.S. Wide platform, co-developed by Chrysler and Fiat. Which is the same platform that the Alfa Romeo Giulietta has as well as the Alfa Stelvio SUV. So it seems strange that the "wobble" would be prominent on some, as in KL's but not others.

To be clear, I'm not saying it doesn't happen and I understand why FCA doesn't want to jump up and admit it and keep it out of the lime light so to speak. No manufacturer is going to freely admit to any problem period, ever. Remember the Pinto and Ford denying it all the way through the law suit. They made a movie about it. It's the way business operates.

I don't think we are going to solve it here by any means but it is interesting to ponder. We do not have all of the facts and to some extent neither does FCA.

I still worry that they, FCA will pull the plug on towing. Especially if it doesn't happen at any other time other than towing. Would love to have seen the Alfa Romeo Stelvio come with a disconnect to free wheel. Great car to tow but have fun driving as well. I have a Daytona Hall of Fame driver that I know that has one and he says it is as much a sports car as an Suv.
I cannot explain why the GC incidents are fewer than those of the KL. The GC and KL are vastly different designs. (I do not know if the Alfa Romeo Giulietta or Alfa Stelvio SUV are approved for towing.) The KL's steering geometry evidently has a tendency for sympathetic vibrations at frequencies associated with the vibration it receives when hitting ruts or bumps. Sympathetic vibration can be a strange thing, if you google "Seattle Tacoma Narrows Bridge Disaster" you'll see an example.

As to FCA not 'jumping up to admit' problems. I think they saw the result of what they implicitly admitted when they released the "tow enhancement kit" for the '14-'18 KL's. This kit consists of some wire, connectors, a switch, relay and fuse holder, might have set them back all of ten bucks or so in parts.... but maybe they felt that they gained more negative publicity in admitting a problem than they did the positive publicity of being willing to fix a known problem. We know of all too many other cases where those responsible just pretend that a problem doesn't exist.

I feel it's better to be forewarned of something which may go wrong and hold the hope that it doesn't. Most of us motorhome owners are used to dealing with unforeseen problems.
__________________
... Rick P.
(Currently searching for early 2000s Monaco).
rpasetto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2019, 09:51 AM   #193
Senior Member
 
VP Chianese's Avatar
 
Thor Owners Club
Newmar Owners Club
Freightliner Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: FL
Posts: 1,286
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpasetto View Post
The "Tow enhancement kit" for the KL turns the EPS on while it is being towed with engine off so the anti-wobble software is in control.

So does the wire kit keeping the EPS unit on solve the problem totally?

I cannot explain why the GC incidents are fewer than those of the KL. The GC and KL are vastly different designs. (I do not know if the Alfa Romeo Giulietta or Alfa Stelvio SUV are approved for towing.) The KL's steering geometry evidently has a tendency for sympathetic vibrations at frequencies associated with the vibration it receives when hitting ruts or bumps. Sympathetic vibration can be a strange thing, if you google "Seattle Tacoma Narrows Bridge Disaster" you'll see an example.

I somewhat understand harmonic vibrations and their consequences but the GC until 2017 needed the wire harness, in fact I had the dealer order one for my car then was told after it came that it was already on the 2017 GC Limited so that may be the answer as to why there are less problems being reported. Are the problems that are being reported older than 2017 units? I thought I made it clear that the Alfa's are not towable. If they were I would have one.

As to FCA not 'jumping up to admit' problems. I think they saw the result of what they implicitly admitted when they released the "tow enhancement kit" for the '14-'18 KL's. This kit consists of some wire, connectors, a switch, relay and fuse holder, might have set them back all of ten bucks or so in parts.... but maybe they felt that they gained more negative publicity in admitting a problem than they did the positive publicity of being willing to fix a known problem. We know of all too many other cases where those responsible just pretend that a problem doesn't exist.

I think any lawyer will advise anyone to not ever admit that they know something was wrong with a product. Just watch the TV ads about on of the drugs you may need to survive until next week. The Disclaimers are worse than the symptom they are going to cure. But the FDA requires them to reveal any problems that were encountered in the trials no matter how minute it was.
So are we hearing about older units that either do not have the harness installed or are we hearing about older units that have the harness and it doesn't work. If it is the former then they need to do the harness if the latter then FCA still has a problem to correct. Also are there newer than 2017 GC that have had the problem and is it ever other than after a right turn with a sharp angle.
__________________
Vinny, Sandy, JD (10.01.13 - 06.20.20) and our present Portuguese Water Dog "Viking"
2016 Dutch Star 4018 Newmar #605899
VP Chianese is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2019, 10:37 AM   #194
Senior Member
 
lass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Tarpon Springs, Fl.
Posts: 1,540
New Plan - Jeep Grand Cherokee EPS Wobble

...the first reported case of the Grand Cherokee wobble was in Oct. 2016. The details were sent to the National Highway Safety, and not reported on the forums.

...the wobble has been reported on 2016, 2017, & 2018 models. ( the EPS was incorporated starting in 2016)

...it has happened on the Limited, Trailhawk, Overland, and up to the Summit model.

...a majority of the wobble reports were traveling at low speed making a left hand turn.

...there are 2 cases where the wobble occurred at approximately 25 mph.

...some members have reported the wobble within the first 1000 miles of towing.

...Some have reported that it did not occur until about 15K miles. And it would repeat after that.

...members have never had the problem and we wish them continued luck.

...one member, driving a 55K lb. Essex stated that the wobble was so violent, he could feel the shaking in the drivers seat.

I will not get into the geometry of the towing equipment but will say that at one point FCA was working on 2 possible solutions. They determined that the wobble was a rare occurrence and did not warrant further action.

Let’s acknowledge that we have some very knowledgeable members who know the equipment and towing details and that the have eliminated these parts from the equation.

Let’s also acknowledge that the wobble has happened on the Grand Cherokee and that FCA has a problem.
__________________
2013 Newmar Ventana 3434 (sold)
2018 Wrangler JLU Rubicon (sold)
lass is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2019, 10:39 AM   #195
Senior Member
 
American Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 344
New Plan - Jeep Grand Cherokee EPS Wobble

Quote:
Originally Posted by lass View Post
...the first reported case of the Grand Cherokee wobble was in Oct. 2016. The details were sent to the National Highway Safety, and not reported on the forums.

...the wobble has been reported on 2016, 2017, & 2018 models. ( the EPS was incorporated starting in 2016)

...it has happened on the Limited, Trailhawk, Overland, and up to the Summit model.

...a majority of the wobble reports were traveling at low speed making a left hand turn.

...there are 2 cases where the wobble occurred at approximately 25 mph.

...some members have reported the wobble within the first 1000 miles of towing.

...Some have reported that it did not occur until about 15K miles. And it would repeat after that.

...members have never had the problem and we wish them continued luck.

...one member, driving a 55K lb. Essex stated that the wobble was so violent, he could feel the shaking in the drivers seat.

I will not get into the geometry of the towing equipment by will say that at one point FCA was working on 2 possible solutions. They determined that the wobble was a rare occurrence and did not warrant further action.

Let’s acknowledge that we have some very knowledgeable members who know the equipment and towing details and that the have eliminated these parts from the equation.

Let’s also acknowledge that the wobble has happened on the Grand Cherokee and that FCA has a problem.


Yep. X2
My first time was in Oct of 16 and happened in the first 20 miles of being towed. And varied the next year and a half.
Glad it’s behind me.
mhudson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2019, 11:13 AM   #196
Senior Member
 
CWSWine's Avatar
 
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Manhattan (Little Apple) Kansas
Posts: 2,491
Quote:
Originally Posted by mhudson View Post
Yep. X2
My first time was in Oct of 16 and happened in the first 20 miles of being towed. And varied the next year and a half.
Glad it’s behind me.

I have had three times and twice was in the same day in about 15k miles. The first two times I thought it was flat tire and pulled over and couldn't find anything wrong. The third time we switched toads. Twice was left turns an one was right turn all under 10 mph.
__________________
2020 Newmar Baystar 3005 Gas V10 - 2020 Jeep Rubicon
1280 Watts Solar - Victron MultiPlus-II 12/3000/120-50 120V Inverter
300 Amp Lithium Battery
CWSWine is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Jeep GRAND Cherokee death wobble! Crabby Mike Toads and Motorhome Related Towing 599 03-25-2024 10:10 PM
Wheel wobble on 2016 Grand Cherokee esaulten Toads and Motorhome Related Towing 12 10-01-2017 02:22 PM
Just intalled Mopar EPS switch on 2015 Cherokee Guernsey Toads and Motorhome Related Towing 19 12-02-2016 01:01 PM
Toad Charge Wiring Cherokee Trailhawk w/EPS JJPP17 Toads and Motorhome Related Towing 8 04-11-2016 12:29 PM
Wobble Wobble in our new Open Range! Cari Z Travel Trailer Discussion 8 08-13-2013 11:03 AM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.