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Old 06-04-2007, 12:14 PM   #1
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I find out that towing a Saturn Outlook 4 down results in a dead battery unless you disconnect the negative battery cable not simply pulling a fuse like the advertisement says!
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Old 06-04-2007, 12:14 PM   #2
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I find out that towing a Saturn Outlook 4 down results in a dead battery unless you disconnect the negative battery cable not simply pulling a fuse like the advertisement says!
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Old 06-09-2007, 02:11 PM   #3
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Same as my Acadia. I'm trying to get somebody at GMC to respond to this but no contact yet. They say take it to a dealer and dealer says GMC advises to disconnect the battery. That is a bummer - the battery is under the floorboards behind the passenger seat!

On my Acadia, it appears that pulling the 50A BAT #1 fuse shuts down the dashboard functions and might be as good as disconnecting the negative terminal. Either way, I will have to reset the clock and radio favorites each time.

I have discussed this further in This Thread
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Old 06-09-2007, 04:05 PM   #4
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I just had the Toad stop ond Blue Ox baseplate installed at Towing World in Wildwood, FL. The tech showed me how to turn on the ignition, put the car in neutral and get the key out without pulling any fuses or anything else.
He also made a lot sense when he said if I ran the car for 15 minutes before starting and again at each gas stop I wouldn't use enough battery to matter.
On the way home from his shop I failed to shut off the "Auto" headlights and they were on all of the way home. The odometer did not rack up miles.
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Old 06-10-2007, 08:25 PM   #5
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Porchdog,
What do the recreational (dinghy) towing instructions in your owner manual say to do? I'd appreciate hearing Saturn says to do, even if you are satisfied with what the tech told you (but remember - its Saturn who decides on warranty coverage - not the Towing World tech).

I'm also curious how you get the key out - are you towing in the Accessory position? My Auto lights don't come on in Accessory like they do in the On position. What's the trick?

I had a key made without the chip, so I can turn the ignition to On or Accessory but it can't be started.
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Old 06-11-2007, 07:31 PM   #6
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Gary,

I read the towing instructions on a friend's new Outlook (Saturn) and it was the same as already mentioned... "pull the fuse".

I was hoping my "toad charge" would prevent discharge, but from what you have mentioned it was of no help. I am getting ready for a new tow vehicle, but I would like to have this resolved before making the jump to an Enclave or Outlook.
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Old 06-11-2007, 08:40 PM   #7
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I have just heard from another Acadia owner that there is a 2A fuse in the box under the dash that will disable the dash lights. It must do more than that, cause it apparently also disables the 12v outlet - the guy's Brake Buddy had no power after pulling that fuse. Can't be simply the fuse, though, since the outlet has to be fused for more than 2A - and the dash lights probably pull at least that much too.
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Old 06-14-2007, 09:05 AM   #8
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I too am having problems with the Saturn Outlook. I just got back last night from having the base plate and a Roadmaster Even Brake system installed. There is a "bulletin" out from Saturn stating to disregard the cars manual about the fuse and to remove the negative lead off the battery. Which is no quick fix due to the positioning of the battery beneath the floorboard. The rv tech found out about the bulletin after he had installed the brake control system. Now there is no way to power the system if the negative lead is disconnected. He re wired a hot line to the panel next to the "e" brake that I could plug the cigarette lighter plug to an energy source after the "car" negative was disconnected.

I towed the vehicle back from Albany, NY to southern NJ with ZERO problems it towed awesome. However, this morning I got in the car to go to work and the Traction control, Stabilatrak and the cruise control are not operating properly. I immediately called the parties involved (i.e.: RV dealer, Saturn) and brought the car into the car dealership service. They said they could not diagnose the problem without "removing the aftermarket equipment".

The RV dealership is willing to pay to have saturn remove, diagnose, fix and reinstall the brake system.

Saturn will gladly remove, diagnose and fix the problem but will not reinstall it even if they're being paid for it. This to me is where i'm having problems. Obviously when the system was installed, something is either giving feedback to the computer or drawing energy from the comp. The Rv place is willing to "PAY" for the services. I would hope that the Saturn dealership, who would be the resident area experts, would be willing to install this "safety device" beings the car was labeled and advertised as a "dinghy" towable vehicle. And that Brake systems are required in some states. I have already been on the phone with Saturn corperate and they have told me to talk to the local Saturn dealership and "try" to get them to install it and if that doesn't work, they gave me the # to 2 other saturn dealerships in the area!!

Guess I'll have them remove everything fix the problem and start over from scratch. I do have to say, the Blue Ox base plate looks great and the car tows like it's not even there. I had to keep looking at the monitor to make sure it was still back there. I never felt it move the rv once. I'm trying to look at the bright side of things I guess!! Anythoughts or suggestions would be great.
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Old 06-14-2007, 10:18 AM   #9
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Are you aware of the Magnuson Act, which prohibits manufacturers from categorically denying warranty coverage because of the presence of aftermarket equipment. They have to have reasonable grounds to suspect the aftermarket equipment actually caused a problem. In your case, the RV dealer installed wiring is reasonably suspect, but [in my opinion] there is no reason to remove any other aftermarket equipment.

It's no big deal to wire an additional 12V outlet direct to the battery (with a fuse, of course) so that you have power for your brake unit. That's a far better solution than trying to tap some other source on the vehicle - modern cars with multiplex wiring harnesses are too complex to try to jury rig something like that.

Did you actually disconnect the negative battery terminal when you towed? It seems like that ought to shut down the Stabiltrack and cruise completely? GMC warns that the traction control can get messed up if the car is towed with back wheels only on the ground, but I wonder if they are wrong about that too? We have seen traction control error warnings after towing (immediately upon start up), but they clear instantly and do not reappear.

I just heard from another source that Saturn has agreed to put a negative terminal disconnect on somebody's Outlook so that it will be towable as advertised. If I can get confirmation of that, I'll post the info here.

Follow-up: Here's a link to a message that mentions the Saturn provided battery disconnect on an Outlook
Saturn provides battery disconnect
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Old 06-14-2007, 11:25 AM   #10
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Hi,
Now towing a new saturn Aura. Looks like the same problems on it. need to remove 2 fuses the 2 amp one in the passenger side cabin fuse box and number 43 in the engine fuse box. What a pain!!! Anyway going to look at the product called Toad-Charge available from RV Upgrades In talking to the Saturn dealer may only need to pull the 2-amp fuse in the interior fuse box without having to pull the main fuse in the engine fuse box doing it this way. Will let youknow when I get it done.
Don Barber
PS 65.95 cost at RV Upgrades plus a couple of hours to install
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Old 06-14-2007, 11:33 AM   #11
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Thanks Gary for your input. I did see the disconnect install on another forum and immediatly called saturn and filled a case/complaint on the same grounds as his. I will be taking it up with the dealer when I bring the car in on Monday to have the wiring removed. There were other wires that were originally installed before the knowledge of the new bulletin about the Neg disconnect. I belive they were for brake light inputs or something - I didn't do the install and not familiar with the wires. They were cut after getting feed back from something and I hope they weren't wires that needed to be there for the Trac sys. I'm not mad at the RV tech, he tried to get ahold of Saturn for two days and finally had to install without bulletin info for my timing issues. They did everything they could to get me on my way. Hopefully with the help of other Outlook, Acadia and Enclave owners that are having problems contacting they're specific manufacturers, we can get this resolved soon. Since this is the first year of these vehicles, I kind of expected some issues but not this soon!! lol
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Old 06-14-2007, 01:52 PM   #12
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I already have the Toad Charge installed - it is insufficient to maintain the battery charge in my Acadia. Goes dead just as quickly, so the amp load must be substantial.

I just got off the phone with a GMC rep - she basically says "tough luck". She contacted the GMC dealer I'm working with here in Washington and the dealer said they could not modify the car to "make the battery more accessible". They recommended a non-GMC shop that could probably do something, but the GMC rep said GMC would NOT pay for it. In other words, I'm on my own. I reiterated that was unacceptable and she said "Sorry - that's GM's final answer." and the call ended on an unpleasant note. I of course will be escalating the case to GMC senior management.
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Old 06-14-2007, 06:08 PM   #13
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Now towing a new saturn Aura. Looks like the same problems on it. need to remove 2 fuses the 2 amp one in the passenger side cabin fuse box and number 43 in the engine fuse box. What a pain!!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd be happy enough if that worked, though the passenger cabin box is a real PITA to get to in my Acadia. Problem is, the fuse procedure (described in the owner manual) doesn't work! Battery still goes dead!
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Old 06-14-2007, 06:35 PM   #14
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Chris: I just got an Outlook and had the BlueOx baseplate installed with a Toad Stop. Beautiful job and they work fine. Consider this: If you pull for 4 hours and run the engine for 5 minutes like the book says you should charge the battery and then start over. If your brake system uses the Outlook battery for power, run a separate line to the motorhome through your light cable. Very simple...
By the way..are you related to H.Ray Vleit the Fire Chief?
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