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Old 06-16-2016, 10:31 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by fudgeanyone View Post
Thanks for the quick replies. I went to the Jeep Garage Website and can't find the TSB dated 4/26/2016. The last TSB if find is dated 3/29/2016 and is TSB 08-29-16a. It eliminates the VIN search but still says "**This bulletin applies to vehicles equipped with 4x4 (Sales Code 5I4) and with Jeep Active Drive II (Sales Code DK4)". The vehicle I am looking at says that it has a 4x4 (Sales Code 5I4S) and Jeep Active Drive II (Sales Code Dk4). The dealer says that since the 4x4 Sales Code is 5I4S that the wiring kit is not needed. Is there a difference between the 5I4 and 5I4S that allows it to be towed without the wiring harness?

Thanks again for the help.

Wally
FCA has made this way more complicated than it needs to be. First of all the TSB no. 08-029-16A is the correct one, however while the Jeep Garage shows a 3/17/16 release date the actual document (see attached) is dated 4/26/16.

IMHO the sales code 5I4 or 5I4S on the Trailhawk is a moot point for the following reasons:

1. If you download the latest User Guide and/or the Owner Manual, they both state you must use the Mopar wiring kit. There is no mention of any sales code difference.

2. As previously stated we have a poster in this thread that owns a 2015 Trailhawk that experienced the problem at approximately 50 mph.

3. There are Trailhawk owners on other RV and Cherokee forums that have also experienced the problem.

4. The FCA customer service dept doesn't, or didn't, have any information on this problem when I spoke to the, so I wouldn't expect a dealer to be very knowledgable either.

5. Some dealers are covering the installation under warranty with no problem at all. Others, like mine, have refused, and in those cases it is neccessary to contat JeepCares to have it take care of at no charge.

The bottom line from everything I have read is the wiring kit is required on all Cherokees built prior to 2/16/16 regardless of differing sales codes. I don't have any knowdledge of what might be different on Cherokees built after 2/16/16 as it is of no concern to me.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf KL_08_029_16a.pdf (32.5 KB, 22 views)
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Old 06-16-2016, 11:00 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by fudgeanyone View Post
Thanks for the quick replies. I went to the Jeep Garage Website and can't find the TSB dated 4/26/2016. The last TSB if find is dated 3/29/2016 and is TSB 08-29-16a. It eliminates the VIN search but still says "**This bulletin applies to vehicles equipped with 4x4 (Sales Code 5I4) and with Jeep Active Drive II (Sales Code DK4)". The vehicle I am looking at says that it has a 4x4 (Sales Code 5I4S) and Jeep Active Drive II (Sales Code Dk4). The dealer says that since the 4x4 Sales Code is 5I4S that the wiring kit is not needed. Is there a difference between the 5I4 and 5I4S that allows it to be towed without the wiring harness?

Thanks again for the help.

Wally
The TH AD "lock" just adds a locking diff to AD "II" system. The reason for the kit only applying to the 2-speed 4WD systems is that only the 2-speed 4WDs are towable behind a MH (because they have a neutral position).

In fact all KL Cherokees have a wobble inherent in the design of the front end suspension/steering. Around 2010-2011 while the KL was being designed FCA-Jeep got a patent on an electronic (software controlled) wobble mitigation system (this has been documented in another forum). While you're driving down the road, engine running, this system is active. However, when being towed behind the MH (with engine off) some pretty severe wobble events occurred. (Much to FCA's dismay because they'd advertised the car as the "ideal towed vehicle".)

As a result the FCA-Jeep "fix" was the harness with fuse and switch which activates the anti wobble system for towing with engine off. By the way this will put some drain on your battery so expect to install a charge line from the MH too.
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Old 06-16-2016, 06:57 PM   #115
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Cherokee Flat Towing

Thanks for the comments. I reached Kori at Jeep Care and she said the vehicle in question is on the "S13" list and will need the wiring harness. She also had not heard of the "5I4S" sales code.

Wally Creel
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Old 06-17-2016, 05:29 AM   #116
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As a temporary "fix" can I tow my TrailHawk with the engine running? Seems that will activate the steering dampening and prevent the wobble, right?

Thanks,

/ken
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Old 06-17-2016, 06:43 AM   #117
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As a temporary "fix" can I tow my TrailHawk with the engine running? Seems that will activate the steering dampening and prevent the wobble, right?

Thanks,

/ken
Ken, given the low probably of the wobble happening (again), it would seem to me that running the engine would be a pretty extreme band aid if indeed it can be done. Not that I anything comes to mind as why it couldn't, but one thing to think about is that your jeep is 5' from the back of your rig, which means it would get very little if any airflow to the Jeep radiator, and with a diesel (particularly if you have a rear radiator) whatever air would flow to the jeep would be very hot.

I'm still walking on the razor's edge since I have not done the harness and we are headed out shortly for our big summer trip. And if it happens, I'll make the decision along the way about getting it installed. I have also discussed the wobble with my wife who drives about 1/3 of the time, so that it would not totally take her by surprise if it happens with either one of us driving.

This whole thing drives me nuts too, but we still really like our Trailhawk. This is just an example of complicating things for the sake of "advanced technology". If you think about it, why would a jeep, made to go off road, get either electric steering or an electric parking brake?

One other thought, given the rare instances of the wobble happening, and that no one has yet to been able to repeat it "at will" as far as I know, and that the "fix" is recent, no one knows at this point if the "fix" really fixes anything in the real world. And would running the engine keep it from happening either?

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Old 06-18-2016, 05:23 AM   #118
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One other thought, given ... that the "fix" is recent, no one knows at this point if the "fix" really fixes anything in the real world...
My question about this whole thing, as well.

Thanks!

\ken
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Old 06-18-2016, 07:38 AM   #119
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As the owner of a 2014 Trailhawk, I read most forums about jeeps. Apparently, the problem is the electric power steering. When towing, it is not powered causing a wobble. Some jeep owners have found that jeep makes a wiring kit to power the power steering unit while towing and has solved the problem. You might look into this for your model jeep.
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Old 06-18-2016, 07:58 AM   #120
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What I don't understand!

I had the wobble for the first time on our last trip (500 mile round trip).
I happened on a very bumpy curved transition road between freeways.

As soon as I looked into the monitor it looked like someone was turning the steering wheel left & right. I could see each fender of the jeep dip slightly when changing direction.

WHAT I DON'T UNDERSTAND: I slowed from about 55mph down to zero.
even at about 10mph it still did the side-to-side wobble. I had to completely stop. so... I can understand a resonance point where a severe shaking can start. but I expect that when variables change, like speed, the shaking will stop. When I normally go around a corner at 15mph, I know the front wheels of the jeep turn to track the motor home. So why doesn't the wobble start when making a turn?

Confused....

Dan
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Old 06-18-2016, 09:08 AM   #121
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I believe there are multiple factors in play here, including the suspension, steering mechanisms as well as the specific design of the electric power steering. Wobble has been an issue with many vehicles, including some 4WD jeeps and trucks, maybe it's the higher un-sprung weight than in RWD versions, maybe in the geometry of the front end required by a system that drives the front wheels. Evidence of this issue abounds in the advertising of every aftermarket manufacturer of steering damper/stabilizers for CJ's Wranglers, 4wd pickups, etc.

For the KL Cherokee, even some of the non-towable AD1 equipped models have had wobble issues when driving down the road. These may or may not be related.

Wobble-while-being-towed has become a particularly dangerous potential with the Cherokees which are certified for towing, namely those 4WD models with 2-speed/neutral. This includes the AD2 Latitudes and Limiteds and all the Trailhawks. (as you know all TH's come with the 2speed 4wd).

It should be no surprise to FCA/Jeep engineering that a tendency to wobble can be an issue with their electric-servo-controlled power steering systems, since there's no fluid in these designs which might tend to dampen the vibrations... and, also because FCA applied for and received a patent for a software-electronic control system to mitigate wobble back in 2010-2011. This system uses electric power, while engine is on, to stop wobble tendencies while running down the road. It is described quite thoroughly on a thread in another forum.

The "wobble fix kit" now available from FCA/Jeep is intended to eliminate the tendency to wobble while the vehicle is being towed by activating the above system.

Why they did not realize this would be in issue back before the first 2014 KL's were being coming off the line... why they advertised the KL Cherokee as the "ideal towed vehicle" knowing of the above feature... why the models produced after a certain date around Feb. of early 2016 do not need the kit... why have some towed their Cherokees thousands of miles without experiencing the dreaded wobble, end then it happens... and why doesthe KL wobble sometimes, yet does not at other times when we might expect it. All one can do is piece together bits of information from members on this and other forums and to hope a wobble-event does not occur. These are all mysteries. FCA is playing this card very close to the vest.
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Old 06-20-2016, 04:35 AM   #122
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I have towed my TH across the country and back and have yet to experience this Wobble. The only problems I have had with my TH that on the last leg of the trip to the East Coast the battery died and the dash would not come on after the jump. Found out that a connector came loose behind the dash and that is what caused the issue. But to be safe I installed a battery trickle charger. Good thing I did now that I had to get the Flat Tow Wiring Harness installed. (what a piece of garbage, you have to install a fuse under the hood every time you use it) (How and the heck am I going to keep track of the darn fuse when not using it) (Why didn't they just install 2 switches; Maybe I should do it myself)
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Old 06-21-2016, 07:10 AM   #123
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I have towed my TH across the country and back and have yet to experience this Wobble. The only problems I have had with my TH that on the last leg of the trip to the East Coast the battery died and the dash would not come on after the jump. Found out that a connector came loose behind the dash and that is what caused the issue. But to be safe I installed a battery trickle charger. Good thing I did now that I had to get the Flat Tow Wiring Harness installed. (what a piece of garbage, you have to install a fuse under the hood every time you use it) (How and the heck am I going to keep track of the darn fuse when not using it) (Why didn't they just install 2 switches; Maybe I should do it myself)
I agree, and I plan to post a solution to this. I think I understand the connections they are making from looking at the tow kit install diagrams.

Jeep is actually ordering a tow kit harness for me so I can confirm my assumptions.

I will replace the console switch with a relay. There is also a relay under the hood, activated when you install the fuse. I am going to use the 12V charge line to activate both relays (I have a blocking diode to prevent the TOAD from activating the relays). This way the everything is automatic.

An added bonus is that on Freightliners, the 12V charge line is ignition controlled. So stopping overnight turns off the system. No Switches and no fuses to worry about.

I will post instructions after I complete the install on our Trailhawk.

Regards,

Dan
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Old 06-21-2016, 08:38 AM   #124
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Originally Posted by dpinvidic View Post
I agree, and I plan to post a solution to this. I think I understand the connections they are making from looking at the tow kit install diagrams.

Jeep is actually ordering a tow kit harness for me so I can confirm my assumptions.

I will replace the console switch with a relay. There is also a relay under the hood, activated when you install the fuse. I am going to use the 12V charge line to activate both relays (I have a blocking diode to prevent the TOAD from activating the relays). This way the everything is automatic.

An added bonus is that on Freightliners, the 12V charge line is ignition controlled. So stopping overnight turns off the system. No Switches and no fuses to worry about.

I will post instructions after I complete the install on our Trailhawk.

Regards,

Dan
Dan, your proposed solution sounds very interesting. Hope it all goes as expected as I will be looking forward to seeing your instructions.
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:21 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by dpinvidic View Post
I agree, and I plan to post a solution to this. I think I understand the connections they are making from looking at the tow kit install diagrams.

Jeep is actually ordering a tow kit harness for me so I can confirm my assumptions.

I will replace the console switch with a relay. There is also a relay under the hood, activated when you install the fuse. I am going to use the 12V charge line to activate both relays (I have a blocking diode to prevent the TOAD from activating the relays). This way the everything is automatic.

An added bonus is that on Freightliners, the 12V charge line is ignition controlled. So stopping overnight turns off the system. No Switches and no fuses to worry about.

I will post instructions after I complete the install on our Trailhawk.

Regards,

Dan
Awesome idea!
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Old 06-22-2016, 06:24 AM   #126
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I will replace the console switch with a relay. There is also a relay under the hood, activated when you install the fuse. I am going to use the 12V charge line to activate both relays (I have a blocking diode to prevent the TOAD from activating the relays). This way the everything is automatic.
dpinvidic, I am interested in how this works out, too. Please keep us updated on your progress.

Thanks!

\ken
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