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Old 11-22-2013, 07:25 PM   #1
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1987 E350 Class C Tioga Motorhome 460 fuel pump

How many fuel pump (s) is this motorhome supposed to have?.

I have start problem, one of the mechanic say I have fuel delivery problem, He think this motorhome should have "two" fuel pumps. (he say most motorhome have two". I found only one in the fuel tank (newly replace).

Does any one own a similar RV. Does your have one or two fuel pump? if you have two - where is the second pump located?
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Old 11-22-2013, 08:13 PM   #2
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I believe that if your 460 has a carburetor then you'll have just one low pressure pump in the fuel tank. If the 460 has fuel injection, a second pump was added along the frame rail to increase the fuel pressure for the FI.
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Old 11-22-2013, 09:05 PM   #3
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Fuel pump

I have a 1988 Winnebago with a 460, it has a mechanical fuel pump on the motor and a inline mid stream, they call it a pusher, it draws from the tank, since its so far from the motor
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Old 11-23-2013, 02:05 PM   #4
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additional information on my 1987 Tioga

My motor-home is 1987 Fleetwood, Tioga, E350, Ford Econoline Chasis, 26' long, Engine is 460 CID, 7.5 Liter, V8. Vin # FDKE30L1HHC20892. Carburetor is Holley 4BB, (E5HE-ED, List 50260-3).

This is is not fuel injection system.

Here is a list of things done by the mobile mechanic:

1) carburetor bowl vent valve –replaced with two new valves.
2) Carburetor re-builded by pro carburetor shop. with new inlet fuel filter. new electric choke.
3) Damaged vacuum line due to back firing - Repaired
4) Replaced gasket between engine block and erg valve plate –Originally has vacuum leak.
5) damaged wiring harness resulted from carburetor backfiring-repaired.
6) New fuel pump, also replaced gas hose at gas tank.
7) Complete turn up; include ; New spark plugs, new wires, new distributor cap, oil and oil filter, air filter. Fuel filters (included the one under carriage AC Delco GF-62), Added fuel conditioner, timing was done.

Currently, Engine will crank normal, but won't start. Sometimes Engine will start if I spray starting fluid in carburetor, and it will run ok. I can restart and stop engine several times without starting fluid. However, next morning, when I try to start it, it will crank normal but won’t start.

One of the Mechanic suggested;
"Sounds like a fuel pressure problem. Most motorhomes have 2 pumps, that's a long way to travel with 1 pump. You will need to purchase an external electric pump. This should fix your start and run problem."

My observation;
1) I observe fuel reaching the Carburetor (we concluded it was not a pump problem, (we did not verify fuel pressure, according to Ford repair manual; it need 6-8 pSI, new fuel pump we put in is Airtec E2484, rated @ 5-8psi)
2) It seems, sometime the fuel pump didn't turn on, then, when we try again, it would work. (Need a little help on this one, guys) fuel pump relay was removed and bench check, it was good.
3) Wiring color (black/ yellow stripe) from inertia switch to fuel pump relay does not match Ford repair manual. Or AllData. we verify continuity - ok. (anyone out there with the correct wiring diagram? help) (wire color on connector to inertia switch is black/yellow stripe, could be white stripe)

1987 Ford Econoline 350, 460cid, 7.5 LITER, Carburetor Holley 4BB, ( E5HE-9510-ED. List 50260-3), Vin # FDKE30L1HHC20892.

Thank you in advance for any helpful advice.
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Old 11-23-2013, 02:33 PM   #5
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Second fuel pump

The Ford 460 with a carb had only 1 pump in the tank. Mine went bad when the tank got down to half. Pulled tank and pump would spray out the top. made a pickup tube and mounted 2 electric pumps in series, MH must have gained 30 HP.
Another thing you can do is add a mechanical pump, everything is there, you just need the pump and the pushrod. That was quite popular back then.
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Old 11-23-2013, 03:30 PM   #6
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more detail please

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leland1950 View Post
The Ford 460 with a carb had only 1 pump in the tank. Mine went bad when the tank got down to half. Pulled tank and pump would spray out the top. made a pickup tube and mounted 2 electric pumps in series, MH must have gained 30 HP.
Another thing you can do is add a mechanical pump, everything is there, you just need the pump and the pushrod. That was quite popular back then.
Do I really need two pump?

In my younger days, I replace several of them mechanical pumps, I am familiar with the mechanical pump you refer to; I will crawl under see if there is enough room. I don't recall anything about ' adding a push rod', My recollection is the 'arm' from the pump slide underneath an existing cam - that's what operate the pump. It has been very long time since I work on old engine.
In the old says, It was easy to find a knowledgeable mechanic, Now that I am retired, I am having hard time finding a knowledge mechanic ( I MEAN finding a local mechanic, not referring to you). . can you send me a picture/ drawing especially the push rod you refer to?
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Old 11-24-2013, 01:57 PM   #7
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Assuming you are remembering to set the choke, I would have guessed something is wrong with your automatic choke. Since it was running the night before, there would be enough fuel in the float bowl to start, if only for a moment. Like a wise old man once said “you can’t flood a Ford!” If your choke isn’t working right, you can pump the heck on the gas pedal until it starts.

-Steven
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Old 11-24-2013, 02:36 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Wong View Post
My motor-home is 1987 Fleetwood, Tioga, E350, Ford Econoline Chasis, 26' long, Engine is 460 CID, 7.5 Liter, V8. Vin # FDKE30L1HHC20892. Carburetor is Holley 4BB, (E5HE-ED, List 50260-3).

.........
One of the Mechanic suggested;
"Sounds like a fuel pressure problem. Most motorhomes have 2 pumps, that's a long way to travel with 1 pump. You will need to purchase an external electric pump. This should fix your start and run problem."

My observation;
1) I observe fuel reaching the Carburetor (we concluded it was not a pump problem,
(we did not verify fuel pressure, according to Ford repair manual; it need 6-8 pSI, new fuel pump we put in is Airtec E2484, rated @ 5-8psi)
.........
Thank you in advance for any helpful advice.
If you have fuel in the carbs bowls. The fuel pump(s) are getting the fuel there. No fuel pressure is required for a carbed engine to start. Pressure is needed to refill the bowl.

I'd have another look at he choke setting or float levels. No matter what if your accelerator pump on the carb is working and you do have fuel in the bowls it should start after a dozen pump shots choke or no choke .
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Old 11-24-2013, 07:36 PM   #9
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automatic Choke... good point

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgneubeck View Post
Assuming you are remembering to set the choke, I would have guessed something is wrong with your automatic choke. Since it was running the night before, there would be enough fuel in the float bowl to start, if only for a moment. Like a wise old man once said “you can’t flood a Ford!” If your choke isn’t working right, you can pump the heck on the gas pedal until it starts.


-Steven
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mekanic View Post
If you have fuel in the carbs bowls. The fuel pump(s) are getting the fuel there. No fuel pressure is required for a carbed engine to start. Pressure is needed to refill the bowl.

I'd have another look at he choke setting or float levels. No matter what if your accelerator pump on the carb is working and you do have fuel in the bowls it should start after a dozen pump shots choke or no choke .
I did not do the work, I am semi-disable, all I can do is watch and offer suggestions (friendly conversation mode). I hire a mobile mechanic to do the work. (they come to my place) One at a time, gone thru 4 already, they all give up. Glad you mention automatic choke ...I will bring it to their attention. Thanks.
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Old 11-24-2013, 09:54 PM   #10
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Our first MH, an '85 F350 Class C, had the original Ford fuel pump in the tank and then a second one mounted on the driver's side chassis rail just forward of the rear suspension.

With all the J.Michael Mouse anti-smog crap on that engine, there was a fuel return line back to the tank in case the two pumps in series fed too much fuel to the carburetor.
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Old 11-26-2013, 08:37 PM   #11
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Problem solved

We found the problem.
We found between the fuel pump and the small inlet filter (physically mounted on the carburetor inlet), there existed another small in-line filter; it looks like a "TEE," in the middle of this tee, there is a fuel line returning fuel back to the tank. Major portion of fuel was returned to the tank due to resistant of the small carburetor filter. Once remove, it working great.
Thank you all for trying to help
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Old 12-02-2013, 04:01 PM   #12
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this is a pressure regulator.I would not run it too much with it unhooked.

dave
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Old 12-03-2013, 12:51 AM   #13
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found out the hardway

Quote:
Originally Posted by dakratdave View Post
this is a pressure regulator.I would not run it too much with it unhooked.
dave
You are absolutely right. Our joy was short live. I wish I had found this before.


fuel vapor separators 460 ci - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums
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