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Old 07-17-2014, 10:13 AM   #57
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Believe it if you wish. But that doesn't mean others do. I sure don't.

On that theory my C+ was a D. Darn, the teacher would be really upset with a mark like that.
Sigh. What do you think C stands for? Cab with cut away chasis. B+s don't have cab over so they were hybrids between B and C. I don't believe, I know bc I OWN a B+, and it says B PLUS RIGHT ON IT. There is a real difference. They are also lower in height and more aerodynamic. You guys are not helping the person looking for a driveable motorhome, bc there is a genuine difference which makes them much easier to drive and more aerodynamic.
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Old 07-17-2014, 10:36 AM   #58
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Believe it if you wish. But that doesn't mean others do. I sure don't.

On that theory my C+ was a D. Darn, the teacher would be really upset with a mark like that.
To clear up the B+ debate, here is a video I found of my year and my RV, altho mine is the 250 B+ 25 ft on a Ford. Now go compare it to Coachmen Concord 300TS. Are you betting people? I wonder who would win this bet. Again you don't help by fighting this as there is a difference. Zoom in and see what it says on the side of the motorhome. B PLUS.
2002 RV B+ Trail-Lite by R-Vision Motor Home for sale - YouTube
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Old 07-17-2014, 10:42 AM   #59
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Needless to say that shape has nothing to do with it. I'd suggest you check with the definitions on gorging.com and the classification of the Mh in question on the Coachmen site.

At this link click on the links for A, B and C and read the descriptions and you will see why you are mixing your b's and c's.

Motorized RVs | Go RVing

Concord - Coachmen RV

Of course, people are free to call any kind of motorhome whatever they wish. The dealership where we purchased three of our five motorhomes has the Winnie View and Winnie VIA in the Class B category. That is incorrect as the View is a C and the VIA is an A. (according to Winnie - but dealers have been now for considerable inaccuracy on their websites)

The Winnie website states "the Via has ushered in a new era of Class A coaches ..........".

It also states for the View " this fuel-efficient Class C motorhome continually surprises with its spacious interiors.... ".

Winnie even as a separate site for its Class B units.

Winnebago Touring Coach Motorhomes

If you note the Winnie B's you will see the MH is basically a van and they have touched very little of the body. B's often have a raised roof but the walls remain as delivered to the MH manufacturer by the vehicle manufacturer.

Class C's (such as the Concord) are delivered to the manufacturer of the MH in what is call a cutaway or stripped chassis form - that is, nothing behind the driver's cabin and then they built the box. These cutaways are used for a variety of things - RV's, ambulances, dump trucks (our Kodiak), small buses.

Chassis Cab - PickupTrucks.com News

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A true C has a large squarer-shaped cab over sleeping area and taller. B+s typically (and this is why I mention) are lower which makes them easier to drive, can go under bridges much easier, etc. do not have the large cab-over sleeping area, which makes them more aerodynamic. A combo between a C and B. Over the years with some changes to models, yes sometimes you will see these lumped in as C's. There is a real difference tho, especially in drivability, which is why I mention it. I have an 11 year old B+ myself. SAYS B PLUS RIGHT ON THE SIDE OF IT, so no debate. Those were the original B+s and this one is the same. If you like, I will post a pic of mine, and a pic of the one I am referring to. The height difference and no cab-over bed over the front make them much different in driveability than a regular C. Navions are a great point to what you refer, they will get mentioned as C's, but some that don't have the cab over bed, are really more similar to the older B+'s, and sometimes sellers will call them a C and B+ to show the difference between the models. But this one in particular, on the same Ford or Chevy cut-away chasis, lower in height, same shape, are definitely modeled after the original B+s. Some more knowledegable sellers, who have seen the older models over the years, will classify them as what they are B+s instead of cab-over C's, as they does help the buyer. As this post in particular wants an easier driving motorhome, being lower and more aerodynamic I will call it a B+ to show the difference.
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Old 07-17-2014, 10:51 AM   #60
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C stood for cab over and cut away chasis. I don't call it what I wish, as it says B Plus right on it, look at the video. Also had a cut away chasis but was a hybrid. So how do you address that? Those are the original B+s. I'm trying to educate you on where the term started. Here is a pic Coachmen Concord 300TS where they call it a B+. To educate you, as you are uneducated in this, the last year or two they started sometimes lumping them in with C's. To clear up the debate of what a B+ really is, they are lower, no cab over bed and are easier to drive and these are B+.
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Old 07-17-2014, 10:55 AM   #61
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You are wrong. I would love to do this all day and would particularly love to bet money with you. I know this bc I own one. Here is an older Concord 300TS. This is an older one calls it a B+ bc that's what they were and started from. Only recently some will call a C which is why people are confused over what a B+ really is. I'm trying to educate. You want to debate you are wrong. C meant cab over and cut away chasis, at least in the past. A B plus had a cut away chasis also and was a hybrid between a B and a C, lower and more aerodynamic without cab over bed.
2006 Coachmen Concord 275 DS Class B+ , 16,000 Miles, 2 Slides, NADA $52K, $39,900 - YouTube
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Old 07-17-2014, 11:00 AM   #62
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And the View's, etc., are an example of the change over the years of the models. They are on a sprinter chasis, C with a cut away chasis and a cab over head bunk. The View models that don't, are actually modeled after the B+s, and you will see them called both a B+ and a C. Which is why people get confused nowadays. Yrs back, it was much clearer. I'm trying to educate bc there is a confusion about what B+s are or were. As I have one of the original, I know. You don't want to understand, I'm sorry you don't. There is no debate, this is not me calling it what I want to as you state, as mine states B Plus on it. Look at the video of the Trail-Lite (mine) and on the side of the coach you will see B Plus. Look at the next video of the Concord which I called a B+ (which you are debating otherwise) and they called it a B+, and is the same as mine. Currently they sometimes call a B+ a C as it has a cut-away chasis and it is not totally wrong bc it is a combination of a C and B. But C stood for not just cut away chasis but cab bunk, at least in the past. B+ had a cut away chasis with no cab bunk, was lower, easier to drive, more aerodynamic, a hybrid between a B and C.
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Old 07-17-2014, 11:16 AM   #63
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I'd love to see it. Sounds like a real workhorse. Photos posted anywhere?
It got the smaller 5.9L Cummins,6sp man trans, Air brakes.
geared up for highway and MPG it now gets 9.3-10.0 MPG as pictured.
as pictured total weight 20K lbs

the first Trip to CO in 2011 in Ouray CO


the 2nd trip west in 2012 This in Weatherford, OK on Old RT 66
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Old 07-17-2014, 06:58 PM   #64
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So yes, a B+ is a C.

Mystery solved.

No, it's a C with one bed (cabover) missing........
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Old 07-17-2014, 06:59 PM   #65
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You clearly aren't reading the material I've included. Just because an owner labelled it a B means absolutely nothing. It is like you calling it a B+. When the RVIA/RVDA/GoRving/Manufacturers all call it C, then you can keep on calling it a B+ if that warms your heart. If you buy a 300TS (which has some nice specs but with 3 slides I wonder what the carrying capacity is) and try to sell it as a B+ I don't think you will get to the correct market.

BTW, people aren't confused - you are.

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You are wrong. I would love to do this all day and would particularly love to bet money with you. I know this bc I own one. Here is an older Concord 300TS. This is an older one calls it a B+ bc that's what they were and started from. Only recently some will call a C which is why people are confused over what a B+ really is. I'm trying to educate. You want to debate you are wrong. C meant cab over and cut away chasis, at least in the past. A B plus had a cut away chasis also and was a hybrid between a B and a C, lower and more aerodynamic without cab over bed.
2006 Coachmen Concord 275 DS Class B+ , 16,000 Miles, 2 Slides, NADA $52K, $39,900 - YouTube
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Old 07-17-2014, 07:02 PM   #66
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I'm trying to educate. You want to debate you are wrong. C meant cab over and cut away chasis, at least in the past. A B plus had a cut away chasis also and was a hybrid between a B and a C, lower and more aerodynamic without cab over bed.

Since we're educating, a Ford (just to pick an example) makes just one cut away chassis, can you explain how a B can be lower than a C?

Does it have less headroom than a C inside?
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Old 07-17-2014, 07:46 PM   #67
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And the View's, etc., are an example of the change over the years of the models. They are on a sprinter chasis, C with a cut away chasis and a cab over head bunk. The View models that don't, are actually modeled after the B+s, and you will see them called both a B+ and a C. Which is why people get confused nowadays. Yrs back, it was much clearer. I'm trying to educate bc there is a confusion about what B+s are or were. As I have one of the original, I know. You don't want to understand, I'm sorry you don't. There is no debate, this is not me calling it what I want to as you state, as mine states B Plus on it. Look at the video of the Trail-Lite (mine) and on the side of the coach you will see B Plus. Look at the next video of the Concord which I called a B+ (which you are debating otherwise) and they called it a B+, and is the same as mine. Currently they sometimes call a B+ a C as it has a cut-away chasis and it is not totally wrong bc it is a combination of a C and B. But C stood for not just cut away chasis but cab bunk, at least in the past. B+ had a cut away chasis with no cab bunk, was lower, easier to drive, more aerodynamic, a hybrid between a B and C.
Madam, I think you are repeating some of what I've been trying to get across to you and it doesn't support the B notion. Phone Coachmen and ask them if the 300TS is a B+ or a C. Ask them why they call it a C. And then ask them why their parent company (Forest River) puts it in the C Category (Lexington) and then does a reference to it as a B+. When you look at the same form factor in the Winnie line (Aspect) it is a C. Jayco's form factor for the Melburne is also called a C. When you look at B's you find they are just not as heavy duty as the C's and the 300TS on the GM 4500 is pretty darn heavy duty to me and has the proper tow capacity of 5000 lbs. I think it is one of the better C chassis and either Ford improves or GM is going to take away biz. If I were looking for a C like this I sure wouldn't be looking under the B+ label. As I said earlier, I think you would be short changing the unit. The only difference is the lower front with the deletion of a bunk that is replaced by an entertainment center and if I wanted one like that I'd look under C's. There are even Super C's like that - no bed over the cab. And of course now we are getting A's with a bed over that retracts to the ceiling.

There are defined industry categories for A, B and C and they sure don't include a unit like a 300TS in the B+ category.
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Old 07-17-2014, 08:18 PM   #68
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Using these arguments it seems MCI, Bluebird and Prevost conversions are all Class B's. I dont see how they are any different than a VW camper bus.

In the end, if the common use is B+ then B+ it is. All soft drinks get called Coke, photocopies are all Xerox and tissues are Kleenex. It drives copyright owners nuts but that's life.

Everyone knows exactly what that thing is we call a Class B+. There's no mistake about that.

That's life
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Old 07-18-2014, 04:02 AM   #69
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Sigh. What do you think C stands for? Cab with cut away chasis. B+s don't have cab over so they were hybrids between B and C. I don't believe, I know bc I OWN a B+, and it says B PLUS RIGHT ON IT. There is a real difference. They are also lower in height and more aerodynamic. You guys are not helping the person looking for a driveable motorhome, bc there is a genuine difference which makes them much easier to drive and more aerodynamic.
Actually, B+ was invented to give an inaccurate idea as to what an RV type is. There are three classes based on what the RV builder is going to make.

A: Truck chassis, no bodywork
B: Van chassis with bodywork complete
C: Chassis cab with the truck cab provided by the chassis maker.

The B+ term some makers invented ascribed the wrong type letter to a Class C type RV. More accurate would be to call it a C- since it is minus the cable bunk, although it still has a cabover compartment, just not a bunk.

Besides that, some Cs have that same cabover bunk compartment converted to storage; no bed. If it starts out life as a chassis cab, then it's a Class C regardless of the body style.

Daimler Benz makes a truck chassis for the Sprinter (F50 I believe) and this becomes a Class A with the entire body being provided in the case of Winnebago/Navion Via and Reyo.

They also make a complete sprinter van with all body work provided and that is made into Class B RVs (also called Van Conversions) such as the Winnebago ERA.

Their 3500 series Chassis cab is the basis for the Winnebago View and View Profile. These are both Class C.

These are the definitions in common use when I started looking at RV's some 15 years ago. I don't care what they are called.

Some camping "resorts" do though. There are several that I know of that accept only Class A units.
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Old 07-18-2014, 07:29 AM   #70
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You clearly aren't reading the material I've included. Just because an owner labelled it a B means absolutely nothing. It is like you calling it a B+. When the RVIA/RVDA/GoRving/Manufacturers all call it C, then you can keep on calling it a B+ if that warms your heart. If you buy a 300TS (which has some nice specs but with 3 slides I wonder what the carrying capacity is) and try to sell it as a B+ I don't think you will get to the correct market.

BTW, people aren't confused - you are.
Really as mine says B Plus right on it, maybe you are the confused one! I would win in a bet and win in a court of law also. Cannot believe you are still arguing this point when mine was sold as a B+ and says it right on it. Look at the video. You clearly are not reading what I sent YOU. IT IS NOT A "B". A B IS A DIFFERENT RV. A B Plus was an RV that was created that was larger than a B, to a market that wanted something a little bit larger than a B, was a hybrid C, but did not have that square overhead cab area that was used mostly as a large bunk, yes some use it for entertainment but look at the outside of the RV to understand. So they were going after that market. Something for people that was in between a B and a C. It also usually had a dry bath, altho some not, but larger than a B and was also lower than a C and easier to drive. The Concord 300 was called a B Plus also, look at the older video I sent. ONLY JUST RECENTLY with the change in the models over the yrs, with the new sprinter Views, etc. coming out, the end of several companies that were manufacturing B+'s like BT Cruiser's, etc., Chinooks, Rialta, etc., Trail-Lite B Plus like I own, the term has started to change to sometimes being called a C and people have become confused. Look at the videos I sent you. When mine says B Plus right on it, I think mine is and has always been a B Plus and YOU ARE WRONG. Yes technically you could argue it looks more like a C as it has a cut away chasis but they called them B+. And yes with the start of the new Sprinter Views, they started calling them C but their one without the bed is more like the original B+ and I still see knowledgeable salespeople etc. calling those B+'s. I know bc I OWN ONE and states it right on it.
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