Feedback on State Parks in general (Ohio)

[Superslif]

Having camped for years here in Ohio at many of our state parks, I have found over the last few years diminishing upkeep and massive overnight fee increases. This past weekend (April 15-18, 2004)we camped at Pymatuning State park. After returning home I felt compelled to write the state park system superintendent about a few thinks that have been bugging me. Here is a copy of that letter:
------------------------------------------------
Hello,
Having lived and camped at Ohio State Parks over the last 30 years I found myself in disbelief in the last few years of all the "diminishing upkeep" and "fee increases" instituted upon the working class residents of this "once" great state. I realize the State of Ohio in general is in a state of fiscal emergency, but at least a few days camping in the outdoors here in Ohio could let you forget about everyday struggles to keep up with living expenses. It seems that in no time the overnight camping fees have doubled from what they were 10 years ago. Yes, I do have and use the "Cardinal Discount Card". While camping at Hocking Hills, last fall, I struck up a conversation with the park check-in clerk about 2003's fee increase. She informed me that you haven't seen anything yet since 2004 there was going to be another $2 across the board increase. She went on to say that Ohio has turned overnight camping in "their" state a "RICH MAN'S SPORT". I took that as marketing geared towards wealthy campers who wouldn't flinch at overnight fees regardless what they were. When I see $100-$200k diesel powered coaches or mega sized travel trailers pulled by $40k SUV's I sometimes think Ohio associates tenters and pop-up campers as taxing the system because they, in general, have more kids who put more wear and tear on stuff in general.
My family had camped for years in a tent and finely about 5 years ago moved up to a pop-up. I just feel people with limited incomes are feeling pressed to keep up once relatively cheap recreational activity. But things have changed forever.
What brought me to write this letter (E-mail) was this weekend trip to Pymatuning State Park. Upon arrival on this past Thursday I really didn't expect anyone to be at the check-in station. From past experiences, I know to check out which washrooms are open before setting up at a site. I drove to the area we were to meet about 6-7 other families where we were to meet later in the day. I noticed that there were no washrooms open. I saw a few maintenance men working and asked them are "any" washrooms or shower houses open. They responded by saying there might be one open but they weren't sure which one. Hummm??? When we found it, we set up camp and phoned others in our group who weren't "self contained" to be near by. I felt sorry for the other campers who set up their camp sites and "assumed" that the campground would have at least one shower house open in their section. On Sunday before leaving I ran into the park V.I.P. (Volunteers in the park)camper and asked why with maybe 125+ campers this weekend with nice weather there was only one showerhouse/bathroom open. He informed me that the state is implementing massive cuts to services in the state parks. He said no other washrooms will open till at least May 15th. I assumed that meant that no one would clean them either. Which was the case. Upon leaving on Sunday they were in very poor condition.
Over the last ten years, we have noticed, while camping in the Pennsylvania State park systems, that their site fees have had only a minimal increase, and, also, their buildings, grounds, and services have never diminished. They have always been well maintained. By the way, they do not have a reservation fees.
------------------------------------------------
I was wondering what others in other States experenced at their State Parks over the years. Here in Ohio overnight fees at non-electric sites range from about $17-$20. And electric sites $22-$26. Full service $30+. I think really what I have seen is in the "off-season" (2nd week Sept till 2nd week in June) Ohio runs its parks on the bare bones. No grass cutting, no washroom cleaning, 1/3 or 1/2 of sites open, no "on ground" employees. But charge "FULL" price.

[Rick A]

In Cebtral Maryland, where I still do lot of camping at state parks, they close for the winter around end of September, and reopen end of April. Most have limited hookups if any. The ones that are open year round have full hookup and only typically keep one camping loop open. The rates are similar to that in Ohio. I will admit that for the most part the upkeep is good because of a strong volunteer program. I have noticed over the past few years camping rates in general signifcantly increasing to the point that when traveling, it is no longer a given to take the RV. It has gotten to the point that some hotels are competively priced with staying at a campground. I gave up boating because of the overcrowding on the waterways and the ever increasing marina fees. Now it seems to be happening to the camping scene and taking a lot of the enjoyment out of it. So much for affordable family recreation!

[Superslif]

Come to think of it, I remember another V.I.P.(Volunteer in the park) at Punderson saying because Ohio State Parks have cut man power, the workers normally doing "trades" jobs (Electrical, Construction, ect...) are doing the cleaning. At one time the V.I.P.'s were able to do small things like doing some light check-ups and cleaning in the washrooms and picking up trash left at sites around the park. But because the normal workers are in a union, they (VIP's)are no longer to do those things. Thou I do see VIP's doing clerical work at the check-in stations. This was in 2002. I don't know if this is system wide, or just at Punderson (NE Ohio).

[Jacksons]

I would say that you are right about the v.i.ps.it seems to be system wide that they are not allowed to clean restrooms because of the union.Last year at Dillion we watched a truck of 3 workers "clean" one restroon each side has 7 or 8 showers and two stalls,total cleaning time was about 3.5 min.this was consistant for the week we were there.prices go up and quality goes down

[Sissy7378]

Have had great experiences in state parks. Have been in Iowa, North Dakota, South Dakota, Missouri, Indiana, Kentucky, Tennessee and Florida. Some are better than others but most are great. Can even make reservations in some which is good especially in Florida. Almost all are looking for volunteer workers so you could go for a month as a host. Not much hard work and a great experience.

[troth]

Quote:

I think really what I have seen is in the "off-season" (2nd week Sept till 2nd week in June) Ohio runs its parks on the bare bones. No grass cutting, no washroom cleaning, 1/3 or 1/2 of sites open, no "on ground" employees. But charge "FULL" price.

Jim, that's generally what I've seen too. Up to about 5 years ago we used to get great off-season rates (reduced prices) and in general nice camping, but no more... Off season now means fewer patrols, dirty restrooms, unkempt areas, yadda yadda.

[ronstan]

Well it is 2006 and the great state of Indiana and our great govenor has raised the rates to $25.00 a night on the weekend. Thats 50. Families are not going to be able to afford that. What a shame. They said they raised it cause they didn't have enough people coming in. What will happen now?

[Captain Pickle]

Our Kentucky State Parks have been steadily rising prices too. It's $20.00/night now on weekdays and $22.00 on weekends. The parks stay full, so I know they are making money. If I saw the levels of the campgrounds rising with the prices, then it might not be so bad. Alot of parks have made improvements, but alot need some serious improvements. Our favorite is Carter Caves. It's the best around.

[Webster]

The ones in California are fairly nice. Some are overcrowded, but the prices are good. If you're VA disabled (100%) then there is no camping fee once you get the card.

We're going back to the East Coast and I looked at quite a few campgrounds in NH. Outrageous. There is one I wanted to stay at, but it's $32 a night and they aren't full hook-ups nor do they really have the amenities. I looked at the State Parks, one in particular, at a lake and they don't even have hook-ups and are $24 for a regular site and $30 for a view of the lake.

I think others are correct. If it has RV attached to the product, they feel they can charge more. I guess all of us RVers are rich...Yeah, that's why I purchased a used one.

[Ron2]

Visit our wonderful State of Idaho, you won't be sorry! Take a drive to Featherville and park your RV along the South Fork of the Boise River, step out in the morning the river is at your doorstep. It's boondocking at it best! You can't beat Three Island Crossing, Hells Canyon, Massacre Rocks, City of Rocks, Lake Cascade, and many more. My Wife and I live here and have been RV'ing just in Idaho for the last 3 years and figure we need 3 more years to cover it. Prices are right, weather is right, people are right. Check out the website, www.idahoparks.org/index.aspx

Ron

[Dagwood]

Ron I just looked at their website and hope to stop at one or two Idaho parks on the way home from Yellowstone next year . Thanks for the link.

[Ron2]

Dagwood,
How far west into Idaho are you traveling. My Wife and I enjoy Three Island Park but you have to make resverations early because it is a busy place during the summer because it is close to Boise and Twin Falls. Massacre Rocks is a nice campground along the Snake River, if you stay there it is much easier to get a big rig in the upper portion because the parking in the lower portion is a little crazy because some of the spots you must pull into and not back in although the lower section does have several pull throughs. If you stay at Massacre Rocks it is an easy drive to City of Rocks they have camping spots there but very limited for large rigs (also gravel roads). I noticed you have a Jayco, there is a Jayco plant in Twin Falls but I don't think they manufacturer 5th wheels there. Enjoy your Idaho visit!
Ron

[Greenie]

I've managed state parks in Maine for 29 years and have seen camping fees increase from $4 a night to $17 a night during those years. When parks were developed it was a different world, income wasn't a top priority. Government has grown massively, parks that formerly relied upon a general fund for operating expenses are now competing with hungry children, schools, needy families for every tax dollar.
Public sector jobs are the one part of union membership that's increasing. Unions can dictate what an employee does as part of his/her job duties, employee benefits can sometimes create abuses in paid sick leave. The bureaucracy often makes a simple task dauntingly complex; on a safety drive many managers turned in tools and equipment they saw as liabilities. A ranger might paint 40 hours a year, yet enforcement of osha demands safeguards that a 52 week full time painter is required to obey. Same with welding, carpentry, so on. The jack of all trades ranger who can repair a light switch, weld, mow, excavate, and build is no longer politically correct and runs the risk of fines for the agency.
There's also a decline in work ethics I've noticed in other park systems. Volunteers take on all aspects of the park's operation and the remaining paid staff doesn't always properly use the free time created by the volunteers. A park that is run by volunteers could benefit by the existing rangers completing repairs or improvements, but quite often the existing paid staff doesn't use the new found time wisely.
At the parks I've managed we have used CETA, SPEDY,SYETP and ASPIRE programs for a labor force to varying degrees of success but many of those programs have also changed or ended. One exciting program we're 3 years into now is the use of prison inmates. The guys we get are carefully screened and are close to their release date. We are trained to supervise the minimum security inmates and use them 40 hours a week with great success. We're rebuilding structures, building new ones, repairing trails and roads. Our rates are still high, but we're hopefully satisfying the visiting public with the realization that their user fees are resulting in progress and the enhancement of the facility.
Sorry for the stemwinder, but this is a subject I feel strongly about

[George Miklas]

Geenie, Thank you for sharing your perspective on the subject. Your contribution helps us, as consumers, to understand some of the logistics that affect camping rates.

GM