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06-12-2018, 01:04 PM
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#43
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 35,349
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I haven't seen a scale used on portable propane cylinders in 10 years. They have them, but sit there rusting away.
They crack the bleeder and fill until the OPD shuts down the flow.
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06-12-2018, 05:24 PM
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#44
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,985
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twinboat
I haven't seen a scale used on portable propane cylinders in 10 years. They have them, but sit there rusting away.
They crack the bleeder and fill until the OPD shuts down the flow.
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In the state of Texas the Railroad Commission will fine and shut down a LP operation if they are caught not using a certified scale to fill portable bottles. It's a very serious matter.
The OPD floats can break off or fail without warning and is meant as a safety measure to not overfill the bottles. It's a Fed law to use the scale.
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06-12-2018, 05:41 PM
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#45
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 35,349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grindstone01
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In the state of Texas the Railroad Commission will fine and shut down a LP operation if they are caught not using a certified scale to fill portable bottles. It's a very serious matter.
The OPD floats can break off or fail without warning and is meant as a safety measure to not overfill the bottles. It's a Fed law to use the scale.
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Is that Fed law only on the 20 lb tanks ?
The OPD is the secondary device, the bleeder is the primary.
Like I said, in 10 years of cruising the East coast and getting a 20 lb tank filled every 6 weeks, the cylinders were never scaled.
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06-12-2018, 05:56 PM
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#46
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Senior Member
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: The Ozarks
Posts: 1,566
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Heyeee....Now thats doin it. I do so enjoy these "Im smarter than you" threads.
__________________
Ret. Military/Corporate Pilot
Summers in the Ozarks-Winters in the Keys
Allegro Bus 36QSP
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06-12-2018, 05:59 PM
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#47
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,985
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twinboat
Is that Fed law only on the 20 lb tanks ?
The OPD is the secondary device, the bleeder is the primary.
Like I said, in 10 years of cruising the East coast and getting a 20 lb tank filled every 6 weeks, the cylinders were never scaled.
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I believe 125 lb bottles are the cut off for requiring a scale and OPD valves. For residential tank fill, usually 100 gallon or more, the procedure is to open the bleeder valve with a drop tube and fill until liquid drops come out which is 80% full.
Relying on the OPD is risky business. If the OPD fails and the portable tank gets overfilled, there is a high risk the relief valve will pop open and things get interesting fast. We used to average 1 out of 40 tanks to have faulty OPD valves. The empty weight is stamped on the bottle handle so you know where to set the scale for adding say 20 lbs.
The bleed valve on a portable tank is just to relieve pressure, there is no drop tube attached for 80% fill.
for SkyPilot this is how passing info works and we both might learn something, it's not a ego thing.
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06-12-2018, 07:28 PM
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#49
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Western Montana
Posts: 972
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twinboat
I haven't seen a scale used on portable propane cylinders in 10 years. They have them, but sit there rusting away.
They crack the bleeder and fill until the OPD shuts down the flow.
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Agree - The only time I have seen a tank weighed is when I fill my own tanks from the wet tap on my 500 gal home tank. Never have seen it when having them filled on the road. Some of my tanks are not OPD.
__________________
Mike & JoAnne
Montana Summer / Arizona Winter
'16 Prism 24G / '02 HitchHiker 38 LKTG
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06-13-2018, 04:19 AM
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#50
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 35,349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grindstone01
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Yup, no scale needed.
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06-13-2018, 06:30 AM
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#51
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 4,985
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twinboat
Yup, no scale needed.
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OK whatever?? A little research will show that a scale is required by Fed law to fill portable bottles. It's like smoking at a gas station, people do it all the time but it's against the law and just not safe. If a overfilled propane bottle pops it's relief valve while near a building or RV, it won't be a good day and it's the reason for the law.
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06-13-2018, 07:43 AM
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#52
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Senior Member
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 14,885
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grindstone01
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In the state of Texas the Railroad Commission will fine and shut down a LP operation if they are caught not using a certified scale to fill portable bottles. It's a very serious matter.
The OPD floats can break off or fail without warning and is meant as a safety measure to not overfill the bottles. It's a Fed law to use the scale.
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Yuma, AZ does not follow the Fed law while filling bottles. Operators meter the propane in and crack the bleed valve. No scales in sight.
__________________
Gordon and Janet
Tour 42QD/InTech Stacker
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06-13-2018, 11:49 AM
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#53
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbaraok
If you read the one document about filling at mobile homes it lists a distance requirement from sources of ignition. I believe that is the reason for the restriction as you can't guarantee the 10' (3 m) between where the tank on a motorhome might be and the sources of ignition from a park model with an Arizona room next door since there is often only 3' or less between the motorhome and the side of the park model.
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Aah, park models. But it still doesn't say that you can't fill tanks in an RV park if you do have sufficient clearance. Like in the summer when it's deserted, maybe.
An RV park may just have a blanket prohibition against having on-site propane filling because it's easier than dealing with each situation individually to see if it complies, which I understand. But that's different from the City of Mesa not allowing it to occur.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbaraok
I really don't understand why people who aren't staying in Mesa are so upset. Those of us that do know what we have to do to enjoy our winters.
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I don't know about the others, but I'm not upset. But I do think scrupulousness when it comes to laws is a good thing. Which leads me to...
Quote:
Originally Posted by grindstone01
OK whatever?? A little research will show that a scale is required by Fed law to fill portable bottles.
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It would be a lot easier for you to share the citation to the federal law instead of making everybody else try to find it, especially since you're already familiar with it.
It would also greatly bolster your contention that it exists.
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06-13-2018, 03:19 PM
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#54
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Senior Member
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Traveling in North America
Posts: 2,248
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Propane or electric
All of the RV parks around us have RVs interspersed with park models. Again, it isn’t the parks saying no, it is the City of Mesa. Even in Summer that RV is probably going to have a park model next door - or more likely won’t be there because of the heat and certainly doesn’t need propane when electric is so cheap under SRP.
__________________
Barbara & David O'Keeffe
Figment II (Alpine 2002 36 MDDS)
On The Road since 2006
Blog
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06-13-2018, 09:25 PM
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#55
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Senior Member
Monaco Owners Club Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 7,469
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No longer very informative but certainly entertaining.
__________________
US Navy Vet, Liberty Tree Member of Oath Keepers, NRA & VFW Life Member, Alaska EMT.
2009 Safari Cheetah 40 SKQ
2009 Winnebago Chalet 231CR
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06-14-2018, 10:36 AM
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#56
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbaraok
All of the RV parks around us have RVs interspersed with park models. Again, it isn’t the parks saying no, it is the City of Mesa. Even in Summer that RV is probably going to have a park model next door - or more likely won’t be there because of the heat and certainly doesn’t need propane when electric is so cheap under SRP.
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Those may be the practicalities, and it might mean that it doesn't happen, but that's not the same as an ordinance that prohibits it.
It certainly wouldn't be the first time a business says something is prohibited by some law, and it turns out that's not exactly the case. The result is the same--they don't do it--but the basis for their action is different.
If you're interested only in the upshot, then fine--just say RV parks in Mesa don't allow filling of propane tanks. But it's inaccurate to say it's prohibited by the city unless there's an ordinance that says that, especially when Mesa publishes a document explaining how to do what you're saying they prohibit.
Now, find an ordinance that says it's prohibited, and we can all be satisfied.
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