Weight of "stuff"?

[ThomCat316]

We are designing an ultralight fiver for towing with our Dakota, and don't have a good grasp of the range of weight for day-to-day stuff for a couple.

We aren't including tankage, propane, electrical/electronics, etc. in "stuff", as that's in the "wet" trailer weight budget. We are also experienced teardrop trailer and backcountry kayak campers, so we are quite comfortable with lightweight and compact outdoor furniture and similar.

What we don't have is a good grasp of what we will be planning to load up for permanent on-the-road life.

On the plus side, we will have a South Florida homebase with storage and shop facilities, so we won't have to carry all my tools....

So, weight guesses?

[dexters]

Originally Posted by ThomCat316

We are designing an ultralight fiver for towing with our Dakota,

Is that a Dodge Dakota? I doubt it has the payload capacity for a 5th wheel.

[ThomCat316]

Current weight budget for the trailer brings it in at under 3,000 lbs. with full tankage. This is less than 50% of the Dakota's tow rating. If we are careful with the build we may shave even more off.

To keep your disbelief at bay, our 5x12 TD is 340 lbs. empty, and a 4x10 I built is 250 lbs.

[Mich F]

The pin weight will be about 25% of your loaded trailer weight, which could be a problem for a Dakota.

[ThomCat316]

Still working out the weight distribution, but the Dakota has a bed payload of over 1,600 lbs., IIRC. We won't be exceeding any ratings.

[Skip426]

Originally Posted by ThomCat316

Still working out the weight distribution, but the Dakota has a bed payload of over 1,600 lbs., IIRC. We won't be exceeding any ratings.

I don't believe that the term " bed payload " is correct , it should be just payload, and not all available on the rear axle or in the box.
I don't know how they would calculate " bed payload"

BTW: I towed my first 3 , 5ers with a 93 , V-8 Dakota 4X4 Club Cab., 1850lbs payload. Remember the max trailer tow capacity is calculated with only a lightweight driver , so everything in the truck other than the driver has to be deducted from the payload and max trailer tow capacity.

[ThomCat316]

Noted, thanks!

The "bed payload" (maybe bed capacity?) was dug up somewhere when I was thinking of going across the state to pick up a small horizontal mill. Decided not to kill the truck..... :-)

We will be removing the bed and replacing it with a light fiberglass flatbed and skirt. The fifth wheel hitch will mount as low as possible into this.

[ThomCat316]

Sooooo....

Ignoring the truck capacity issue, anyone have a good answer for the original question?

All conversation aside, if the truck's capacities are exceeded, we simply have to sell the truck and buy one more suited.

[Skip426]

Ok then back to the weight of " stuff " our coach has a 3500 lbs. CCC rating , ( Cargo Carrying Capacity ) or payload if you will . Between my tools and the DW , " Just in case " items we use up 2400 LBS. when leaving for our 5 months of snow birding .
But then if the DW sees any empty spot anywhere , she simply has to find something from the house to take to fill it.
Examples of " Just in case" items.
Inflatable queen bed , and all pillows and sheets comforters etc. just in case someone decides to come and stay with us . It's happened once in 7, 5 month, seasons for 6 nights. So 1% of the time we have company.
I also have and electric pressure cooker , NEW, with 30,000 miles on it.
So , if like you say you know how to pack light , my weight numbers are of no use to you or most anyone else for that matter.

[Arizona]

Sounds like a fun project. Our list of must haves changes but some of the heavy things are the clothes, BBQ, drinking water, tools, Honda generator, installed solar, liquid soaps/detergents, food, and pots-pans. Remember your water heater holds six or ten gallons of water. If you put a digital scale next to the door when loading you can step on it with items, deduct your weight and see the progression
I started to go over when I put in separate washer/dryer units and had to unload other things.
Good luck

[ThomCat316]

Skip426,
Thank you for letting us know what your actual weight is. I don't think we will be travelling with much in the way of single-use stuff, though a Zojirushi 4L water boiler will have a place. We get by luxuriously in the saltwater backcountry with about 150 lbs. for a week, including water. I will guess that the teardrop has ca. 350 lbs. of stuff for a month of travel, including refrigerator, stove/grill, and too much cast iron.

Arizona,
Thanks for the encouragement, and for nudging me to get started on the "portable" weight budget. When you're building, spreadsheets are your friends...

I can't wait to see what we actually end up with when I go past rough weight calcs. Right now the shell weight is based on a rectangular box defined by the limits of the length, width and height. About 25-30% of the area of the shell will be "going away" in rounding, tapering and streamlining. The way we are doing calcs, everything that can't be picked up and moved, including full water tankage, is included in the sheet. We will be trying out one of the newer tankless heaters, carrying composite propane tanks, building water and waste tankage into the floor structure, and generally doing everything one would do to trim weight in designing a performance​ sailboat.

[Mich F]

Originally Posted by ThomCat316

Skip426,
We get by luxuriously in the saltwater backcountry with about 150 lbs. for a week, including water.​

It sounds like quite the project, and you have a very good idea on how to do it. That 150# you mentioned would be less than 17 gal. of water alone ? From another of your posts, I believe you mentioned wanting a 5th wheel about 28' long. That might be a handling issue with the Dakota. One of those tail wagging the dog kind of things.

[winniman]

Please let us know how your project progresses. I am the exact opposite. We have everything including the kitchen sink. How can you live full time with 150 lbs of stuff. Sounds like you are spending a lot of money trying to keep the weight down to save some money on the truck. I think you will tire quickly having so little personal stuff. jmho

[ThomCat316]

Sorry if I mislead!

Kayak trips load out at about 150# for a week, including water. Our Teardrop loadout is about 350#.

I can easily see several hundred pounds or more of moveable stuff for full-time living. We started this thread to get a realistic range from folks who are already doing it.

To clarify our intent: getting great gas mileage is a game for both of us, being frugal with project spending is also, and we are building a trailer structure that we can resell in near-new condition in thirty years if we want. Nothing I've seen in parks or dealer lots is built to last, and the most durable of them are both vastly more expensive and ridiculously heavier than what we plan to build.

As for spending a lot of money.... I'm a cheap DIY bastard. The truck was $2,000, the Mercedes that's donating the Diesel for it was $800, and the best estimate so far to build the trailer is about $12,000. We've already saved $4,000 off that by buying the main electrics used. If weight calcs tell me I have to spring $5,000 for a 1997-98 Dodge 2500 Cummins....Ok.

I have experience working with light composite structures, which this will be, and fully expect to come in under the current weight budget for the trailer.

I had thought a bit about the sway issue mentioned, and was thinking to combat that by keeping the trailer axle proportionally further aft than is typical. Since the structure is very light and the tankage, equipment and storage are designed around the axle area, I suspect that the moment arm aft of the trailer axle will be short and the sectional weights fore and aft will be proportionally minor.

Still have to do a thorough mass budget, though.