More Canadian Walmarts banning Overnight RV Parking

[jobriant]

There are two Walmart stores on Prince Edward Island: Store # 3162 in Charlottetown, PE and Store# 3644, Summerside, PE. In both cases, Walmart leases the lot (and perhaps the building) from First Pro Property Management of Vaughan, ON.

Effective this month (August 2010), First Pro is erecting "No Overnight RV Parking" signage in the parking lots of both of these stores. This morning I've spoken with the managers of both stores, and both stated that First Pro has changed their Overnight RV Parking policy due to abuse by RVers.

Both store managers told me about:

• RVers parking without permission, sometimes for up to a week
• RVers parking so as to block traffic flow and customer parking
• RVers parking rigs in a square, blocking traffic lanes, with awnings deployed, BBQ's and lawn furniture in use, and in some cases excessive alcohol consumption
• RVers parking on the grass adjacent to the parking lot
• RVers parking and then also pitching tents for their kids

Over the past three years, other RVers have also reported these abuses in their reports to my Overnight RV Parking website, and most (but not all) of these reports have been at Walmarts in Eastern Canada and the Northeastern USA.

The Overnight RV Parking privilege, at Walmarts and at other retail stores, continues to erode. There are numerous causes, but one significant cause is abuse by RVers who don't ask permission from the store, who stay more than one night, and who set up "dry camping" campsites rather than simply PARKING overnight and departing the next morning.

[Gary - K7GLD]

YUP - I have steadily maintained that the "Walmart RV campground" issue would eventually be dead from suicide - for all the above stated reasons...

[ParkyJordan]

When Parking at a Walmart you have to be considerate and keep in mind that it isnt a camp site, its a car park.
its the ones that take liberties that ruin it for the rest

[Diesel Guy]

Hello as I travel around Canada & the US i see countless people parked in Wal-Mart parking lot like they own the place. I for one use camp site to park my unit over nite, but I see in the Walmart parking lots are very very costly rigs are they so cheap they can.t afford to park in a camp site. They are the careless ones who screw it for others they have no one to blame for Walmart banning overnite parking but themselfs which of course they don't blame themself that where the problem lies. I would bet money that they are the same people who don't pickup after their pets

[jobriant]

Originally Posted by Diesel Guy

Hello as I travel around Canada & the US i see countless people parked in Wal-Mart parking lot like they own the place. ... [they are very very costly rigs are they so cheap they can.t afford to park in a camp site. They are the careless ones who screw it for others they have no one to blame for Walmart banning overnite parking but themselfs ... I would bet money that they are the same people who don't pickup after their pets

Regarding MOST of the RVers who park overnight at Walmart, you'd lose your bet.

The vast majority of RVers who park at Walmart park there only with permission from the store (as Walmart says they should in the FAQ on the corporate website). They park in the part of the lot where Walmart wants them to park. Some do it because saving money is mandatory for them, but most do it for the convenience. Most Walmarts are easy to get to, most lots are "easy in & out," most sell groceries & supplies that RVers need, and many have gas stations, some with Diesel fuel.

There is a tiny minority of RVers who do indeed, park there as if they own the place: They park without permission. They block traffic lanes. They park close to the store, occupying spaces needed by customer automobiles. They use awnings, lawn furniture & BBQ's. They stay for several days or weeks. (I don't know whether they pick up after their pets or not, and I'm not going to state anything I haven't personally seen nor had reported to me by other RVers whom I consider reliable.)

The vast majority of RVers who park overnight at Walmart are not the problem. This tiny minority are the ones who cause the problem, and they need to be educated. I wish I knew the best way to accomplish that.

[jobriant]

Originally Posted by jobriant

There are two Walmart stores on Prince Edward Island: Store # 3162 in Charlottetown, PE and Store# 3644, Summerside, PE. ...

Effective this month (August 2010), First Pro [the property management company] is erecting "No Overnight RV Parking" signage in the parking lots of both of these stores. This morning I've spoken with the managers of both stores, and both stated that First Pro has changed their Overnight RV Parking policy due to abuse by RVers. ...

This morning I've received an email from the property management company. They cited the following reasons for banning Overnight RV Parking:

• Local campgrounds complaining to municipal governments.
• Increased liability & resulting recommendations from insurers that Overnight RV Parking not be allowed.
• Instances of RVs catching fire in parking lots, with resultant danger to customers and inconvenience to stores & shoppers.
• RVers parking for long periods of time.

We've heard all of these before (except maybe the one about fires).

I'm following up to see if I can get a list of all the shopping centers that this company manages, along with the Overnight RV Parking policy of each. I'll be including those in the Overnight RV Parking database so that RVers who don't want to support RV-Unfriendly businesses will be able to avoid spending any mone at these locations.

[InPursuit]

Originally Posted by jobriant

The Overnight RV Parking privilege, at Walmarts and at other retail stores, continues to erode. There are numerous causes...

Yes there are.
Even beyond the fact that 98% of the "erosion" involves WM stores on lots that belong to someone else who is making those rules.

I believe the examples you cited are more a function of the amazing increase in the raw number of WalMarts than in years past (more stores = more incidents- good or bad); and that more of those stores are being built closer and closer to the bigger cities (but with smaller and tighter lots)... even when WM owns the lot.

The issues today isn't RV'ers or WalMart's... it's the cities and how they draw and maintain these feral cat communities that will abuse and take advantage of any well intentioned kindness.

[Gary - K7GLD]

I'm following up to see if I can get a list of all the shopping centers that this company manages, along with the Overnight RV Parking policy of each. I'll be including those in the Overnight RV Parking database so that RVers who don't want to support RV-Unfriendly businesses will be able to avoid spending any mone at these locations.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and course of reaction - here's mine in regards to the above selection I've outlined in red:

Business ALLOWING RV overnight parking, do so as an added courtesy to their RVing customers - it is NOT a "right" for those customers, merely a courtesy by the business that to them, carries with it at least some additional small degree of risk and liability.

We should be grateful and appreciative of the few merchants who DO allow this, rather than display the same attitude of "entitlement" as seen by some RVers using and abusing that courtesy - and as evident in the statement shown above.

I buy groceries at the local food market - but neither use or EXPECT to use their parking lot for overnight (or LONGER!) RV parking.

The same holds true for where I bank, buy fuel, or get my hair cut - NONE of those allow overnight RV parking - should I boycott those as well - and deliberately attempt to get others to do the same?

Use and appreciate the courtesy provided by the few, in a responsible and judicious manner - but attempt to somehow force, coerce or "punish" those who do not? THAT, to me, is EXACTLY the misguided and selfish attitude that is slowly CAUSING the privilege and courtesy to be removed...

[Always-RVing]

Do you think there is a silent action group with reasons to ban Wal*Mart RV parking and any other free RV parking? Like maybe a group of Campground owners that want RV'ers forced to use them? State and Private?

[Lorna]

Originally Posted by jobriant

...This tiny minority are the ones who cause the problem, and they need to be educated. I wish I knew the best way to accomplish that.

2X4 or baseball bat?

Naw, even that probably wouldn't work. Have you heard much about problems with the folks who park in Sam's Clubs? We prefer Sam's Clubs. Since we have a business membership card, we can go in before the store opens and get coffee/snacks. Sam's Club stores have all seemed so happy for us to park there that I suspect they do not have much in the way of problems with the RVers.

[Lorna]

Originally Posted by Batman_777

Do you think there is a silent action group with reasons to ban Wal*Mart RV parking and any other free RV parking? Like maybe a group of Campground owners that want RV'ers forced to use them? State and Private?

YES! There is a national Campground owners group (National Association of RV Parks and Campgrounds) that tells their members how to get the bans put in place. It used to be on their website but after a link was placed online in the RV forums to the page for the How-To, it was jerked.

[stearn]

Very sad to hear that a few bone heads can ruin such a good thing !! Sadly they probably don't have a clue of how disrepectful they are. One would think security would uphold their co rules, thus educating OVERNIGHTING VS/ CAMPING. I understand thats extra burden on the store, but some folks just need to be told. Stopping in a secure location while traveling is a nice option, would hate to loose the option. We have not overnighted that often , but I do know folks that do stop to get a few hours rest en route .

[Possum]

Originally Posted by Batman_777

Do you think there is a silent action group with reasons to ban Wal*Mart RV parking and any other free RV parking? Like maybe a group of Campground owners that want RV'ers forced to use them? State and Private?

Being the RV camp site owners pay a higher municipal tax than a business pays on a parking lot I can see their concern. I would much rather stay at an RV park than a Walmart but that's me. How would you like to see unfair competition to your chosen line of work? I can see it both ways but boondocking in the main business core is not my cup of tea.

[chiefdave]

It was just a matter of time before this situation happened. You can’t trust John Q Public to keep a good thing going. I have always asked at the customer service center if overnight parking is permitted, even though most of the time we call ahead and ask permission prior to arriving. I have always noted the person’s name that approved our stay just in case I was asked for any reason. While parked where we are told to, we open the small curbside slides to limit the amount of room we take as well only run the generator to charge our batteries prior to resting for the evening. We always stay for the night and always leave in the morning. I do however continually see RV’s and fifth wheels with all their slides out, once even with their jacks down, and many times with no regards for fellow RVers or Wal-Mart shoppers. To show our consideration, we always purchase food for a quick dinner and other items we need for our trip. I use Wal-Marts because they are convenient and honestly I think its great business practice for them. We normally spend what we would have spent staying in a campground but with out having to worry about all the hassles setting up. I have always known that the campground associations was trying their best to stop this practice but I knew it would ultimately stop because of the irresponsibly of my fellow campers. It was a great deal while it lasted.