TT vs 5th wheel?

[memilanuk]

We've gone from 24' TT to a 31' TT... kinda decided that it's a bit longer than we like maneuvering around (though the interior space is nice!), combined with getting frustrated with public camp sites being full/waiting-list more and more frequently. So we're starting to look at weaning ourselves off the full-hookup sites, and moving towards more dry-camping and/or boondocking.



Along those lines, we've been looking pretty hard at shorter 5th wheels (<30') under the notion that they should have about the same (or a little more) interior room as what we have now, but a little shorter over all length and that 5'vers are supposed to turn tighter, etc. for getting into weird spots.



I've seen some posts in different places that seemed to indicate that 5th wheels may have problems with the bottom of the nose contacting the bed rails of the truck while maneuvering over rough / uneven terrain, like what we would expect to see in some of the places we'd like to go dry camping (4wd strongly recommended).



Given that I've managed to scrape off the right rear stabilizer on this 31' TT already (dang thing hangs down lower and sits further back than the electric stabs on the 24' we had) while negotiating some turns on uneven roads, I'm a little gun-shy about banging up the trailer nose and/or truck bed! At least the stabilizer is cheap/easy to replace...


How 'real' is the advantage of the 5th wheel units as far as getting into / out of tight camp sites? How serious is the risk of smacking the truck bed rails with the nose of the trailer while negotiating uneven ground? Are there other factors one way or the other that are worth considering



Thanks!

[Searching_Ut]

Welcome to the forums. I didn't see what area you're in, but will offer my two cents worth regarding boondocking. It's an area where you may find issues similar to finding sites in many areas. Here in the Utah/Idaho area where I do the majority of my camping, they are rapidly closing off many areas to boondocking, and having just gone to another land use meeting, I expect huge areas of the southern Utah area to close in the next couple years.



Hitting the bedrails with the nose of the 5er is largely affected by how much clearance you set up when you initially set up your hitch and pin box. the more clearance, the less likely you are to hit, but lot's of nose clearance often causes trailer level issues. I've found I start dragging parts of my fifth wheel before bedrail clearance becomes an issue with the 7.5 inches I currently have. Another thing to consider is how much rough/dirt road you intend to drive. I bought and used on Outdoors RV Timber Ridge for a couple years because it was supposedly designed better for off road use. If anything, it fell apart slightly worse due to the twisting/vibrating etc. than several other RV's I've owned. No matter what, any significant time on rough roads is hard on an RV, so expect issues if you do too many rough road miles or severe twisting and rocking very often.


Finally, I personally find a bumper pull to be slightly more maneuverable than a fifth wheel in tight areas, but it's somewhat hard to compare as the behavior/tracking is different, and length behind the truck tends to be different. I don't really see one as being superior to the other, just different.

[astrocamper]

The other disadvantage of fifth wheels is the overall height. If you are pull it down a road with tree limbs the extra height may be a problem if you are towing the tallest RV down that road.

[guten tag]

Seems that a bumper pull with an articulating hitch and the right trailer will go anywhere that your truck can, and a 5th wheel won't keep up with the right combo.

[Mtn. Lion]

Originally Posted by Searching_Ut

Welcome to the forums. I didn't see what area you're in, but will offer my two cents worth regarding boondocking. It's an area where you may find issues similar to finding sites in many areas. Here in the Utah/Idaho area where I do the majority of my camping, they are rapidly closing off many areas to boondocking, and having just gone to another land use meeting, I expect huge areas of the southern Utah area to close in the next couple years.

Name the last 5 areas in UT now closed to boondocking.

[memilanuk]

Originally Posted by guten tag

Seems that a bumper pull with an articulating hitch and the right trailer will go anywhere that your truck can, and a 5th wheel won't keep up with the right combo.

Well, I wasn't planning on getting quite *that* off-road just yet

Though I do have to wonder... how well do those articulating hitches work with weight-distribution and anti-sway bars, for the road trip *to* the tight/rough stuff?

[Searching_Ut]

Originally Posted by diginomad

Name the last 5 areas in UT now closed to boondocking.

We probably shouldn't hijack this thread with this particular discussion, but if you google "Moab area camping restrictions" you'll find links to maps that show some of the recent closures in that area. They just added quite a few not showing on the maps yet. The Monticello BLM office will show you similar on maps, but they don't have any online yet I'm aware of as that area is in rapid flux.


The main thing limiting/restricting Boondocking for us RV'ers are the vehicle travel/use maps that were mandated for government land managers to produce back in 2005 or so. The maps didn't start coming out till several years later. The forest service districts in Utah pretty much standardized at dispersed camping had to be within 150 feet of the centerline of a road designated for dispersed camping. Northern Utah designates by road number, southern Utah as a general rule allows along all forest service roads unless specifically prohibited. The issue is, many of the logging and mining roads as well as the spurs people are boondocking off of aren't designated on the use map, thus not legal to boondock or drive on legally, let alone use to get the RV to the spot. Enforcement, varies greatly, with not being enforced at this time being the generally rule.


BLM land has the same basic requirements, but are less clear and do vary by area as to how far off a designated road you can be. The Kanab office for instance was allowing up to 300 feet for awhile, I'm not sure what it is now. Enforcement has been non existent until recently. Having just returned from the San Rafael swell area, and talking to folks in the Price office however this will change a lot in the next few months/years. Due to passage of the "Dingell Natural Resources Act" earlier this year, most of the southern Utah BLM land managers are re-doing their motor vehicle use maps, tightening up as required, and of course closing off the hundreds of thousands of acres now designated wilderness. On the plus side Goblin valley state park will be able to expand the state park area. On the downside, much of the land around it where I used to boondock will now be closed off to motor vehicle use. Significant changes are required throughout much of southern Utah.


Back to the original subject. With my Timber Ridge, and a Dodge Ram 3/4 ton I would take off my equalizer bars on rough roads. While the hitch was 18 inches off the ground, it still drug from time to time, as did the aft of the trailer. Biggest issue though was washboard roads. They just tend to vibrate things apart no matter what speed you try to drive. Also, keep in mind that if the sugar somehow falls out of the cupboard and gets all over it's your fault in your wife's eye. Same goes for all the stuff that gets scattered everywhere in the fridge. RV's really aren't designed for even a moderately rough dirt road.

[twogypsies]

BLM boondocking is in jeopardy because of campers not taking care of these lands. We've seen a lot of misuse on these beautiful lands.

https://cronkitenews.azpbs.org/2019/...-camping-utah/

OP: We've traveled the roads with our 27' travel trailer; 33' 5th wheel and 40' motorhome. We never had any issues with any type. However, we don't do hard core roads. There are plenty of options otherwise and we just took our driving vehicles to get back farther and explore.

[Mtn. Lion]

Originally Posted by Searching_Ut

We probably shouldn't hijack this thread with this particular discussion, but if you google "Moab area camping restrictions" you'll find links to maps that show some of the recent closures in that area. They just added quite a few not showing on the maps yet. The Monticello BLM office will show you similar on maps, but they don't have any online yet I'm aware of as that area is in rapid flux.

Google it and stay on topic?

[guten tag]

Originally Posted by Searching_Ut

RV's really aren't designed for even a moderately rough dirt road.

There's always hope https://youtu.be/r2CyDo65YOw

[bearman512]

Originally Posted by memilanuk

We've gone from 24' TT to a 31' TT... kinda decided that it's a bit longer than we like maneuvering around (though the interior space is nice!), combined with getting frustrated with public camp sites being full/waiting-list more and more frequently. So we're starting to look at weaning ourselves off the full-hookup sites, and moving towards more dry-camping and/or boondocking.



Along those lines, we've been looking pretty hard at shorter 5th wheels (<30') under the notion that they should have about the same (or a little more) interior room as what we have now, but a little shorter over all length and that 5'vers are supposed to turn tighter, etc. for getting into weird spots.



I've seen some posts in different places that seemed to indicate that 5th wheels may have problems with the bottom of the nose contacting the bed rails of the truck while maneuvering over rough / uneven terrain, like what we would expect to see in some of the places we'd like to go dry camping (4wd strongly recommended).



Given that I've managed to scrape off the right rear stabilizer on this 31' TT already (dang thing hangs down lower and sits further back than the electric stabs on the 24' we had) while negotiating some turns on uneven roads, I'm a little gun-shy about banging up the trailer nose and/or truck bed! At least the stabilizer is cheap/easy to replace...


How 'real' is the advantage of the 5th wheel units as far as getting into / out of tight camp sites? How serious is the risk of smacking the truck bed rails with the nose of the trailer while negotiating uneven ground? Are there other factors one way or the other that are worth considering



Thanks!

I have a Starcraft 24RKS that is 26' from the front of hitch to the back of the spare tire. I have at least 18" of clearance below the steps in the rear and with them positioned just behind the back tire I have never dragged the rear of the trailer. I have come close to bumping the bed but with an anderson Gooseneck Adapter I can move the ball up or down about 4" giving me the correct distance and no need to worry about twisting the 5th wheel pin box on really extreme angles.

[Pyropete]

Originally Posted by Searching_Ut

Welcome to the forums. I didn't see what area you're in, but will offer my two cents worth regarding boondocking. It's an area where you may find issues similar to finding sites in many areas. Here in the Utah/Idaho area where I do the majority of my camping, they are rapidly closing off many areas to boondocking, and having just gone to another land use meeting, I expect huge areas of the southern Utah area to close in the next couple years.

That's so sad. Hopefully in 5-10 years when I am in your area I will have sufficient land to use :(

[Mtn. Lion]

Originally Posted by Pyropete

That's so sad. Hopefully in 5-10 years when I am in your area I will have sufficient land to use :(

Don't let the fearmongers get to you. I'm in South UT now and there are more dispersed camping places and relaxed stay limits than anywhere I've been. There is plenty of land to enjoy here now and in the future.

[tarheel21]

Originally Posted by Searching_Ut

Hitting the bedrails with the nose of the 5er is largely affected by how much clearance you set up when you initially set up your hitch and pin box. the more clearance, the less likely you are to hit, but lot's of nose clearance often causes trailer level issues.

I had the recommended clearance between truck and nose sitting level but could touch bed rail or get scary close when maneuvering in tight spots with sloped shoulders on road. If the front wheels of truck found the slope the back end came up to meet the FW pretty quickly. What I found (after making contact a couple times) was I had the solution at hand but wasn't using it.

A manual sliding hitch in the 'maneuver' position will put the pin/hitch back far enough that I never came close to touching bed rail again. Also, I find it MUCH easier to get in/out of tight spots with hitch slid back. YMMV but the manual sliding FW hitch is a huge plus on uneven surfaces. I never turned so extreme to need it to prevent cab window contact but it pretty much takes that out of play as well.