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-   -   Tireminder TPMS (http://www.irv2.com/forums/f84/tireminder-tpms-77319.html)

moldmkr 10-15-2010 10:56 AM

Tireminder TPMS
 
I see Camping World has the Tireminder TPMS system on sale. There is only 1 review on their web sight and it was all good. Does anyone else have any experience with this system. Any information pro or con would be appreciated. I like the idea of being able to replace the batteries on the valve stem pieces. The price is also very reasonable.

Thank you in advance for your input

OneRVer 10-15-2010 10:01 PM

Just remember, as far as temperature is concerned, you are only reading the outside temperature of the valve stem which is surrounded by out side air.

Very misleading when they state reading of the tire temperature.

In order to receive a true tire temperature you must have a temperature sensor in contact with the tire. Not the valve stem. :nonono:

AFChap 10-16-2010 10:17 AM

Quote:

you are only reading the outside temperature of the valve stem which is surrounded by out side air.
That is NOT a true statement.
Quote:

Very misleading when they state reading of the tire temperature
Is that the claim? ...don't know whether it is or not, but it does in fact read the tire's inside air temp much better than your statement implies. Regardless of exactly where the inside air temp reading is coming from, the main point is that you have a reference temp, and if one tire is reading considerably hotter than another you might want to figure out why. Some folks have reported finding hot wheel bearings after experiencing an elevated temp from this type of TPMS sensor. My right front toad tire nearly always reads a bit warmer than the others ...both with the TPMS sensor AND with an infrared thermometer ...and I have concluded the elevated temp is due to the diesel exhaust directly in front of that tire.

I used the TST system for 8 months before I gave up on it, and now use the Tire Traker system ...both have this type of temp sensor (Tire Traker is Tireminder under another same, as is Hawkshead also). At each stop, I also read tire sidewall temp (or tread temp on rear duals) with an infrared thermometer. The sensor temp reading is not quite at hot as the sidewall temp, but it definitely is higher than the surrounding air temp.

At this point, I am happy with the the performance of the TireTraker system. You can read more of my experience with TPMS systems on my web page at Tire Date Codes/Tire Care

OneRVer 10-16-2010 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AFChap (Post 719173)
The sensor temp reading is not quite at hot as the sidewall temp, but it definitely is higher than the surrounding air temp.

Thank you. You proven my point. :) And if you take your IR gun and measure the tire surface you will have even a higher temperature.

If my wheel is getting hot I want to know at that instance. Not wait for the end of the valve stem to get hot. :nonono:

Plain and simple it is false advertising. No where does it say "temperature reference". They claim that an alarm will go off the when the tire temperature exceeds 167 degrees F. Not true, when the valve stem temperature exceed 167 degrees F. :banghead:

By the time your valve stem is exceeding 167 degrees F, your tires will be far more then 200 degrees F. JMHO

AFChap 10-16-2010 01:13 PM

Quote:

By the time your valve stem is exceeding 167 degrees F, your tires will be far more then 200 degrees F. JMHO
In my humble experience, your humble opinion is wrong again! I said the sensor reported temp is "not quite" as hot as the infrared reported sidewall temp ..I did NOT say it is SIGNIFICANTLY different. A few days ago on my toad one tire was showing 122 degrees ...and that is not at all unusual. I know from experience the sidewall temp would not be over 130, and probably will be less, and the tread temp likely WILL be less. I do not see differences of more than 10 degrees or so between the two methods. If one tire shows 122 when all others are 70 or 80, that tells me there likely is a problem.

As difficult as it apparently is for some people to believe, the air inside the tire ...even in the valve stem ...is a reliable, and early enough to help, indicator of a possible overheated tire. It is just one more indicator for you to consider. If you don't like the idea, fine. But it does work much better than your humble opinion thinks it should! :)

OneRVer 10-16-2010 03:05 PM

Chap, I understand what you are replying. However you are not understanding what I am saying. No problem. Let me try to explain a little better.

Engine temperature is being monitored by a sensor installed into the cooling water inside the thermostat housing. Engine oil temperature is being monitored by a sensor that is installed directly in the oil inside the oil pan. Transmission temperature is being monitored by a sensor installed in-line in the transmission oil.

Notice that all sensor are install into its medium. Not on the housing, pan or hose.

Why? In-order to receive a true temperature the transducer must be in direct contact with whatever medium to be measured.

Now, to have a true reading of the tire you should have a sensor stuck into the (rubber) tire. Since this is not feasible, the next step would to have the sensor attached on the inside to the tire. If that is not feasible, the next step would be a sensor mounted to the rim.

Smartire tpms is the closest monitoring system that will give you a truest reading of your tire temperature.

Now back to the Tiremonitor. As stated before this temperature sensor in mounted inside a cap that is screw on the threads of the valve stem.

With this being said, would you please tell me where I am wrong in my statement.

If I am giving out bad infor I would like to know. No problem.

So the point of this whole discussion; Tireminder claims they measure the temperature of the tire.

I claim that is false, they only measure the temperature of the valve stem.

You claim that it is close to the tire temperature. However, that is not what Tireminder claims.

AFChap 10-16-2010 07:43 PM

I've never read what the Tireminder claims, so I went to their website. I see they claim up front to "monitor tire pressure and temperature" ...and later on "Temperature alarm if temperature rises above 167f/75c". The first statement does say "tire...temperature," so if you presume that means exact temperature of the rubber then I agree a sensor on the valve stem will not report that. But neither, I doubt, will a sensor that is attached to the metal wheel. If a wheel bearing is bad and the wheel gets hot, won't the wheel itself be hotter than the rubber, except perhaps where the rubber touches the wheel? It that internal sensor is measuring the temp of the air BESIDE the metal wheel, how is that much different than measuring the temp of the air inside the valve stem? I guess Tireminder should say they monitor the air temperature inside the valve stem ...but when I read that their sensors mounts on the end of the valve stem, I just presume that is what they mean when they say they monitor "tire temperature."

I guess the whole question is, "what temp should a tire be?" ...and I think the answer is, "Well, it depends."

For instance, when I check a tire with my infrared thermometer, on any one tire, after driving, I will get one temperature reading on the bead, another on the sidewall, another on top of the tread, and another in a tread valley. So the temp of the tire depends on where exactly on the tire you are measuring the temp.

I don't believe the point of temp monitors is so you can know the exact temp of tire ...or even the approximate temp. I don't really care what temp my tires are ...but I DO care if one is significantly hotter than another tire in a similar position. I expect the two front tires to be similar to one another in temp, the outer duals to be similar, the inner duals to be similar, the toad fronts to be similar, and the toad rears to be similar. If any one tire, or pair of tires, it significantly different in temp from tires in a similar position, THAT is what I care about. And ANY temp sensor can do that job ...even a wireless thermometer taped to each tire if that is how I want to do it.

The temp sensor on the cap reports temps better than I would expect it to, based on the small volume of air in the tiny, relatively long, valve stem. IT WOULD BE INTERESTING TO PUT BOTH AN INTERNAL SENSOR AND A VALVE STEM SENSOR ON THE SAME TIRE AND SEE WHAT EACH REPORTS.

But when it comes right down to the basics, it really doesn't make much matter since temperature DIFFERENCES are much more important here than EXACT temperature. I don't know about you, but I certainly am not going to wait for a tire to hit 167 or 200 degrees (regardless of WHAT sensor system I am using) before I stop to find out why it is significantly hotter than the other tires that are running probably around 125 degrees or lower.

OneRVer 10-16-2010 09:01 PM

Very well said. I agree with you 100%. If you have the temp sensor mounted to the rim, you will know sooner if the brakes are dragging or your bearing's are going bad.

I very much enjoyed our conversation. This is why we need forum's like this on.

wddogger 01-18-2011 03:26 PM

Paul -

I read your website Tire Date Codes/Tire Care with interest since I am new to RVing and have been considering a tire temp/pressure monitoring system like TPMS or Hawkshead. I noted in particular your photos and comments re valve stems and centrifugal force. Would you kindly provide installation details about such systems, particularly the sensor/transmitters. I can understand the "Let Us Install It" price Camping World is charging for the Tireminder Hard-Wired Signal Booster but the basic monitor/display is powered by built-in Lithium batteries which are rechargable from a cigarette lighter plug-in charger and the sensor/transmitters are described as being a simple screw-on instal to the valve stem or extender tube. Am I missing something that would justify the "installation prices" Camping World is charging?

I just purchased and installed a new set of six Michelin tires and would hate to have them damaged due to a valve stem failure related to centrifugal force.

Michelin had this to say in their RV TIRE GUIDE about stem extension hoses, "If you use valve stem extension hoses, make sure they are good quality stainless steel braid reinforced and are securely anchored to the outer wheel."

I presume they (Michelin) are concerned about the effect of centrifugal force acting on the extender hoses. Wouldn't the added weight of the sensor/transmitters only add to (magnify) the centrifugal forces? In short, should transmitter/extender assemblies be firmly secured to the wheels in some manner as Michelin advises?

I am aware that solid metal extenders are also available in a variety of configurations and am inclined to use them as opposed to the flexible extender "hoses" Michelin refers to.
Any comments/details/advice you can provide would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

AFChap 01-18-2011 04:58 PM

I see no reason to pay anything at all to have the sensors installed ...particularly what Camping World is likely to charge!! Installation of the valve-stem mounted sensors is just a tiny bit harder than installing a valve cap. :) ...the only difference is that you have to follow the inializing procedure for the TPMS at each tire ...a very simple procedure on the TireMinder. Before installing the sensors, you will want to ensure the tires are inflated to the recommended pressure (tire mfg'er chart for your model tire and the weight you are carrying on that tire). The set-up procedure is very simple, and you need to know how to do that anyway in case you need to make changes/adjustments down the line.

The TireMinder sensors are very small/light, but any weight at all magnifies the effect of centrifugal force on the valve stem. The only cracked metal stem I have experienced happened with a normal valve cap in place before I bought a TPMS ...and when I had that stem replaced the tire service place recommended the stabilizers and GAVE me a set at no cost to me. If your inner duals have extensions ...if they are flexible/hose type the end with the sensor on it does need to be securely mounted to the wheel somehow. If the extensions are solid metal, it would be good if you could find the rubber stabilizers for your particular wheels ...they can be hard to find. I ordered my last set online.

Most TPMS mfg'ers recommend metal stems on the toad/trailer tires but I have not found any for my Honda. My rubber stems are very short, and so far have not been a problem.

Hope that is helpful!!

caymann 01-23-2011 09:27 AM

After trying two different TPMS on the valve step i decided the best thing to do is to pony up and get smartire. Never been happier. By the time i bought and sold two different systems, i spent about the same money if i had smartire the first time. Oh well, live and learn. My conclusion, the valve stems are all TPMS wannabees. You get what you pay for. Furthermore all OEM TPMS installations (such as in a car) have sensors inside the tire.


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