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Old 11-22-2021, 02:52 PM   #15
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For all owners that are going to be taking dealer delivery, I highly recommend that you get a 3rd party inspection.

The advantage of this report is you will have a very detailed list of the items to be corrected, and it gives your dealer more time to focus on resolving items instead of looking for them.

Even with a professional inspection, I strongly recommend that you do your own inspection of the 3 major areas I outlined above: PAINT, WOOD, TILE
I have been an advocate of having new RVs inspected for the past few years. I will add to make sure the inspector is "NRVIA Certified" because that adds a level of credibility to the inspector's findings. As a lawyer friend told me, "If you think, act, and document like you're preparing to go to court, you greatly reduce the likelihood that you will need to."
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Old 11-22-2021, 03:07 PM   #16
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RVIA certification is definitely a minimum qualification.


When you are preparing the documentation, keep in mind that the person you are making the case to only sees what you put in front of them. Telling the story, and supplying pictures that better explain the story is a key factor in getting your work approved.


With proper documentation, I have never had a problem getting work completed. Sometimes it takes a few round trips of emails to clarify and change wording or picture angles to make sure it is clear to the reader, but once done properly, that documentation is used for all phases of the repair process, from approval, to requisition of parts, and finally for scheduling and implementation.
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Old 11-22-2021, 03:09 PM   #17
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redbaron73,
That is one helluva report. You must have spent a lot of time putting all that information together. I probably could not have put together such an extensive report myself.

As for as Newmar goes I can't give a lot of information on quality as I do not have one of their newer models. I must have gotten mine before quality control went down hill. I have a 2016 VTDP 3725 and I have had very few problems with it. I have had some minor issues but nothing big time. I think Newmar knew years before we did that they would be purchased by Winnebago. There is a possibility that is where the quality starting going down hill. Nothing to do with Winnebago QC, as I think they have excellent coaches too. When you are faced with the unknown, things just don't work like they should. With everyones input I think Newmar will get it all worked out. They are a great company and I think they will continue to be.

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Old 11-22-2021, 03:26 PM   #18
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redbaron73,
That is one helluva report. You must have spent a lot of time putting all that information together. I probably could not have put together such an extensive report myself.

As for as Newmar goes I can't give a lot of information on quality as I do not have one of their newer models. I must have gotten mine before quality control went down hill. I have a 2016 VTDP 3725 and I have had very few problems with it. I have had some minor issues but nothing big time. I think Newmar knew years before we did that they would be purchased by Winnebago. There is a possibility that is where the quality starting going down hill. Nothing to do with Winnebago QC, as I think they have excellent coaches too. When you are faced with the unknown, things just don't work like they should. With everyones input I think Newmar will get it all worked out. They are a great company and I think they will continue to be.

JMcG
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I think this nails the sentiment for most new coach buyers. It all started with the fact that we don't know what affect WGO will have on Newmar quality. It's has ballooned into the unproven track record now going forward with COVID, Labor, WGO purchase, CEO leaving, and CEO#2 leaving that has new coach buyers like me on EDGE over this HUGE purchase. It's a tough time for everyone in the industry, but I will not let apathy pass as acceptable when we need something to look forward to and rely on as a whole.

We just don't know, but we can learn and be positive.
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Old 11-22-2021, 04:39 PM   #19
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I think this nails the sentiment for most new coach buyers. It all started with the fact that we don't know what affect WGO will have on Newmar quality. It's has ballooned into the unproven track record now going forward with COVID, Labor, WGO purchase, CEO leaving, and CEO#2 leaving that has new coach buyers like me on EDGE over this HUGE purchase. It's a tough time for everyone in the industry, but I will not let apathy pass as acceptable when we need something to look forward to and rely on as a whole.

We just don't know, but we can learn and be positive.

Here is my thought on the situation.


Newmar needs units out the door in order to keep employees paid and to keep the lights on. Just to break even, there is a minimum amount of sales that must take place. Once that threshold is crossed, then profits start coming in.


Supply chain issues and the general craziness that has ensued has put a lot of pressure on the Just-In-Time delivery model that newmar depends on. If a coach sits on their lot 95% complete, newmar has been billed for all of the components by their supplier, but has not been paid by the dealer. This will impact cash flow.



If units are not moving to dealers, then profits are not being booked. This impacts year end bonuses, normal payroll, etc.



Bottom line, there is a huge push to get units out the door "at all costs", including shipping of coaches that are not complete.



I am certain you are going to see some coaches being delivered with an attached "We Owe you" statement at closing. Most likely this will be minor things that can be easily added like furnishing, outdoor refrigerators, etc. We won't see a coach shipped with a missing window, but we may see one shipped with a window that is chipped or scratched.


With the push to get coaches out the door, every part of the build process is being discouraged from taking extra time.



If you take this new push to get coaches out the door and add in that most customers won't even notice the problems up front, you can see why we are in this position.


I do not see that WGO has had a negative impact on owners. In fact, I think the opposite is true. I believe that supply chain issues and demand are the reason quality has suffered, and once Newmar is aware, they will come up with a solution and continue to revolutionize the industry.
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Old 11-22-2021, 04:44 PM   #20
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Thanks Redbaron73 for all the hard work preparing this! Just the right tone, direct but polite.
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Old 11-22-2021, 06:59 PM   #21
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I will never understand how they can let some of the units leave the manufacture with obvious defects. I was just at the dealer getting my windows inspected and noticed all the coaches overflowing on the lot. The repair person told me they are waiting 6 to 8 weeks for repair parts and some are much longer than that. So maybe the manufacturer would rather let them sit on the dealers lot lot. It is sad to pay a lot of money for these units and not be able to use them for 2 months or longer. Just a noter on PDI - make sure to bring a ladder so you can inspect the upper portion of the units.
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Old 11-22-2021, 09:40 PM   #22
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Thanks Redbaron73. I would have never thought to look for this stuff even though I've had to deal with some similar problems on our current coach. We have had so much fun with our first 2 1/2 years of coach ownership we are thinking of upgrading to something nicer. Newmar is high on out list but we'll be buying used that is several years old and hopefully before these problems started.

We bought our current coach used and I've had to reposition several doors and latches so things would open & close properly. I guess the previous owner didn't care.
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Old 11-22-2021, 11:38 PM   #23
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Blaming Newmar is have the equation. When you pick up the RV you should do a detailed inspection before signing off. If it does not meet your expecting standards walk away. Now if you sign the dotted line you are in for the ride. I inspected my rig for 4 hours and found a number of things including a non working ac. I did not sign a thing till it was fixed. When I was happy with the standards I aligned all the paper work except the overly expensive warranty and went on my have way. Just remember it's your money and your responsibility to ensure it's what you want. So take your time and press all the buttons and try every thing first. This is a new brave world we are in.
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Old 11-23-2021, 06:23 AM   #24
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Blaming Newmar is have the equation.
I totally disagree. They should leave the plant with ZERO defects. The stuff they are shipping with all the obvious defects is UNACCEPTABLE.
I bought a Newmar because it was supposed to be a top of the line coach. Turns out the QC was no better than a Jayco.
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Old 11-23-2021, 06:45 AM   #25
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Documentation is the most important thing. Having an understanding with your dealer, but also full documentation sent by you to Newmar with a case number assigned.

Let newmar know that you are doing your PDI, and you do not want to leave the dealership without acknowledgment of your items submitted. You may not have newmar approval, but that does not matter as long as they acknowledge receipt of your claim. The process today is about 1 week from time of submission to approval.
redbaron73 ... just making sure I understand this. So, if there are any items that the dealer cannot address, I need to have a claim in writing approved by Newmar before leaving the dealership ... or at least proof that I have reported them to Newmar. Where/who/how should I send this information to Newmar?

Just trying to be ready when the time comes.

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Old 11-23-2021, 06:59 AM   #26
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Arm yourself with a well put together PDI checklist and don't be distracted by the beauty/newness/etc of the coach. Thats the best advice I have given anyone. It's just like when you have a house built, you will have a punch list of items that will need to be addressed.

As far as finding paint defects, pretend you are hand washing the coach and inspect it from that angle.. Most folks never hand wash their coach and when they finally do a year down the road, they start finding small defects such as clear coat runs that are not difficult to remedy.. Key to point out that I would prefer to have excess clear coat than not enough ...

Happy Thanksgiving!
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Old 11-23-2021, 08:15 AM   #27
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Key to point out that I would prefer to have excess clear coat than not enough ...
This is not correct!

Too much paint will cause internal stress on the coating over time and become brittle. This will result in cracking and delamination of the area that has excessive coating. At the coating ages it will continue to cure and lose plasticity and the ability to flex. Too much coating will increase the stress beyond what it was designed to handle.

This is why you should address runs in the clearcoat as soon as possible while the coating is still "green" from application.
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Old 11-23-2021, 08:18 AM   #28
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redbaron73 ... just making sure I understand this. So, if there are any items that the dealer cannot address, I need to have a claim in writing approved by Newmar before leaving the dealership ... or at least proof that I have reported them to Newmar. Where/who/how should I send this information to Newmar?



Just trying to be ready when the time comes.



FLSteve
You need to have it documented with lots of pictures and clear description of the problem. Then call your newmar rep in the window of your coach and inform them that you are taking delivery and have found problems that you need to get repaired under warranty.

The rep will want you to send the information and should confirm the receipt.

A follow up discussion to verify clarity of the issues would be a good idea.

The severity of your issues will dictate the next step. It might involve a service appointment at the factory, another dealer, or a mobile service. That will be something for you and your rep to discuss.

Do not expect an approval before you leave. Just expect a confirmation of clarity and submission of your items.

The most important item to address before leaving is the paint chips and swirls. After pulling out if the driveway, your case will be exponentially higher to prove.
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