RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > THE OWNER'S CORNER FORUMS > Newmar Owner's Forum
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-30-2014, 03:35 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Canton, MI
Posts: 656
Bird system

Chassis battery became drained (not completely dead) even though coach was plugged in and use/store button was in use position. Recharged the chassis batteries with a battery charger and checked voltage after complete recharge and chassis battery voltage was 12.7 and house battery read 13.4 which makes sense because it was plugged in to shore power. After one week while still plugged in chassis battery voltage down to 12.4. Doesn't, appear that the bird system is charging chassis batteries. Searched this forum and many comments said it could be the isolator relay. However not sure how to trouble shoot. Any help would be appreciated.


Thanks
__________________

__________________
Tigerfan1

2016 DSDP 4369, Freightliner Chassis, AF One brake system, 2016 Chevy Equinox
Tigerfan1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 06-30-2014, 04:40 PM   #2
Member
 
Dave.O's Avatar
 
Newmar Owners Club
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 66
Tigerfan1 - I am having the same exact problem - intermittently. I think it is in the Bird. Purchased a replacement. Easy to change out. Have not done yet. Wouldn't ya know......as soon as I get ready to change, it starts working again and then I put it off. Will be interesting to see what others have to say.

Dave
__________________

__________________
2007 Newmar Essex 4502
Dave.O is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 05:21 PM   #3
Community Moderator
 
"007"'s Avatar


 
Nor'easters Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 30,118
In QT's # 3 you will find this and also this for small solar panel on roof.
Where it maybe located in your coach.
Parts if needed.
I
"007" is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 05:25 PM   #4
Member
 
johnsadventure's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Marble, NC
Posts: 63
My 2014 Canyon Star needed a new 7.5 volt fuse in the bird box and the dealer changed the bird relay to be shure the problem was solved. It works great now.
__________________
2014 Newmar Caynon Star 3956, Ford V10 Michelin 22.5", Roadmaster Tow Dolly
2010 Toyota Venza, Live in North Carolina
johnsadventure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 09:11 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Canton, MI
Posts: 656
Bird system

Is ther a way to trouble shoot the Bird or solenoids with a volt meter to determine if the may be defective causing the chassis batteries not to be charged? Thanks for the other posts.
__________________
Tigerfan1

2016 DSDP 4369, Freightliner Chassis, AF One brake system, 2016 Chevy Equinox
Tigerfan1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 09:30 PM   #6
Community Moderator
 
"007"'s Avatar


 
Nor'easters Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 30,118
Did you read this link to the end explains the Bird and the solenoids at end of link.
__________________
98KSCA, 99MACA, 03 KSCA-3740- 8.1 Chev-- ALLISON Trans
VISIT the NEWMAR QUICK TIPS & EASYMODS 1 & 2
QUICK TIPS # 3
RV SYSTEMS & APPLIANCES & RECALLS --- TECH INFORMATION
"007" is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 09:49 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Canton, MI
Posts: 656
Bird

Did read the thread, saw the info on trouble shooting the battery disconnect but didn't see anything about trouble shooting the bird unless I missed it.
__________________
Tigerfan1

2016 DSDP 4369, Freightliner Chassis, AF One brake system, 2016 Chevy Equinox
Tigerfan1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 10:31 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Skip426's Avatar


 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Powell River, B.C.
Posts: 18,637
My system Bird is working fine , and I'm glad I read this because I miss-understood the operation.
I believe the trouble shooting , would involve , tests at the wiring on the BIRD connectors, first zero ohms to ground on the ground connector.
With the coach plugged in, full coach battery charge voltage at the terminal, check at the batteries then the wire connection( coach batteries ) MUST be over 13.1 and take into account the delay, before the controller activates the relay.
Engine running , alt output voltage at both sets of batteries, & the ignition feed.
Gen set running , charge voltage at the coach batteries over 13.1 volts and again at the controller, coach battery terminal. Don't forget the delay.
My miss-understanding was , I thought the system looked for fully charged coach batteries , not just over 13.1v charging applied.
The possibility of a modern step down charging system dropping below the 13.1v threshold , exists so if the system stops charging the chassis batteries after a few days, you need to know the lowest output of your charging system. My wiring has no generator input wired to the control , the system is dependant on convertor/charger output to the coach batteries, to activate. Original manual step up 13.2>14.2v charger working fine 15 years later.

Every time you see the same voltage at both sets of batteries , shore power, engine running or gen set , that's the indicator that the isolator relay is operating.
No power , gen set , or engine , you will get slightly different readings.
__________________
99DSDP 3884, Freightliner, XC, CAT 3126B, 300 HP /ALLISON 3060
2000 Caravan toad, Remco & Blue Ox.
Skip426 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 10:47 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Skip426's Avatar


 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Powell River, B.C.
Posts: 18,637
Tigerfan 1 ; I just re-read your original post , and in that case you needed to test for the same 13.4v at the bird terminal, because if you have a poor connection and it only sees 13v it won't activate the relay.
__________________
99DSDP 3884, Freightliner, XC, CAT 3126B, 300 HP /ALLISON 3060
2000 Caravan toad, Remco & Blue Ox.
Skip426 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 11:56 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Canton, MI
Posts: 656
Bird

Skip426 thanks for the reply, please forgive my ignorance with using a volt meter as I am a bit of a novice using one. To check for 13.4 volts at the bird would I put the black lead on a neutral lug like on the battery disconnect and then use the red (pos) lead to check the bird connectors and if so there are four I believe (chassis, ignition, ?, ? can't remember the other two). Would I remove the small wire off the chassis connector and use the red lead on the meter there to check for 13.4 v?

Thanks again for your help as I am trying to identify the defective component rather than just replacing things.
__________________
Tigerfan1

2016 DSDP 4369, Freightliner Chassis, AF One brake system, 2016 Chevy Equinox
Tigerfan1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2014, 12:04 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Skip426's Avatar


 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Powell River, B.C.
Posts: 18,637
If you have a multi meter , and check the ground wiring on the BIRD controller first for zero ohms to the frame of the coach, then you can use that terminal for, ground during the rest of your voltage tests.

Any electronic or electrical component on your coach , always check the grounds first. Doesn't mater how much power you supply to a component if it's not properly grounded it won't work.
__________________
99DSDP 3884, Freightliner, XC, CAT 3126B, 300 HP /ALLISON 3060
2000 Caravan toad, Remco & Blue Ox.
Skip426 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2014, 04:49 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
Qwert66's Avatar
 
Newmar Owners Club
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Michigan
Posts: 875
Send a message via Skype™ to Qwert66
Based on failure modes the first thing that usually goes is the isolator relay switching contacts. This is because under certain conditions it is asked to pass very high amperage upon closing.
Dirt, pitting, varnish, rust, carbon, can all be preset at the contacts causing it to work sometimes but not reliably.
An ohm meter check across the contacts "while its energized" is a simple test for most who can use a DVOM. (digital volt/ohm meter)
To do it; Make sure your charger is on and the coach batteries are fully charged or at least above 13.1 volts. This voltage can be higher. As stated earlier then wait 15 seconds (usually not necessary as the batteries have been above 13.1 for at least 15sec already) then take the meter, set it to ohms and select something around the 200-300 range on the dial. Then take the 2 leads and touch them together to see a 0 in the display. Then place them at the 2 large threaded lugs (doesn't matter which one goes where but DO NOT PLACE 1 LEAD ACROSS BOTH CONTACTS) on the relay with the very large wires coming off.
If the meter is reading 0-7 ohms the relay is working. If the meter reads open with a high number then its either the contacts or the trigger circuit/bird/bad charger/bad batteries/bad ground etc.

I have experienced this same condition of dirty contacts and have been successful at disassembling and cleaning them back to proper function.

It may also be that your chassis batteries are simply worn out and need replacing.
__________________
1999 Newmar Mountain Aire MADP 4080, Cummins ISC 8.3L, Allison, Spartan MM IFS, Howard Power Center, Chev Trailblazer LTZ Towed w/ BlueOx rigging, Segway X2.
www.shaw11.com
Qwert66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2014, 07:39 AM   #13
Community Moderator
 
"007"'s Avatar


 
Nor'easters Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 30,118
Its not to often the Bird has a problem as Skip has explained and others grounds with corrosion, contacts of high arcing need to be cleaned.
Your battery ground cables on chassis frame can cause a problem on older coach if they have not been maintained over the years, wiring connections in your trsnsfer switch with leads to Gen, load center and your shore power line all screw connections clean and tight, stranded wiring will flatten out and become loose from road vibration.
Your 12v fuse panels wiring needs to be checked also. The solar panel on roof link can help with that.
My signature below has many links to other info that will help, this for instance.
__________________
98KSCA, 99MACA, 03 KSCA-3740- 8.1 Chev-- ALLISON Trans
VISIT the NEWMAR QUICK TIPS & EASYMODS 1 & 2
QUICK TIPS # 3
RV SYSTEMS & APPLIANCES & RECALLS --- TECH INFORMATION
"007" is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2014, 04:58 PM   #14
Member
 
Dave.O's Avatar
 
Newmar Owners Club
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 66
Tigerfan1, just changed out the BIRD module. Bada Bing. Problem solved. Chassis batteries charging while plugged in.

Dave
__________________

__________________
2007 Newmar Essex 4502
Dave.O is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Custom Fresh Water Auto-Fill System Dr4Film RV Systems & Appliances 9 12-22-2015 08:22 PM
Erratic BIRD behavior...on shore power litespeed Newmar Owner's Forum 3 05-25-2014 02:54 PM
AC Upgrades - '98 Bounder ducted system Fl_Richard MH-General Discussions & Problems 2 03-29-2014 03:50 PM
Bigfoot Leveling System -- Options VAParrothead Class C Motorhome Discussions 18 01-24-2014 05:23 AM
Infotainment Center GPS System antenna issue ChrisKW Winnebago Industries Owner's Forum 3 01-19-2014 07:56 AM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:00 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×