Do I Have a Lemon or is This RVing?

[twogypsies]

It sounds like many after-market things; not things that Newmar made.

We full-timed in a 2004 Newmar Dutch Star for 8 years traveling constantly. Honestly, we had absolutely no Newmar build issues. We did have to replace the microwave and had our jacks fixed at HWH but those aren't Newmar things.

[Archerwoman]

I would never buy new again. Way to many repairs need to be done and it's very hard to get in and out. Appointments are months away and so are parts. There is no quality control in these new coaches. We gave up a 13 yr old National that was in far better shape and quality than our Newmar.

[NCC-1701A]

Several times a year we stay in a campground by Minneapolis and a couple there that were camp hosts (they are from Florida) had a fairly new Canyon Star and mentioned to me it had lots of issues during their ownership. No details of what all the issues were, but from the tone, I could tell they were not real happy with it.

I had a 2010 Baystar we bought new and kept for 8 years (sometimes I wish we still had it). The genset had an issue pretty much right away and Onan fixed that. They had a bad batch of fuel pumps. The only other issue, which also happened within the first year, was that the opposing sofas and the captain's chairs stitching started coming apart...and we're just part time campers, not fulltimers. Flexsteel took care of all that and even upgraded the foam...all under warranty. Otherwise, it was trouble free and pretty simple. A great coach.

[Jabber Jaw]

Have a 2020 Canyon Star 3710. Did "CPU" at Newmar last October.

Had a hot water heater fitting issue, but was quickly fixed by Newmar techs at the Tampa Super RV Show/Newmar Rally. And one bay door adjustment.

Recently, the front privacy shade motor quit working. Not sure if motor or switch, but Newmar "CS" said it's probably motor. They, Newmar, will replace it when we got to Napanee for service in August! Also need a minor "entry door" adjustment. And a small warranty paint issue!

We love our 3710, & it has almost 5,000 miles on it now.

I do believe the factory "CPU" is the very best thing a Newmar owner can do when ordering/buying a new coach!

Good luck & hope you get your issues resolved!

[777 Driver]

Originally Posted by Jn1edosp

Do I Have a Lemon or is This RVing?

I am ready to trade the RV in for a new 2020 RV but before I do, is this what I can expect with a new 3710 or is my RV just a lemon? Said otherwise, has anyone had as many problems with your Canyon Star or Bay Star as I have had or are my problems representative of long time RVing???

Your saga reminds me of this:

https://youtu.be/LPjGLXYUSeY?t=71

Good luck,
Stu

[Archerwoman]

Prior to owning our Newmar we had a 2007 National Sea Breeze. It was a excellent coach and was in much better shape than our new Newmar. We were shocked with all the repairs that need to be done on a new RV.
Here is just a few things.
4 fogged windows, both front seats replaced, the Jack's quit working on us, 2 holes in the shower, rust and mold everywhere, dip in the roof, paint issues, skylight issues, stove issue, entry door issue, then to top it off we had a huge powder post beetle infestation. It's already been in the shop for 2 months and now we have to drive 1100 miles to get more repairs done and some that the dealership won't do. We will never buy new again.

[Massparanoia]

I bought our 2016 Bay Star Sport new. Had to go to the factory twice for warranty work. The major issue was a crack in the sidewall that they fixed under the structure warranty, and all of my baggage doors were originally fiberglass. They started to delaminate so Newmar replaced them with all new aluminum ones. Those were the only two “Newmar” issues, other things like a dometic ac unit wasn’t really Newmars fault. Ford chassis has been bullet proof. We have about 25k miles on ours now.

[Jn1edosp]

Originally Posted by Jn1edosp

I own a Newmar Canyon Star that was purchased new in 2016 and have had nothing but problems with it since the day I bought it. Initially, it was slide adjustments and a zillion minor things to repair or replace. On the major item side, thank God I bought the extended warranty because the dealer replaced an AC unit, transfer switch, inverter, the fireplace, and central vac and I am on the third transfer switch and inverter. I saw some new Canyon Stars on the dealer’s lots with the seats already “shreading” so this is also a concern. In addition, all of my thermopane windows are fogging. On the positive side, I had Sumo Springs and a Safe-T-Plus steering stabilizer added and the RV drives better than any brand that have road tested so far. The fit and finish of the exterior and interior is absolutely excellent so my gripe is more with the aftermarket component providers than with Newmar.

I am ready to trade the RV in for a new 2020 RV but before I do, is this what I can expect with a new 3710 or is my RV just a lemon? Said otherwise, has anyone had as many problems with your Canyon Star or Bay Star as I have had or are my problems representative of long time RVing???

Thanks everyone for your input. Over the past three months I did extensive research on the Newmar and Tiffen brands and associated service issues. Based on my research of the two brands along with iRV owner feedback on both, I decided to pull the trigger last week on a new 2020 3719 Canyon Star.

Someone will be getting a great used 2016 3710 CS because I spent three and a half years debugging it. The only thing left to address are the FlexSteel DS and PS seats which are starting to peel. As part of the sale, Newmar agreed to repair or replace the seats (for the dealer) and ultimately, the new owner. I already reached out to Newmar Customer Service regarding what to do if the FlexSteel seats on my new coach start peeling and they said to call them and they will address it as with my old coach.

So why am I trading in this "great" coach now that almost everything is fixed? Primarily, because my wife and I are ready for a new floor plan. Our previous RV (Fleetwood Southwind) had the same floor plan as our 3710 and we just got tired of the cramped kitchen / living area caused by the L-shaped seating. In addition there are the number of upgrades that are made to the new models each year that caused us to upgrade to a new coach

Prior to purchase, I spent almost a full day going over the new 2020 CS, from top to bottom, looking for defects, testing each system and test driving it. My expectation is that I will have fewer issues after the sale with my new coach vs. the old one because there is very very little for the dealer to address on the new rig before the sale. I am taking possession on August 21st and haven't gotten much sleep since I made the deal because I can't wait to pick up the new coach.

[Tilzbow]

Originally Posted by twogypsies

It sounds like many after-market things; not things that Newmar made.

We full-timed in a 2004 Newmar Dutch Star for 8 years traveling constantly. Honestly, we had absolutely no Newmar build issues. We did have to replace the microwave and had our jacks fixed at HWH but those aren't Newmar things.

Newmar and all RV manufacturers must be held accountable for their total quality, including their supplier’s quality. Until that happens consumers will continue to receive poor quality end items. Automobiles are better quality and longer lasting than ever and I promise they have a diverse and complicated supply chain, yet still produce a quality product. I’m in year 28 of a manufacturing career and I promise our customers could care less where we get our parts, we’re ultimately responsible for design, supplier selection and total quality.

[Indy Glenn]

Originally Posted by Jn1edosp

I decided to pull the trigger last week on a new 2020 3719 Canyon Star.

Someone will be getting a great used 2016 3710 CS because I spent three and a half years debugging it. .

Good for you.......

We bought a 2017 CS new.

We have never had problem with the Newmar build of the motor home.

With this said........we have had a ton of issues with all with the components Newmar installs.

We pay a premium for a Newmar - I guess I expected the parts they installed to be quality premium parts also. Newmar uses the cheapest parts they can purchase.....that's the problem and that's a shame!

We have replaced 2 A/Cs, clothes washer, 4 slide controllers, Micro/Convection, and windows are starting to fog.

On the actual Newmar build side, our shower stall was pulling away from the wall, it turned out to be a major repair, actually requiring removing the stall to repair.....

So yes - we were disappointed but still enjoy our motor home. We will keep this rig as I don't want to go through the BS of another new one, regardless of the brand. We are lucky, we live fairly close to the factory and have all our "house" service done there......

Take care and all the best....

g

[hohenwald48]

Originally Posted by Tilzbow

Newmar and all RV manufacturers must be held accountable for their total quality, including their supplier’s quality. Until that happens consumers will continue to receive poor quality end items. Automobiles are better quality and longer lasting than ever and I promise they have a diverse and complicated supply chain, yet still produce a quality product. I’m in year 28 of a manufacturing career and I promise our customers could care less where we get our parts, we’re ultimately responsible for design, supplier selection and total quality.

My first brand new car cost $1700. My most recent brand new car cost over $60,000. I doubt many folks would be willing to pay $500,000 for a 30' gas powered motorhome but suspect a motorhome built to the same quality standards as a passenger car would probably be prohibitively expensive. However, that would solve the problem of RV park space shortage.

[hrt]

Looking at the replies here, it seems as though around 2012 the build quality just went way down. Could of course also be that all the earlier coaches which were not reliable have gone to pasture, and the ones still on the road are the best of their era. In 2030 will people be talking about how great the 2016-2020 coaches are? Possibly.

[Roy-c]

I find it to be unbelievable when people say that it isn't the RV manufacturers fault when the cheap junk that they get from their suppliers fails. The bottom line is that there is little to no quality control in the entire RV industry. Why would anyone expect their suppliers to be any different.
People have said on this and other forums how happy they are that the manufacturer stepped up and repaired their NEW RV. REALLY ? They should be unhappy that they were sold a defective unit in the first place. Like I said, no QC, pump them out the door and hope for the best. That being that the owner will get tired of waiting for warranty service and fix at least all of the minor issues themselves. That is a win/win for the manuf and dealer.

[Solo_RV_Guy]

Originally Posted by Roy-c

I find it to be unbelievable when people say that it isn't the RV manufacturers fault when the cheap junk that they get from their suppliers fails. The bottom line is that there is little to no quality control in the entire RV industry. Why would anyone expect their suppliers to be any different.
People have said on this and other forums how happy they are that the manufacturer stepped up and repaired their NEW RV. REALLY ? They should be unhappy that they were sold a defective unit in the first place. Like I said, no QC, pump them out the door and hope for the best. That being that the owner will get tired of waiting for warranty service and fix at least all of the minor issues themselves. That is a win/win for the manuf and dealer.

Maybe it's the small number of units (relative to auto/light truck production) made, but I'm sure someone has done the math to see if it's cheaper to fix the incomplete/incompetent stuff post-delivery rather than make them 100% right when driven from the last production station. In automobile manufacturing the warranty work would be a huge cost and it's cheaper to engineer the build process to minimize in-process failures and bad purchased sub assemblies (like Takata air bags) can affect consumer perception even when the assembly manufacturer assumes liability.

I worked briefly in general aviation manufacturing and have seen what automation and robotics have done for airframe design and assembly. I've seen what manufacturing engineers can accomplish. The thing holding the RV industry back is the enormous up-front costs to redesign and rebuild production lines beyond the level they currently exist at. Thor Industries *could* pull it off, but it would require some brand consolidation (Ford, Lincoln, Mercury/Chrysler,Dodge, Plymouth etc) because how many nearly identical RVs can be sold under so many brand names? REV might do it, too.

Nothing will happen until the cost of human labor is greater than the costs of automation and robots, and consumer demand for better QC before delivery affects sales negatively.