Community Forums

TJ · 06-14-2017, 11:58 PM

I am a tournament skeet shooter and we stay at a couple of clubs each year that have RV sites with power, but the voltage is sometimes pretty low. I currently have a Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C surge protector that will shut things down when the voltage drops to unacceptable levels.

I am considering purchasing a Hughes Autotransformer to boost the low voltage. (I am aware of the "power stealing" controversy; let's not go there). Hughes has now upgraded its auto transformer to include "surge protection" but it doesn't seem to be as comprehensive as that offered by the Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C. Can these units be used together? I have had good luck with the PT50C and would like to keep it in the circuit, if possible.

And, if they can be used together, which should be plugged into the RV power post? I'm thinking the auto transformer should precede the PT-50C surge protector. Is that correct?

Any help will be appreciated.

TJ

PanJH · 06-15-2017, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tranquil Jim

I am a tournament skeet shooter and we stay at a couple of clubs each year that have RV sites with power, but the voltage is sometimes pretty low. I currently have a Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C surge protector that will shut things down when the voltage drops to unacceptable levels.

I am considering purchasing a Hughes Autotransformer to boost the low voltage. (I am aware of the "power stealing" controversy; let's not go there). Hughes has now upgraded its auto transformer to include "surge protection" but it doesn't seem to be as comprehensive as that offered by the Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C. Can these units be used together? I have had good luck with the PT50C and would like to keep it in the circuit, if possible.

And, if they can be used together, which should be plugged into the RV power post? I'm thinking the auto transformer should precede the PT-50C surge protector. Is that correct?

Any help will be appreciated.

TJ

I have an older Hughes autoformer and I contacted Hughes about configuration. They said to put the autoformer in front of the progressive surge protector. This makes sense as it allows the autoformer to boost voltage whereas if it was after the Progressive unit, the progressive unit may cut off the flow due to low voltage. My concern was the lack of protection on the Hughes for surges... the one I have , according to Hughes, does have surge protection, but it is sacrificial, so if you experience a surge, the unit has to go back to the factory for repairs. So, what I did was get a reasonably priced surge protector and put it in front of the Hughes. I've had it that way for 4 years now and it's worked fine.

D Lindy · 06-15-2017, 08:08 AM

Yes they can be used together, I'm currently doing that. Just put the Hughs unit first or the progressive unit will shut you down.

TJ · 06-15-2017, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PanJH

I have an older Hughes autoformer and I contacted Hughes about configuration. They said to put the autoformer in front of the progressive surge protector. This makes sense as it allows the autoformer to boost voltage whereas if it was after the Progressive unit, the progressive unit may cut off the flow due to low voltage. My concern was the lack of protection on the Hughes for surges... the one I have , according to Hughes, does have surge protection, but it is sacrificial, so if you experience a surge, the unit has to go back to the factory for repairs. So, what I did was get a reasonably priced surge protector and put it in front of the Hughes. I've had it that way for 4 years now and it's worked fine.

So, going with the new Hughes unit with surge protection, followed by the Progressive Industries unit might be a better choice? The new Hughes auto transformer apparently has a field-replaceable surge suppression module.

TJ

Steve Ownby · 06-15-2017, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tranquil Jim

I am a tournament skeet shooter and we stay at a couple of clubs each year that have RV sites with power, but the voltage is sometimes pretty low. I currently have a Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C surge protector that will shut things down when the voltage drops to unacceptable levels.

I am considering purchasing a Hughes Autotransformer to boost the low voltage. (I am aware of the "power stealing" controversy; let's not go there). Hughes has now upgraded its auto transformer to include "surge protection" but it doesn't seem to be as comprehensive as that offered by the Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C. Can these units be used together? I have had good luck with the PT50C and would like to keep it in the circuit, if possible.

And, if they can be used together, which should be plugged into the RV power post? I'm thinking the auto transformer should precede the PT-50C surge protector. Is that correct?

Any help will be appreciated.

TJ

Good plan TJ. I've been using this combo for several years. Yes the Hughes should be in front of the Progressive.

My Hughes is 10 years old now and has been rebuilt one because it soaked up a big surge/spike. Hughes has always had surge circuits but the current design makes the surge components field serviceable.

A few years ago I wired my Hughes into the power compartment where the Progressive and the transfer switch reside. The old "it steals current" is false but I don't like to fight the fight. It was only an issue in parks which had such marginal power that you really needed the protection.

vsheetz · 06-15-2017, 08:52 AM

Good and ok to have together. Have seen arguments both ways for which is first, but conventional wisdom says autotransformer first, then the progressive EMS.

TJ · 06-15-2017, 09:05 AM

Thanks, folks. I'm going with the new design Hughes unit with field-replaceable surge suppressor component. There are still some of the old-style units for sale new at about $80 less, but the field serviceable unit is definitely the way to go.

And, I'll put the Hughes first in line, followed by the PT50C. Thanks, again.

Safe travels.

TJ

Canuck53 · 06-15-2017, 09:35 AM

Does the New Hughes have more than surge protection? What does the Progressive give you that the Hughes does not have?

Steve Ownby · 06-15-2017, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Canuck53

Does the New Hughes have more than surge protection? What does the Progressive give you that the Hughes does not have?

Don't know if the level of protection has changed. If it's important to you call & discuss with Hughes.

The Hughes is only looking at the voltage and boosts accordingly. If the voltage gets below its threshold, it just turns off.

The Progressive is an EMS, as it looks at voltage, neutral, frequency, polarity, and will cut power to the coach if the power isn't clean.

Archer2 · 06-15-2017, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Ownby

Good plan TJ. I've been using this combo for several years. Yes the Hughes should be in front of the Progressive.

My Hughes is 10 years old now and has been rebuilt one because it soaked up a big surge/spike. Hughes has always had surge circuits but the current design makes the surge components field serviceable.

A few years ago I wired my Hughes into the power compartment where the Progressive and the transfer switch reside. The old "it steals current" is false but I don't like to fight the fight. It was only an issue in parks which had such marginal power that you really needed the protection.

Can you explain or maybe point me in the right direction to learn what this "autotransformers steal power/current" controversy is? I'm an electronics engineer and have never heard of it. Thanks if you have time

Steve Ownby · 06-15-2017, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archer2

Can you explain or maybe point me in the right direction to learn what this "autotransformers steal power/current" controversy is? I'm an electronics engineer and have never heard of it. Thanks if you have time

It stems from the management of older campgrounds with marginal electrical infrastructure. Many up graded their power pedestals without substantial rewiring to accommodate 50 amp RVs. It seems to have its nexus in other renters seeing some RVers plugging in autoformers & complaining that somehow these newcomers were getting more than their fair share of the power & somehow impacting them. Some campground owners/managers took the path of least resistance & listed a ban on autoformers.

It was only a problem for me at a campground just south of Crescent City, Ca. Since we were traveling with friends I elected to not use the Hughes but hard wired the unit in my power compartment shortly there after.

Archer2 · 06-15-2017, 03:25 PM

Thanks Steve. I bet this theory got a lot of arguments going on the interwebs! I'm sorry I wasn't following along!

CaptainDavid · 06-15-2017, 09:20 PM

I just recently purchased a Hughes Autoformer with surge protector. I too had questions since I also have built in surge protector. I called Hughes directly and was told that it will not interfere with my surge protector. They were Friendly and willing to answer any questions about their products

ftharrisiii · 06-15-2017, 10:00 PM

Tranquil Jim,

I've been running the Hughes Autoformer RV220-50-SP/Progressive EMS-PT50C combination in my 2016 DSDP 4369 for about 8 months with no issues. I have the Autoformer connected ahead of the Progressive unit. There were several posts from a year or so back that discussed the pros/cons at length.

Below is a photo showing my installation. I had to shift and move a few items around, but got everything to fit in the electrical bay.

Tom