If you’ve owned both Spartan and Freightliner chassis

[R.Wold]

Originally Posted by cbennis

I'm waiting on a 2021 Ventana 34', so I have been looking into this. The Ventana does not have Independent Front Suspension on either chassis (at least the 34' models). The Spartan has Integrated Front Air Suspension and steer axle system, which is a solid axle. Brakes are disc in front, drum in rear, and an exhaust brake.

I thought I saw something that mentioned that Spartan has relocated the shift controls to the steering wheel stalk, maybe one of those Mt Comfort videos?

A 2018 article on motorhome.com shows Spartan uses Hendrickson suspensions, so possibly the Ventana has the Airtek Integrated Front Air Suspension and steer axle system.

The 2021 Ventana New Features and Product Changes does not mention anything about Independent Front Suspension, and specifically mentions that the 40' models have a solid beam axle on both FL and Spartan. It doesn't mention the 34'.

So, this is my take on the info I have been able to find. If someone knows for sure if this is wrong, speak up.

In this video from Steinbring, they say that the entire Ventana line will have a Spartan option, with the 34’ and 37’ models on the K1 360.

https://www.steinbring.com/2021-newmar-ventana

All the Spartan K1 360s currently in production have IFS. If the 34’ Ventana version has enough of the other features I’m after, I can live with an ISB and drum brakes. Otherwise it will have to be a New Aire on a K2.

But I’d like a simpler coach, don’t need the luxury styling, and prefer propane appliances. So we’ll see. I don’t mind the wait because I wouldn’t be using a new coach right now anyway.

[lakebuster]

We have had both a FL on a 15 DS 4369 and now a LA4553 on a Spartan K3. Both ride great, but do get more porpoising in LA and will probably swap to KONIS. What I like about Spartan is easy access to fuel and Wabsco air drier filters. Also do not like controls on right steering stalk on new FL platform. But for what it is worth a driver for Newmar who delivers all over the country said his favorite was the 40’ Ventanna even over the KA!

[cbennis]

Originally Posted by R.Wold

All the Spartan K1 360s currently in production have IFS. If the 34’ Ventana version has enough of the other features I’m after, I can live with an ISB and drum brakes. Otherwise it will have to be a New Aire on a K2.

If the Spartan comes with IFS, then I'd get it in a heart beat. I'll have my dealer verify which suspension with Newmar.

[R.Wold]

Originally Posted by cbennis

If the Spartan comes with IFS, then I'd get it in a heart beat. I'll have my dealer verify which suspension with Newmar.

Whole lotta anticipation and wait and see goin on in his camp

[Tigerfan1]

Originally Posted by DS15

R.Wold,

I have posted an answer to this question long ago. I copied from that post and have pasted it below:



Please understand, this is my experience/opinion also. Don’t want to be beat up over my experience and my opinion! We had a 2005 Kountry Star 3910 DP on a Spartan Chassis, no Comfort Drive, but that coach rode great. We traded up to a 2015 Dutch Star 4018 on a Freightliner Chassis. The Freightliner Chassis had constant recalls, yes chassis only, recall after recall, 740 miles total, back and forth to the Freightliner shop, for recalls. I’m starting to understand why there are so many service centers for Freightliner. Looking at the Freightliner recalls currently (including Sprinter Chassis) looks like Freightliner is proceeding on schedule! The ride on our 2015 Dutch Star 4018 was not as nice as our 2005 Kountry Star. I installed Road King CUSTOM shocks on our 2015 Chassis which I worked with Road King for specific valving for a better ride and spent big bucks for those and it still did not ride as well as our 2005 Kountry Star! Now, we have a 2020 Dutch Star 4081 on a Spartan Chassis, yes, we paid extra for it and the ride is fantastic! No comparison in ride quality to our last Freightliner, well worth the extra money paid for the chassis alone. It’s the smooth ride that I remember from our 2005 Kountry Star! We have the 4081 model (40 foot) and we do not have the porpoising issue on this chassis. Spartan has called me asking how everything is with the chassis, don’t recall Freightliner doing that. I am an auto mechanic, diesel mechanic and an FAA Certificated Aircraft Mechanic. I have over 35 years turning wrenches and have crawled all over the previous Freightliner Chassis that we had and spend DAYS crawling under the Spartan Chassis that we now have. The differences are notable. The hydraulic cooling fan drive and fan drive mount is flat out better engineered. Filter placement, especially the air system dryer filter is much, much, much better. I mean much better placement and serviceability! The front steer axle wheel bearings are oil bath, not grease packed bearings like on our 2015 Freightliner. The front axle tie rods are straight, not curved (like our 2015 had which did pose some alignment issues at first). Now, so I’m not called out and roasted on this forum, remember, this is my experience and opinion based on three Newmar coaches we owned. One Spartan Chassis, one Freightliner Chassis, and now back to Spartan, because in my opinion and based on my experience, Spartan is the better chassis. I highly recommend that you go Spartan.



Bruce

I have had both and they are both good chassis’s. You mentioned the front wheel bearings were oil bath on a Spartan as if it were an advantage. The grease pack bearings as explained to me by the factory in Gaffney are good for a million miles. One less maintenance item.

[DS15]

Originally Posted by Tigerfan1

I have had both and they are both good chassis’s. You mentioned the front wheel bearings were oil bath on a Spartan as if it were an advantage. The grease pack bearings as explained to me by the factory in Gaffney are good for a million miles. One less maintenance item.

Gaffney’s wrong, not the first time though, ask the Gaffney Service Center and you may get a different answer, read your Freightliner’s Maintenance Requirements, on our previous coach, a 2015 Dutch Star 4018, front bearing repack is required at 100,000 miles. My point was no removing a BIG wheel and BIG hub to repack a bearing and change seals. On oil bath hubs, remove small hubcap and look at oil level. It is much easier changing the oil in the wheel bath hubs as a maintenance item - I’ve done that quite a bit on heavy equipment and prefer oil bath hubs. In my opinion, better design for maintenance, that’s all.

[Ann n Gene]

Spartan oil bath hubs are very prone to leak. I know, many think they are overfilled, not mine, I ran OTR road trucks for years and know how to read a fill level. They use cheap seals that leak, get oil on rims and brakes and can cause bearing failure. I have had six Spartans and all but the first couple had multiple huh seals go bad. Both great chassis but neither problem free. JMHO

[Tigerfan1]

Originally Posted by DS15

Gaffney’s wrong, not the first time though, ask the Gaffney Service Center and you may get a different answer, read your Freightliner’s Maintenance Requirements, on our previous coach, a 2015 Dutch Star 4018, front bearing repack is required at 100,000 miles. My point was no removing a BIG wheel and BIG hub to repack a bearing and change seals. On oil bath hubs, remove small hubcap and look at oil level. It is much easier changing the oil in the wheel bath hubs as a maintenance item - I’ve done that quite a bit on heavy equipment and prefer oil bath hubs. In my opinion, better design for maintenance, that’s all.

Thanks for the heads up. Will be at Gaffney next week and ask them.

[cbennis]

Originally Posted by R.Wold

All the Spartan K1 360s currently in production have IFS. If the 34’ Ventana version has enough of the other features I’m after, I can live with an ISB and drum brakes. Otherwise it will have to be a New Aire on a K2.

Looks like it will be the NA on a K2. Per Newmar, the Ventana line does not have independent front suspension. the front suspension on the 34' Spartan is a 12,400 LB ZF/SPARTAN AXLE WITH PITMAN ARMS..

[Ann n Gene]

You will love the New Aire. Great coach with all the luxury line features in a compact package.

[R.Wold]

Originally Posted by cbennis

Looks like it will be the NA on a K2. Per Newmar, the Ventana line does not have independent front suspension. the front suspension on the 34' Spartan is a 12,400 LB ZF/SPARTAN AXLE WITH PITMAN ARMS..

Since 2011 the Ventana line has been on a Freightliner chassis with a straight front axle. For 2021, according to Steinbring (see video posted earlier) there will be a Spartan option for all Ventana models with the 34’ units riding on a K1 360. All current K1 chassis are equipped with IFS. Again, this is for 2021, not current models.


ZF (for ZF Friedrichshafen AG) is the designation used for the current IFS on the New Aire (and other) Freightliner chassis, which makes sense since Freightliner is a Daimler company.

A pitman arm connects the steering box to the tie rods and both straight axles and IFS arrangements utilize one.

So I’m still holding out some hope. Where did you get the info and in what context? In the past, Spartan has used Reyco Granning IFS.

Not sure what IFS Spartan is currently using on the K1 but all K1’s listed on their website are 12,600 IFS and from their video it doesn’t look like Reyco or ZF.

ZF front suspension from the Newmar page of the Freightliner website. It doesn’t specify but it’s an RL75E:

[R.Wold]

Originally Posted by Ann n Gene

You will love the New Aire. Great coach with all the luxury line features in a compact package.

I really do like the New Aire line, and I can appreciate the better materials and workmanship (polished tile, dove tail drawer joints, etc) but I’m going to have dogs and grand kids (not sure which is worse) in my coach and I’m not sure I want to subject a New Aire to that. I also like simplicity and LPG appliances and the New Aire has neither. The Ventana line is complex enough for me. So I’m still on the fence. As someone else pointed out, the 450 ISL is appealing to any motorhead, but I can live with an ISB if everything else is right. So Im waiting for info and hopeful. But either way I’ll end up with a great coach. If Newmar would just let me design one, it would be perfect.

[cbennis]

Originally Posted by cbennis

Looks like it will be the NA on a K2. Per Newmar, the Ventana line does not have independent front suspension. the front suspension on the 34' Spartan is a 12,400 LB ZF/SPARTAN AXLE WITH PITMAN ARMS..

just got this email this morning (I've deleted the names) -

HOPE YOUR TUESDAY IS GOING GOOD. HERE IS THE CORRECT INFO. ON THE VENTANA AXLE. SPARTAN GAVE ME THE WRONG INFORMATION YESTERDAY.

I was just informed that the axle information given to me yesterday was for the NewAire, not Ventana. The Ventana is a Hendrickson Airtek front axle. The GAWR IS 12,400 as I said before.

Sorry
Account Manager, Specialty Vehicles

[cbennis]

forgot to add - the account manager, specialty vehicles is from Spartan, the email that is quoted in all caps is from Newmar. All of the info was forwarded from the dealer