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03-12-2007, 01:16 PM
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#1
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Member
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MN
Posts: 73
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Does anyone know anything about the new FRED units that just came out?
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03-12-2007, 01:16 PM
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#2
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Member
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MN
Posts: 73
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Does anyone know anything about the new FRED units that just came out?
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03-12-2007, 04:00 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Erie, PA
Posts: 1,070
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mrmrsbb, I believe the Newmar Grand Aire(FRED) has 300hp and 600ft./lbs.of torque, on a Freightliner Chassis. Ed.S
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2005 Newmar Mountain Aire W-24 , 2006 Jeep Commander Limited towed vehicle Newmar Kountry Klub 7284L, Pennsylvania State Directors
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03-12-2007, 04:56 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Mid Atlantic Campers
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: McVeytown, PA
Posts: 2,259
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very nice diesel chassis for the entry level diesel market, strong and reliable.
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Steve, Pat, Hakbar, & Root Motor
2007 National RV Pacifica 36'
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03-13-2007, 01:59 AM
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#5
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sheboygan, WI
Posts: 5,644
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The Grand Star should be a good seller. Tiffin has had the FRED chassis underneath the Allegro Bay since the FRED first was introduced and has been selling very well and is well accepted by it's buyers. In fact they've just added the FRED to the entry level Allegro line due to popular demand.
The FRED eliminates the noise issues of the earlier attempts at diesel pullers and is a well built chassis. It's never going to be the same as a diesel pusher but at it's price point, it nicely bridges the gap between a gasser and a pusher. The Cummins 300 ISB has more torque than a gasser and puts it down low in a useable RPM range. Many FRED owners are reporting 11 MPG fuel economy readings so it's an economical chassis to operate.
I predict that you're going to see a number of Grand Stars (and happy owners) hitting the road within the next year.
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Mark & Leann Quasius
2016 Cornerstone 45A
2020 Jeep Gladiator Rubicon
2021 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon
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03-13-2007, 02:06 AM
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#6
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Administrator Emeritus
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 10,041
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After having the opportunity during a recent factory visit to check the Grand Star over from head to toe, I agree with Mark's prediciton.
Nice rig for the money....
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2019 Grand Design Solitude 380FL fifth wheel
2017 40' Renegade Verona LE LTS (traded)
2018 F150 King Ranch Crew Cab Diesel
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03-13-2007, 05:48 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Crossville,TN USA
Posts: 437
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If Newmar's version of FRED is anything like Tiffin's They may well get some gas owner converters. However, there is zero comparison to a pusher,i.e. 5 speed tranny, no air suspension,no full basement with pass through compartments as the Freightliner chassis is not a raised rail unit, max. 5,000 # towing capacity.
One advantage that Tiffin has had over Newmar is the limited scope of their product line. Now with Newmar introducing yet another model series that differential will be even further widened. Was this not a mega problem for Fleetwood just a few short years ago? How much inventory can you really expect the dealers to carry? Ken,'04 DSDP....
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03-14-2007, 07:51 AM
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#8
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sheboygan, WI
Posts: 5,644
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Ken, I agree that I think that Newmar has too many models. It does spread the product pretty thin and make it rough for dealers. If the Grand Star is Newmar's only FRED based coach though, I think you'll see it being one of their better selling units. It will definitely make a dent in Newmar's gas chassis sales.
As to comparing to a diesel pusher - you're right, there is no comparison. However, that's a different market. The FRED isn't priced anywhere near that. You can pick up a new 34' triple slide Allegro on a FRED for around $90K which keeps it far away from any diesel pusher pricing. I think you'll see FRED's market being gasoline chassis owners who want a bit more torque, better fuel economy, and greater cargo carrying capacity while staying in the lower price spectrum normally reserved for gassers. It's an excellent fit in that market segment.
__________________
Mark & Leann Quasius
2016 Cornerstone 45A
2020 Jeep Gladiator Rubicon
2021 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon
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03-27-2007, 06:17 AM
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#9
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Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 14
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I'm in full agreement with Mark. The FRED isn't a pusher and doesn't compete in that market. It does, however, compete in the gas puller market at about a $9K upgrade price for a Tiffin Allegro Bay. I currently have a 5 year old W20 chassis that I have put 57,000 miles on. After several test drives with the FRED on a 37' quad-slide Allegro Bay and comparing that to my W20 and a 36' HR Neptune pusher, we were completely convinced that a FRED was the right choice for us at this time. Next week we are going down to Red Bay to watch our Allegro Bay 37QDB FRED start down the assembly line.
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2007 Allegro Bay 37QDB FRED
2002 Jeep Liberty TOAD
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03-27-2007, 06:50 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 259
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I'd like to see some performance numbers comparing the Fred to the Workhorse UFO. The Fred has the 20+ ft drive shaft, only a five speed transmission. The UFO has a 2 ft drive shaft and the six speed allison. I honestly don't know which will out perform the other, but I think dyno info would be interesting. The UFO design is also conducive with pass through storage because there's no driveshaft or exhaust system to contend with. With the UFO reportedly getting 9 mpg and and the Fred getting 11 mpg I think if you consider the higher cost of diesel in most places this is a wash. After adding up the maintenance cost of diesel vs gas, I think the only real practical difference between the two units is going to be actual performance numbers at the rear wheels, not just engine ratings. I also heard the Newmar Grand Star with the Fred is coming in around $180,000. That's pretty pricey and not a lot of advantages. Time will tell.
Jack
__________________
"Be the kind of person your dog thinks you are"
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03-27-2007, 10:26 AM
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#11
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Moderator Emeritus
Nor'easters Club Workhorse Chassis Owner iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 30,785
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I like your post Jack from what I have read most RVers that have taken the trial ride on UFO were looking for more MFG's building a coach in their make. With 9 mpg and a reprogram of ECM bet it would push 11 mpg easily.
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03-27-2007, 10:55 AM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Dalton Ma/Crystal River Fl
Posts: 574
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Jack,
I would like to any reports on the UFO, I am assuming they are being sold now but have heard nothing from any owners.
Seeing a lot of posts from people test driving but evedently they haven`t bought or coaches are on order.
Beglad when people get some miles on them and see how they perform loaded.
007, I think you are being really optimistic about 11 MPG. I know people with GM pickups with the 8.1 who aren`t getting much over 12 MPG.
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03-27-2007, 11:06 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 259
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Spoonman
Unfortunately, you're right in that we're going to have to wait for awhile to get feedback from owners. I also doubt that we'll be able to get a true performance comparison. Seat of the pants comparisons can't be done accurately because of different manufacturers, weight of coach, loading, wheelbase etc. The only true way we'd ever get a true performance picture of both would be to put them on a dyno. Even then, wheelbase on the FRED could cause a variable.
Jack
__________________
"Be the kind of person your dog thinks you are"
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03-27-2007, 02:56 PM
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#14
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Moderator Emeritus
Nor'easters Club Workhorse Chassis Owner iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 30,785
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Spoonman
Was getting 6.1-6.9 upgrade Ultra power 8.7 -9.1 with the shorter drive shaft who knows what good news may bring.
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