Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > THE OWNER'S CORNER FORUMS > Newmar Owner's Forum
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 08-17-2022, 07:28 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma
Posts: 411
Solar, Lithium and A/C on Batteries

I am installing 810ah of lithium and 1290 watts of solar on my 2017 DS 4054. One of the things I would like to do is run an air conditioner on batteries. I'm installing the batteries and lithium BIM, having the solar installed professionally, but not sure how to rewire the electrical panel to do what I want. Ideally, I would like to run both air conditioners through the inverter so I could select which air conditioner to run, depending on circumstances. For instance, I would like to run the front A/C when we're driving and it's 90+ outside, or run the back A/C when we're boondocking overnight in warm temperatures. Looking at my panel, it doesn't appear there's any room to move or add a couple more breakers to the inverter side of the panel. Am I missing something here? I'm fairly comfortable with wiring (I wired my own home). The other thing I'm not sure about is if using the inverter as a pass through would it be able to handle both air conditioners? Without adding an additional inverter, is this possible? Currently have the MS2812 Magnum inverter.

Thanks in advance!
__________________
2017 DSDP 4054 Spartan Chassis
BattChief is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 08-17-2022, 07:58 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Rockwood27's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Nor'easters Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Freedom, NH
Posts: 1,320
Your 810 AH lithium battery will yield around 7 to 7.2KWh of power through the inverter. Assuming the battery is fully charged, it will be depleted in 4 to 6 hours, after running the AC at night and nothing else. Running an AC on battery power requires a huge battery bank. Most of the time it isn't very practical, except for a few hours and coupled with either the generator or vehicle alternator to supplement.

As far as your inverter, I've had a couple of 30A, 120V (3600 watts) RVs and 30 amps was barely enough to run 2 ACs. I guessing the MS2812 inverter is 2800 watts continuous, but really around 2500 watts at 90% efficiency. It may not be large enough to run both ACs. Does anything else use the inverter, like a refrigerator?
__________________
Fran, Mary & Zoey (silver Cocker)
2017 Thor Axis 25.5 "RUV", Ford E-450, V10, 6 speed
2016 Chevy Sonic LTZ Auto Hatchback 4-down
Rockwood27 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2022, 08:08 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 31,222
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockwood27 View Post
Your 810 AH lithium battery will yield around 7 to 7.2KWh of power through the inverter. Assuming the battery is fully charged, it will be depleted in 4 to 6 hours, after running the AC at night and nothing else. Running an AC on battery power requires a huge battery bank. Most of the time it isn't very practical, except for a few hours and coupled with either the generator or vehicle alternator to supplement.

Sent from my SM-A515U using iRV2 - RV Forum mobile app
Is that calculation with the AC running full time or with a 50% run time. Nighttime AC , depending on temps, may only need to run 50% of the time.
twinboat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2022, 08:11 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 31,222
Your Magnum inverter/charger probable only has a 30 amp pass thru breaker on it. If that's the case, your probably going to trip it while on shore power with both ACs running. Remember, it's also re-charging your deeply depleted lithium batteries.
twinboat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2022, 08:12 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Rockwood27's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Nor'easters Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Freedom, NH
Posts: 1,320
Quote:
Originally Posted by twinboat View Post
Is that calculation with the AC running full time or with a 50% run time. Nighttime AC , depending on temps, may only need to run 50% of the time.
I figured 80% discharge, 90% inverter efficiency and 100% operating time at 12 amps.

Sent from my SM-A515U using iRV2 - RV Forum mobile app
__________________
Fran, Mary & Zoey (silver Cocker)
2017 Thor Axis 25.5 "RUV", Ford E-450, V10, 6 speed
2016 Chevy Sonic LTZ Auto Hatchback 4-down
Rockwood27 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2022, 08:23 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma
Posts: 411
My thoughts on running both through the inverter was so I could select which one I wanted to use. I agree it would be impractical to run both air conditioners off the batteries at the same time. As stated, I may select the front to run while driving during hot days (for a couple hours in the afternoon), OR select the rear to run at night while boondocking when itís warm outside. Even if it didnít make it through the night, the AGS would supplement if needed. Of course, this would only be at a harvest host or Walmart if thereís no generator hours. But it sounds like it wouldnít handle both a/cís being passed through on shore power, so that may not be an option.
__________________
2017 DSDP 4054 Spartan Chassis
BattChief is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2022, 10:55 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Newmar Owners Club
Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Lake McClure, CA
Posts: 1,383
I don't think it's wired the way your thinking.
The 120/240v from the transfer switch goes straight to the electric panel. There's a 30a breaker in the panel that goes to the inverter pass thru and from there back to the electric panel where it feeds the inverter circuits. Thats how shore power or generator feeds the inverter circuits. When there is no power it inverts and sends it to the inverter circuits. Not that you will need it but the 2812 has two 30a pass thru's and the 3012 has a 60a pass thru. I installed Micro Air easy starts on all 3 a/c's which helps. I added a second inverter and inverted the entire panel using all 3 pass thru's.
__________________
2018 Dutch Star 4369 Spartan Chassis
2016 Jeep Cherokee, 1952 Willys CJ3A
10 fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 09:01 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma
Posts: 411
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10 fan View Post
I don't think it's wired the way your thinking.
The 120/240v from the transfer switch goes straight to the electric panel. There's a 30a breaker in the panel that goes to the inverter pass thru and from there back to the electric panel where it feeds the inverter circuits. Thats how shore power or generator feeds the inverter circuits. When there is no power it inverts and sends it to the inverter circuits. Not that you will need it but the 2812 has two 30a pass thru's and the 3012 has a 60a pass thru. I installed Micro Air easy starts on all 3 a/c's which helps. I added a second inverter and inverted the entire panel using all 3 pass thru's.
10 Fan, would you mind explaining how you wired your panel to utilize both pass through? At this point, Iím not interested in installing a second inverter, but would be interested in inverting the entire panel. I know I canít run both air conditioners, induction cooktop, floor heat, etc., and I would turn off the breakers to those items when boondocking for extended periods. My primary reason for inverting the whole panel would be to have the ability to select which air conditioner I want to run, situation dependent.
__________________
2017 DSDP 4054 Spartan Chassis
BattChief is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 10:03 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Beaver Dam, Wisconsin
Posts: 3,618

2017 DS 4054
810ah of lithium
1290 watts of solar
MS2812 Magnum inverter

One of the things I would like to do is run an air conditioner on batteries. I'm installing the batteries and lithium BIM, having the solar installed professionally, but not sure how to rewire the electrical panel to do what I want.


Do you have a 50 amp 240 volt split phase shore power system or a 30 amp 120 single phase system? I will assume it is a 50 amp system.

The MS2812 Magnum inverter is designed for use with a main panel and a sub panel. The Magnum gets its power from the main panel and supplies power to the sub panel. Most likely it is a 120 volt 30 amp pass through. However, there is an option for a 60 amp 120 volts pass through circuit.

The 60 amp system would allow you to connect both A/C's and run them simultaneously from shore power or generator. It would probably require a different or modified sub panel to include two more branch circuit breakers. However, both A/C's would be running on the same leg of a 50 amp 240 volt split phase shore power system. That has balance implications.

https://www.magnum-dimensions.com/si...-MS-Series.pdf

Post make and model of sub panel for better advice. Some models have expansion boxes available. Pictures would be helpful.

There are whole RV inverters that would not need the sub panel. See Victron https://www.victronenergy.com/invert...s/multiplus-ii
__________________
Paul Bristol
Kodiak Cub 176RD
Nissan Pathfinder 2015
Persistent is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 10:04 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Jon_C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Southeast Texas
Posts: 719
Solar, Lithium and A/C on Batteries

I wired my inverter to the generator input on my xfer switch to invert all circuits, then installed an outlet on genny to plug shore power cord into.

Also installed a relay powered only by inverter to drop 120v inverter power to the battery charger

But mine did not have an inverter at all so i dont have the pass thru wiring. Im sure that could be bypassed pretty easily tho.
And micro airís on both a/cís.

Hardest part has been educating DW on what things can and canít be turned on at the same time
__________________
1998 HR Endeavor Cummins ISB 275 / Banks Allison 3060
20014Jeep Wrangler JKUR with M&G air brake with breakaway
Jon_C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 04:51 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma
Posts: 411
I have a precision circuits panel, but no obvious room for additional breakers.

Click image for larger version

Name:	2F87AFDF-1CCB-41AB-B753-179FB9DAE263.jpeg
Views:	13
Size:	70.6 KB
ID:	374034

Click image for larger version

Name:	B7828B87-5194-47D8-BD9C-58FF461C9AAF.jpeg
Views:	16
Size:	101.0 KB
ID:	374035

Click image for larger version

Name:	8730974F-9021-4805-ACAD-274EE443E721.jpeg
Views:	19
Size:	116.9 KB
ID:	374036
__________________
2017 DSDP 4054 Spartan Chassis
BattChief is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 05:24 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Jon_C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Southeast Texas
Posts: 719
Is that the only panel you have or is there a separate inverter panel?
__________________
1998 HR Endeavor Cummins ISB 275 / Banks Allison 3060
20014Jeep Wrangler JKUR with M&G air brake with breakaway
Jon_C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 06:34 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
richpatty's Avatar
 
Newmar Owners Club
Freightliner Owners Club
iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 722
Quote:
Originally Posted by BattChief View Post
I have a precision circuits panel, but no obvious room for additional breakers.
Bummer. I did what you want to do, but I had one single pole breaker where I replaced it with a dual pole. I then added a switch to allow me to go back and forth between Shore power and Inverter... I did this for the front AC for driving.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	AC on inverter.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	178.8 KB
ID:	374043  
__________________
2017 Newmar Ventana 4310
1,440W solar / 800 AH Lithium
2007 CR-V
richpatty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 08:02 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,356
As someone else mentioned, you might consider upgrading to a Victron Multiplus II. Jared from the YouTube channel All About RVs has a nice diagram showing how itís wired. There would be no need to mess with the breakers in your panel.

https://allaboutrvsinfo.com/wp-conte...-II-2-x120.pdf
__________________
It ainít camping unless you have a microwave.
Yosemite77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
batteries, lithium, solar



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
solar and Lithium batteries rbTN Going Green 13 06-29-2022 10:24 AM
Lithium batteries with non-lithium. UncaMike RV Systems & Appliances 4 09-26-2021 12:49 PM
Batteries to lithium or not to lithium sciblades RV Systems & Appliances 18 03-21-2021 10:40 PM
RV Lithium Lite & Lithium Super Upgrade Systems - Mike Mas Idleup iRV2.com General Discussion 10 02-20-2021 04:26 PM
Lithium batteries only and no solar? mclinkaberry RV Systems & Appliances 29 12-14-2016 07:34 PM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.