Spartan Cummins Code

[drdonny]

Anyone seen this
Audible Engine Alarm
5246 16-Data above normal MS Aftertreatment SCR Operator Inducement Severity
2020 London Aire

[Archer2]

That code doesn’t show up unless there are other codes active. The SPN5246 code indicates that some other problem(s) exist with your DEF/SCR systems and the conditions have been met to have the ECM start derating the engine speed/torque. The real underlying problem is related to the DEF/SCR system and you should have one or more additional fault codes active that should indicate more specifically where the problem lies.

[drdonny]

This code came up a week ago and was told by Spartan it would be OK to drive Would not be a problem unless real cold weather. Take it to Cummins if it did not clear in the next 5 or 6 times cranking and stopping. 3362 31-condition exists. Aftertreatment 1Diesel Exhaust Fluid Dosing Unit Imput Lines

[Archer2]

A couple of things to clarify. First, are you now saying that you have code 3362 FMI 31 now in addition to the 5246 FMI 16? If Spartan told you to not worry about it unless it didn’t go away in a week or so then whoever you talked to did you a real disservice. It’s possible that they only looked at the 3362 code and just assumed that maybe the fluid was temporarily frozen and the code would clear when it warmed up. The problem is that DEF only freezes at 12 degrees F. Were you in temperatures in the teens at the time? The 5246 code means that there is something seriously wrong somewhere in the emissions systems and the ECM has ALREADY started to reduce the engine performance. The reduction will get steadily more severe until you will soon be unable to travel at more than 5MPH!
The other code, 3362, indicates a problem with the DEF lines or the DEF “Dosing Unit” aka pump. That code (along with possibly others you might have) is what is causing the 5246 code. It is saying that the doser/pump is not able to prime. Could be a leaking line, frozen DEF with an inoperative DEF heater, bad doser pump or your DEF tank is just empty. In any case you should get it fixed before you are stranded and have to be towed.

[drdonny]

Thanks for your help. I hope to make it to Cummins next Monday about 30 miles. Have already driven about 25 miles. I was told by Spartan and Cummins the same thing last week. Definitely has not frozen and is full.

[Archer2]

Good luck!

[drdonny]

Originally Posted by drdonny

Anyone seen this
Audible Engine Alarm
5246 16-Data above normal MS Aftertreatment SCR Operator Inducement Severity
2020 London Aire

Is it safe to drive with audible alarm going off? Does it get louder when it is getting closer to shut down?

[Archer2]

Hi Dr. Donnie. Sorry but I don’t know of any way to easily tell how far you can still go until the 5MPH derate hits. I think that whenever it does kick in it is after the coach has been shut down and then restarted. In other words it is very possible that when you start it up in preparation for trying to get it to the shop you may find that it is already derated.
If I recall correctly the FMI associated with the SPN5246 fault will change as the ECM goes through its EPA-mandated “progressive Inducement algorithms”. FMI 15 is least severe, FMI 16 is moderately severe and FMI 0 is most severe. Your code was at 16 so it was already somewhat derated (like torque reduced to 60%) the next level is going to be the “death penalty” 5MPH inducement.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
Your best bet considering everything may be to get a mobile Cummins tech to come to you and fix it. The problem is likely to be a leaking or kinked DEF hose or possibly a clogged filter or bad DEF Doser/pump. The DEF hoses, pumps, injectors etc are not very hard to get to for troubleshooting.
One more thing to point out is that this is a good example of the kind of DEF issue that WOULD NOT be relieved by building and installing a DEF Sensor Simulator (DSS). I say this in case anyone might guide you into trying the DSS as a fix.

[drdonny]

Thanks for all your help. I have gone to 0 now and have a stop engine light just cranking engine at my home. Spartan does not want to send a mobile tech, but have me towed to a Cummins Facility. I am a little frustrated.

[777 Driver]

Originally Posted by drdonny

Thanks for all your help. I have gone to 0 now and have a stop engine light just cranking engine at my home. Spartan does not want to send a mobile tech, but have me towed to a Cummins Facility. I am a little frustrated.

Dr. Donny, good luck working through your challenge.

This is just my opinion, worth exactly half of what you're paying for it, but, I'd only accept the tow option as the very last possible resort. I would be very concerned that some sort of damage is very possible during the tow evolution. Although the tow company should accept responsibility for any damage done during the tow, you won't be compensated for the hassles associated with having any damage repaired.

If it were me, I'd be inclined to pay, out of pocket, any mobile tech repair charge before I'd accept a tow.

Take care,
Stu

[Archer2]

I can understand being wary of mobile service techs in general but in this particular situation (if it were me) I would be a little less suspicious. First let me be clear that I’m talking about a heavy truck technician (the kind who service big trucks-NOT an RV guy).
I say this because the only code you got indicated that the DEF doser would not prime. That would indicate that fluid is not getting to the input side of the doser/pump. The only components would be the doser itself, the 2 or 3 hose(s) between the DEF tank and the doser, the fluid pickup on the sensor assembly and the tank itself.
These components are pretty easy to inspect and replace if necessary and the system is more or less identical to one in any Cummins-powered heavy truck.
Worst case is maybe you could cover the “mobile fee” and Spartan can cover parts and labor?
Another thing just for your information is that you won’t harm your engine or DEF systems by starting and running your coach. You will just have to put up with the ominous and annoying lights and alarms if you need to run the engine for any reason.
Good luck again.

[drdonny]

My issue was a def head issue. Was told they only replace sensor now and not whole unit. They said it would be a generation 8 sensor. Covered under warranty and 3 hours labor allowance. I was surprised they no longer replace entire unit. I was lucky that I made it home before derate. When I pulled it out of garage to get behind wrecker it had hardly any power.

[randomledder]

Maybe I’m missing something but why not call cummins and have them send out one of their mobile technicians? I assume it’s a warranty item?

[drdonny]

It goes through Spartan not Cummins and they would not authorize it. Believe me I tried.