Community Forums

Trvlngnrs · 12-06-2021, 04:03 PM

Hi guys. My wife and I are considering purchasing a 2002 Mountain Air 3357 as we draw closer to retiring. I'm familiar with Newmar as we used to full time in an '03 DSDP while working as travel nurses. We won't be full timing in this, just vacationing for a couple weeks at a time.

The RV is 2,000 miles away, in OH and we're in UT. It has the Chevy/Workhorse chassis with approx 32,000 miles. Tires are 3 years old.
After talking to the seller, he seems like a pretty honest guy. Told me the good and the bad of the rig. From what he says, and looking at the photos' it's in great shape. The one big problem is the clear coat. He says 60-70% of clear coat is cracking in the rear of coach. It looks OK from 10’ away but it still bugs him. There are 3 spots above drip line where the paint is peeling.

My questions are if you have run into this, and is it repairable without having to re-paint the entire RV?

Asking price is $35,000 but he said he would accept $32,000.

Thanks for any input you can give me!

Also, if anyone is in the Cleveland area and would like to scout it out for us, that would be a huge blessing!

Trvlngnrs

R.Wold · 12-06-2021, 07:43 PM

Country Coach had a similar problem in that era that looked like lacquer checking. I was told it was only repairable by replacing the fiberglass. A repaint wouldn't do it. So this might be the same issue, but as you said, it looked fine from a few feet away. And its not like its going to rust.

The failing clear coat is just that and can be repaired, but if it isnt terrible and doesn't bother you theres no reason to go to the expense. It wont hurt anything although the failing areas will grow over time. If everything else checks out you're getting a lot of coach for the money and your enjoyment will be the same either way. I think interior condition and maintenance history are the most important things to focus on.

Ljwt330 · 12-06-2021, 08:20 PM

I am going to add to R.Wold’s response and say that it appears there are two related issues with the paint. The fiberglass defect which caused paint checking, especially in darker colors, was present in many coaches of that vintage and appears to be in this coach. Enlarge the picture showing the ladder at the rear, and the black by the window looks to be from the fiberglass defect. Can’t really be certain, however.

The peeling clear coat is a separate issue from paint checking, but extreme checking can lead to peeling.

Here is the important part, both problems are expensive to repair properly. Checking cannot be resolved without panel replacement followed by a repaint, and clear coat peeling cannot be properly repaired without a repaint of both the color coat and the clear coat.

At best, there is one of those problems with that coach, failed clear coat. At worst, both problems are present. My coach has checking, and I can live with it. It has not caused any clear coat peel. I do have some peel around the roof radii due to sun and weather, but none on the panels where checking exists.

This comes down to you seeing the coach in person and deciding if you can live with what you see, knowing how expensive it will be to fix correctly.

Trvlngnrs · 12-06-2021, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ljwt330

I am going to add to R.Wold’s response and say that it appears there are two related issues with the paint. The fiberglass defect which caused paint checking, especially in darker colors, was present in many coaches of that vintage and appears to be in this coach. Enlarge the picture showing the ladder at the rear, and the black by the window looks to be from the fiberglass defect. Can’t really be certain, however.

The peeling clear coat is a separate issue from paint checking, but extreme checking can lead to peeling. Here is the important part, both problems are expensive to repair properly. Checking cannot be resolved without panel replacement followed by a repaint, and clear coat peeling cannot be properly repaired without a repaint of both the color coat and the clear coat.

At best, there is one of those problems with that coach, failed clear coat. At worst, both problems are present. My coach has checking, and I can live with it. It has not caused any clear coat peel. I do have some peel around the roof radii due to sun and weather, but none on the panels where checking exists.

I was just going over the photos again and noticed what you are mentioning. My thought was that hot was a water leak in the window causing the damage, but I'm not very qualified to diagnose it. I was leaning to water leak, due to the location under the window.

Can you explain the checking? Is it fiberglass fibers coming loose and lifting the paint causing cracking or is it something else? It seems to be only in the dark colors, which leads me to believe it has something to do with heat.

Looking at all the photos he sent, under the window is the only area I see this type of damage. To my untrained eye, the rest looks like clear coat issues... not foundation issues. Except for the wall/roof juncture which is a paint issues.

bentjm · 12-07-2021, 05:16 AM

My understanding of the paint checking is:

The outside panels are a sandwich. The outside layer is thin fiberglass covered in gelcoat. It was the same basic stuff that was used in non-painted coaches. It was not really designed/tested to be fully painted.

When it was painted in darker colors, the heat gain from being out in the sun caused the gel coat under the paint to crack. Those cracks is what you are seeing in the paint. The paint itself is not cracked - the structure underneath is cracked. It is cosmetic in nature - not structural.

It is not cheap to rectify. It will affect the resale value of the coach.

Ljwt330 · 12-07-2021, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bentjm

My understanding of the paint checking is:

The outside panels are a sandwich. The outside layer is thin fiberglass covered in gelcoat. It was the same basic stuff that was used in non-painted coaches. It was not really designed/tested to be fully painted.

When it was painted in darker colors, the heat gain from being out in the sun caused the gel coat under the paint to crack. Those cracks is what you are seeing in the paint. The paint itself is not cracked - the structure underneath is cracked. It is cosmetic in nature - not structural.

It is not cheap to rectify. It will affect the resale value of the coach.

Agree with this description^^.

To the OP, I only offered up paint checking because of the year of the coach and the cracking by the window. I could not see closely enough the painted areas in the other photos to determine if checking is present. To be honest, the part by the window seems much more extreme than any I've seen on my own coach, but since it doesn't appear to be a bubble or delamination, it seems to be checking.

As mentioned, checking is purely cosmetic and does not necessarily lead to clear coat peel. It does result in a less than shiny, reflective paint coat, however. It was not a deal breaker for me as I was aware what it was, going in.

CaptainJerry · 12-07-2021, 02:22 PM

I agree with all said before. I own a one year newer Mountain Aire, also longer. If you are looking at gas coaches, and you know Newmar, you know that this coach is the top of the line in any brand in that era for gas. I have had mine for 10 years (2nd owner) and although I occasionally have diesel envy, I love it!

I have the clearcoat peeling along the roof radius, but no clearcoat peeling on the sides as I see in the photos. I store in covered parking and don't use it much.

The interior looks very nice, although sometimes photos can be deceiving.

The spidering below the window would be my big concern. If you can live with the sidewall clearcoat peeling, fine. If not, you can try your best at a DIY repair. I did with the front and rear caps and it lasted about 2 years. I think you could do better on the sidewalls, especially with the new 2 part rattlecan clearcoat. Be careful - wear a respirator. I did mine before the new 2 part clearcoat was available to the public. My next planned repair for the roof radius is colored bedliner applied with a roller.

For an '02 33 or 34 ft. coach, $32,000 seems about right given the current market, low mileage, 3 yr. old tires. I'd negotiate hard on the paint issue.

No way would I repaint unless you can do it cheap, like in Mexico. You would be putting way too much into a 19 year old coach on which you will never see a return.

Trvlngnrs · 12-07-2021, 03:08 PM

Excellent thoughts so far. I appreciate it very much. I'm glad to know it's only cosmetic... as it advances does it simply get more cracks or so they get deeper or longer?

If I purchase this, It's new home will be St George, UT where the summer time temps are 110+ degrees. Will a hot climate accelerate the cracking? I plan to park it on the side of the house, under of roof that will have partial walls, not a full garage. I could even extend sunblock fabric to the ground if it is direct sunlight that causes the damage.

I found a video that helps to explain what's happening

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usbpmuwMFb0

Regarding the spidering under the window, the owner assures me there has never been water leaks or intrusion, its not delaminating due to a leak at the window.

The photos are all recent, per the owner the coach is in great shape other than the sidewall issues.

One more question, it has 50amp power, but only has one A/C. Can I drop a second one in pretty simply? Again... I live in the desert!

Blessings guys!
Trvlngnrs

bentjm · 12-08-2021, 01:53 AM

Unless part of the coach has been exposed to the sun a lot less than the other side, what you see now is probably what you get.

I have had my 2005 MADP for three years and the parts that are cracked look the same as when I bought it.

Steve N Sal · 12-08-2021, 03:50 AM

Our 04 MACA had the same problems but mostly only on the darker paint. It was mainly on the sidewalls but the nose only on the passenger front had some starting. The rear had nothing at all. Our rails around the top had the clear coat peeling and we had that repainted. They can get into your wallet a bit if you really want to keep them looking good. JMHO

Trvlngnrs · 12-08-2021, 07:59 AM

Good to know! I contacted Newmar regarding the issue, here is their response: "As long as you maintain the integrity of the roof, and the window seals, the paint checking is only a cosmetic issue."

With all your input I feel comfortable moving forward with making an offer on the coach!

Trvlngnrs