Back-up lights

[Dudley do-right]

My latest problem showed up when I went to get my new inspection tag. As the examiner went through my exterior lights, he discovered that my back-up lights weren't working; hence no inspection sticker. So home I came to see if I could find the problem. When I went through the diagrams for the 12V wiring, I found no schematic that covered the exterior lights. When I looked at the fuse diagram, I found nothing noted for any external lights. Also, I'm thinking maybe there's a switch on the transmission that makes when you select reverse.
Before I start searching, maybe someone can help me keep from having to re-invent the wheel?
Dudley

[DrDaveMA]

Dudley, I see from your profile you have a 36' coach, but in order to assist you accurately we need to know what year.

The first thing I would check is do you have power to the lights, after that we are just guessing until we know the year.


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Dave, Bobbi and Fenway

[mbweitz]

Dudley
In a previous post you said you have a 2007 model. Ours is an '01, but the lights are probably the same. If all back-up lights failed at the same time you probably have a wiring problem. Otherwise I would check the light bulbs first - I changed mine recently. I got the lamps in the tail light cluster from NAPA. The back-up lamp at the bottom of the cluster and the direction indicator lamp at the top are both single filament T-3156. The center double filament brake lamp & tail/park lamp are T-3357. The rectangular back-up flood light lower down in the bumper is a sealed unit with no replaceable lamp. An RV repair shop got replacements for mine at a truck supply - readily available and not expensive.
Michael
2001 Alpine 36FDDS

[Dudley do-right]

It's a 36FDDS, '07, with the Vansco system

[Dudley do-right]

It's a 2007 36FDDS, and i"ll bet the prob. is somewhere in the Vantrex

[Old Scout]

I'll take your Vansco bet--when all else fails did you try "resetting" the Vansco modules?? [ie, turn off the chassis bat switch[es], wait a few seconds, then turn them on again...]

[Dudley do-right]

Re: old scout's suggestion: "been there, did that.", didn't help. I'm about ready to tear into the loom back there to see if there is some corrosion at the point where the L &R sides connect B/4 they go fwd. to the vansco in the batt. compartment. Since they work together, it makes sense they would be mated instead of running separately.

[ralph0808]

I had a similar problem with my left back-up light. When I was making my purchase & pre-delivery checks I noted that it wasn't working & the dealer said he would ship a sealed unit to my home address, which he did. But not sure when it started working again but it did, I had done a Vansco reboot for other reasons and may have solved the problem. Still have the sealed unit for a spare. I'm happy that it's working for now. But will be following the thread to see the final solution, may come back to haunt me in the future.


2005 Alpine 40 FDQS
Thanks
Ralph

[EngineerMike]

Reverse lamps are wired off a single rear VMM output, white wire #1149.
1149 = Back up lights in tail lights, rectangular Aux Backup Lights & middle pin on trailer 6-pin plug; light circuit uses ground #3435. Rear VMM P131/1&13 (two feeds from VMM) feeds circuit to splice in loom just after lower Rt VMM 35 pin connector; then branch C of circuit 1149 runs to splice 48 near rear of coach to branch off to Lt & Rt tail light assemblies, to lower rectangular backup lights, and to center pin of trailer plug
If one or more but not all of these lights is lit when in Reverse, then you have a problem in the loom. If none light up, could be loom (probably leg C between the two splices, could be feeds (would have to be two feeds in this case) from VMM.

[Dudley do-right]

Mike... This sounds like paydirt! I figured that somewhere there was a schematic of this Vansco assm. Looks like you have it, or know where to see it. However, if the in-tegrity of the Vansco isn't compromised in some way, then that means the problem could originate clear back at the source, i.e. the reverse button on the shift pad. I ran a hot jumper from the batt. to one hot connection on one back-up light, and they all lit, telling me they were all 4 connected, (no corrosion) and the grounds were good. So, now disc. the pin assm. at back vansco and hot jump it to prove conn. from there back? If OK, then I'm further down the rabbit hole...moving to front Vansco I guess. Oh, by the way the orange markers in the tail light assm. don't work either, but the safety inspection for my new sticker missed that, so I didn't dwell on it in my original post. I have since gotten the new sticker by returning for a re-inspection with a hidden manual hot jumper on the back-ups, activated at the proper time. This takes the heat off time -wise, since I had allowed my old sticker to lapse! Now we can use the coach without fear of a ticket, while I persue the solution at my leasure. I will mine you for info. as the search progresses. Thanks, DUDLEY.

[Old Scout]

By the way--the "orange markers" in your tail lights are the turn signals......

[Dudley do-right]

Hey old scout, you could be right, since I'm alays the one in the coach working the controls, and using someone else to tell me what's going on; however while doing some detective work yesterday, I turned on the parking lights, and noticed that the front orange lights in the headlight assm. came on, hence my thought that the rear orange would come on too...they didn't. (Rear bulb is single filament) The rear red lens/bulb is a double filament, meaning to me, that it is a stop/turn on one fiament, and a tailight on the other. So, I'm thinking my back-up light problem, and the rear orange lights not working, are somehow related. Have not persued eng. mikes tip yet.

[Old Scout]

Think that what Mike is trying to tell you is that the lights on the rear Vansco module will tell you whether the module is getting a signal from the source in the front--the Vansco system is both a communications and a power supply function for your coach. If you confirm that the appropriate light is blinking on the module, you will know that the comm module and the signal source [the tranny selector] are operating correctly--therefore no need to trouble shoot them.

Since the power module acts as a power supply with self-reseting "fuses", and all the back-up lights [those in the assembly and those sealed bulbs below] are all wired together with the trailer/toad plug, my "guess" is that you have a short in the wiring loom for one or more of those 5 items and it is kicking off the Vansco power circuit for the back-up light function. Think I would start with the wiring for the trailer plug and go from there to the individual lights--just a thought.
PS--the 2-filament bulb in the rear red lens is tail and brakes, the orange lens is turn signals--like most/all foreign vehicles. Otherwise, an orange marker light in the back could be confused with a vehicle facing you vs the one you are following.

[Dudley do-right]

It began to dawn on me after I made that post, that the twin filament bulb I men-tioned was as you say just a taillight and stoplight, with the yellow being turn.Otherwise, how would the extra stop bulb in the center work right?
Also, I guess what you're saying re the Vansco, is watch the signal lights on the front Vansco, while putting the tran. in rev, see which extra lights come on, note the number, then go to the rear, and see if the same number light(s) come on. So then what? How does that tell me how to diagnose the problem? I'm usually pretty good with low & high voltage electrical stuff, wiring, etc. but electronics is a different thing. perplexed Dudley do-right
P.S. I'm beginning to see what someone meant by the remark about liking the RV's better B/4 the Vanscos.