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Old 10-31-2020, 04:12 PM   #85
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...will try to attach a pic later....my 2003 [early 2002] looked just like yours, coming from the factory..early on, I used the main fuse block on the wall as a buss bar to distribute cables and eliminated the combiner solenoid cables--never really had to use that feature-- 17 years and 190K miles....have since added a negative buss bar for the negative house side when I upgraded the solar....
Thinking about what you wrote....

I could delete 13 & 14, then connect 16 & 19 to the house fuse where 15 connects. Wow! That's a significant improvement with nothing but a little sweat equity.


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Old 11-04-2020, 11:19 AM   #86
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So, does everyone agree that a high quality bus bar like Blue Sea, rated at 250A continuous, would be adequate for our alpine coaches?
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Old 11-04-2020, 11:31 AM   #87
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Blue Sea makes high quality components, so yes, more than adequate IMHO. Pictures of your finished wiring upgrade appreciated please...
This is something I've been wanting to do since we purchased, but everything works fine as is. Are you still replacing your inverter or are you still deciding on a model?
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Old 11-04-2020, 07:03 PM   #88
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My battery cable project won't happen until next year.
My inverter is working fine, but I just want to be prepared.....you know; 20 years old and everything.
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Old 11-04-2020, 09:41 PM   #89
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My battery cable project won't happen until next year.
My inverter is working fine, but I just want to be prepared.....you know; 20 years old and everything.
I understand. Sadly we just winterized too. Not to say we won't winter camp if we get a nice stretch of weather. Colleen loves to winter storm camp at LaPush, but the tribe has the whole place Covid shut down. One December trip planned for Salt Creek and maybe Winchester Bay too, shutdown dependent.
Funny, since you mentioned inverters ours took a dive. Still charges fine, just no pass thru circuit (again). Bypassed the sub panel into the unused washer/dryer breaker for now. SW2012 in my future....
Take Care. Mike and Colleen
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Old 11-04-2020, 10:06 PM   #90
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Thanks twinboat. Duhh, you are correct. As my diagram notes, those cables DID go to terminal 5.....but for some reason I had a momentary lapse of reason when I made the sketch yesterday.

Right now, both the chassis and house bank (+) each have at least 6 cables tied to the battery post.

Maybe I'm making a non-issue only because I haul the batteries twice a year. It is time consuming and kills my back to be leaning in there carefully color-coding and carefully isolating all the live cables. When I can be in a more temperate climate I won't be doing that any longer. Obviously it does work just fine as-is.

I'm also thinking a bus or two would be handy in the future if I go to lithium and relocate the batteries to the foot of the bed or something....or add more circuits, or expand to six 6-volt house batteries or whatever.
I dislike having multiple cables/wires "stacked" on a single post. IMO too many ways to get something wrong. I do have every cable labeled as to where it attaches, plus a diagram. In my 5th wheeler I have two Pos buss bard plus a Neg bus bar. The first Pos buss connects to the cutoff switch to the battery, all charging sources and most important loads, propane alarm, jacks and slides. This is connected to the 2nd Pos buss through a battery protect device that will open if voltage drops below a setting (12v by my choice). The 2nd Pos bus has all other loads and connections. The Neg bus goes the shunt then to battery and has all negative terminals.

I made the bus bars from 1 1/2 x 1/2" copper bar. Drilled and tapped them for 3/8" brass bolts. Used an electrically insulating plastic for mounting the bars. This way I was able to make them the length I wanted. Below is the basic 12 volt panel layout.

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Old 11-05-2020, 10:18 AM   #91
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Bear,
That is a nice handy schematic for anyone to use. Even I can understand it.
I like the way it's spread out so the relationship of the parts is easy to understand.

What are the PD things that need a 120A breaker?
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Old 11-05-2020, 10:35 AM   #92
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Bear,
That is a nice handy schematic for anyone to use. Even I can understand it.
I like the way it's spread out so the relationship of the parts is easy to understand.

What are the PD things that need a 120A breaker?
Glad you liked the drawing.

That 120 breaker is just a fail safe device between the converters and the bus. I have two converters wired in parallel a 70A and a 45A models, combined output is a possible 105A. Since I installed the solar system both of these converters have been turned off at the 120v breakers. Solar provides 100% of our 12 v power requirements.

As you can see I have perhaps more breakers & fuses than is really needed. I just like protecting the wiring system. Not totally clear in this drawing of the 12 v power panel is that I have the OEM 12v main fuse panel plus four more in various locations. A few 12v loads are protected with as small as 0.5A ATO fuses.
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Old 11-18-2020, 04:20 AM   #93
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Dear Andy and winemaker,
I just read this whole thread again and I noticed that none of us told you that the electrical schematics for several alpine years are on the Alpine coach association website.
That being said.....I don't know if you can trust them, since we all see a lot of variation.
It's like the pirate code: the diagrams are less of a strict rule and more of a guideline.
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Old 11-19-2020, 08:40 AM   #94
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I have been improving my drawing. One thing that I have learned since I started planning this project is that the inverter negative/ground should go directly to the battery. Mine goes to the ground lug on the battery box. The 2/0 ground from the batteries goes to the ground side of the starter. The out side of the house fuse goes to the inverter. I plan on reworking the cabling in the battery compartment when I have to replace my batteries.

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Old 11-19-2020, 12:52 PM   #95
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I have been improving my drawing. One thing that I have learned since I started planning this project is that the inverter negative/ground should go directly to the battery. Mine goes to the ground lug on the battery box. The 2/0 ground from the batteries goes to the ground side of the starter. The out side of the house fuse goes to the inverter. I plan on reworking the cabling in the battery compartment when I have to replace my batteries.
As long as you are doing all this work I'd plan ahead... Sooner or later you are going to want to split your grounds - when you add a shunt-based house battery monitor. That's the only way to have a true "gas gauge" for your house battery. I modified your drawing to show where the shunt goes. The *only* connection to the negative posts of the house battery will be the cable going to the shunt and the cable tying the two negative posts together.

So as you are doing this work I'd leave a 5 to 6 inches slack in the black cable where the shunt will be mounted. When it comes time, the installer will just cut the cable, mount the shunt, install the lugs on the cable, and bolt the lugs to the shunt.... and relocate the inverter negative cable to the ground side of the shunt.

As long as I was editing your drawing I consolidated the 5 vertical cables on the right side of your diagram into one.

Lastly, I marked the location for a manual disconnect for your house battery and a second for your chassis battery with a switch symbol.... one of those big red rotary switches like are used on boats will work just fine...

My coach has the standard dual remote disconnect panel that independently turns off the chassis and coach batteries but leaves the vampire loads active. This is fine for overnight or for when you are plugged into shore power...

However I also like to have a separate manual disconnect that turns *everything* off... for when the coach is in storage or for when you are doing work on the 12 volt systems. But that's just me... I've seen the results of what happens when a wrench gets dropped across a battery bank... half of it vaporizes.

The next round of electrical work on my coach will include adding a BRS (big red switch) to the chassis battery - I already have one on the house battery.

Mike
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Old 11-19-2020, 04:49 PM   #96
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As long as you are doing all this work I'd plan ahead... Sooner or later you are going to want to split your grounds - when you add a shunt-based house battery monitor. That's the only way to have a true "gas gauge" for your house battery. I modified your drawing to show where the shunt goes. The *only* connection to the negative posts of the house battery will be the cable going to the shunt and the cable tying the two negative posts together.

Lastly, I marked the location for a manual disconnect for your house battery and a second for your chassis battery with a switch symbol.... one of those big red rotary switches like are used on boats will work just fine...

Mike
I like your ideas. Thanks for sharing. I'm guessing I need a 200A shunt (2000 watt inverter). What say ye?
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Old 11-20-2020, 03:53 AM   #97
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That's pretty cool Mike & Andy.
When you finalize, can you post a higher - res version of your schematic?
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Old 11-20-2020, 08:18 AM   #98
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That's pretty cool Mike & Andy.
When you finalize, can you post a higher - res version of your schematic?
The image for my drawing is stored online. You can copy or download from the site.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Alp...tic%201-XL.png
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