Thank you 'Putybm', HWH jack retraction

[Beagle RC Air]

A big thank you for the work you did sorting thru the issues with stuck HWH jacks.
Our LR jack has been an ongoing problem for several years. First it was the warning about jack not being up and then it was really slow retraction. Then failure to retract without manual assistance. Yes, I wiped the shaft with silicon.
After doing all HWH manual tests it became very apparent that it was not a solenoid as the troubleshooting guide indicated. I did some wiring switching and hydralic line switching but still same problem. I did some searching and found Putybm's very comprehensive posts about piggyback springs and how the springs fixed the stuck cylinder. http://www.irv2.com/forums/f101/hwh-...ion-50237.html Century Springs # 5582 inside of the original springs really made the jack retract in record time. This is a rather tough job but well worth the effort.
If there is an internal modification to the clearance between the shaft and the packing then it makes me wonder why there has been no apparent acknowledgement from HWH. They must sell a ---t load of parts to fix this problem.

beagle

[Beagle RC Air]

Pubtym is the name of the poster who did the good work on piggy back springs. Sorry about the misspell. He also uncovered parts that were not of very high quality.
The Century Spring #5582 needs to have about 1/4" trimmed off of the loop on the end of the spring to facilitate getting it thru the hole on the round plate that contacts the ground. Century Spring has a minimum of 4 when you order. I have a couple of extras if anyone wants to give this mod a try.
Pubtym is the handle and I think he is on the Winnebago forum. Thanks again!

beagle

[Beagle RC Air]

Has anyone else tried Pubtym's advice on adding helper springs?

[Algoma]

I know this subject has been discussed endlessly but I would like to add some comments for anyone new to this.

First, the HWH website has a lot of information on how to treat the jacks and on acceptable retraction times. These times are long and probably exceed our patience, hence why we all think our jacks are defective. I have one rear that always takes much longer than the others but is still in spec.

Second, do not spray with silicone. This builds up over time and slows the jack down. Fully extend the jack and then spray with WD-40. The manual says to wipe off but I have found that spraying right before retracting works best.

Lastly, I have installed the new HWH springs but have not added the helper springs. I am sure they will help and can't do any harm so why not.

[Refuse1]

Beagle,

I am not finding any details about this spring doubling trick. Are there any pictures or details available about how this is done ?

Thanks,

Jeff

[Beagle RC Air]

Originally Posted by Refuse1

Beagle,

I am not finding any details about this spring doubling trick. Are there any pictures or details available about how this is done ?

Thanks,

Jeff

Jeff check your PM box.

beagle

[94-Newmar]

Adding more springs is only a temporary measure - the cylinder will eventually become so stiff that adding 10 springs to it won't raise it.... as I've discussed, along with 100's of other people's posts on various forums. the problem is not with the springs - it's the quality of the HWH piston wear ring, the rod end wear ring, seals and wipers. They shrink as they age and become so tight on the rod itself that it simply cannot overcome the friction. As it progresses they begin to roll up (think of placing a rubber band over your arm and roll it up to your shoulder area) and become so tight that you'll eventually need a 2 ton floor jack underneath the leveler pad to be able to get it to retract. Adding more springs simply buys you more time.

Any local hydraulic shop that rebuilds cylinders can rebuild the HWH hydraulic cylinders. There is nothing special or unique about them. Every one that I've had rebuilt for customers using good quality internals from a local shop will result in the cylinder retracting in less than 10 seconds. More importantly it will continue to function this way (as it should). I have some going on 10 yrs now and they still retract in less than 10-15 seconds with the OEM stock original springs.

[Beagle RC Air]

Originally Posted by 94-Newmar

Adding more springs is only a temporary measure - the cylinder will eventually become so stiff that adding 10 springs to it won't raise it.... as I've discussed, along with 100's of other people's posts on various forums. the problem is not with the springs - it's the quality of the HWH piston wear ring, the rod end wear ring, seals and wipers. They shrink as they age and become so tight on the rod itself that it simply cannot overcome the friction. As it progresses they begin to roll up (think of placing a rubber band over your arm and roll it up to your shoulder area) and become so tight that you'll eventually need a 2 ton floor jack underneath the leveler pad to be able to get it to retract. Adding more springs simply buys you more time.

Any local hydraulic shop that rebuilds cylinders can rebuild the HWH hydraulic cylinders. There is nothing special or unique about them. Every one that I've had rebuilt for customers using good quality internals from a local shop will result in the cylinder retracting in less than 10 seconds. More importantly it will continue to function this way (as it should). I have some going on 10 yrs now and they still retract in less than 10-15 seconds with the OEM stock original springs.

Appreciate your input. Confirms the sticky cylinder issues other have posted about. Having 25 plus years as hvy. equip. mechanic, I've dealt with equipment that had mostly hyd. components, I will say that single action cylinders are not difficult to diagnosis. For my money the add on springs are the way to go if you are inclined to want to wrestle with the installation. I can report back on the piggy back springs in year or so, but for now it is first cylinder on the panel to go out.

beagle

[Beagle RC Air]

A trip to the Washington State Fair with several stop coming and going confirmed the add on springs are the 'cats meow' when it comes to getting the jacks up and not having to deal with the annoying buzzer going down the road.

beagle

[Chuck 1935]

Originally Posted by Beagle RC Air

A trip to the Washington State Fair with several stop coming and going confirmed the add on springs are the 'cats meow' when it comes to getting the jacks up and not having to deal with the annoying buzzer going down the road.

beagle

Beagle
I am going to get the 5582's when Century Spring has them in stock. I am in the L.A. area and will pick them up in a couple of weeks.
I have been thinking about adding helper springs but have not gotten around too it. (read lazy) !
My question to you is.. What is the length of your rear HWH Springs when retracted ?
Mine are 16 inches so it would require a fairly good stretch on those 5582's which are 12 inches.
I don't envision having a problem doing it as I have had the round feet off in order to press them flat again.
With these facts do you have any sage advice ?

[Beagle RC Air]

Originally Posted by Chuck 1935

Beagle
I am going to get the 5582's when Century Spring has them in stock. I am in the L.A. area and will pick them up in a couple of weeks.
I have been thinking about adding helper springs but have not gotten around too it. (read lazy) !
My question to you is.. What is the length of your rear HWH Springs when retracted ?
Mine are 16 inches so it would require a fairly good stretch on those 5582's which are 12 inches.
I don't envision having a problem doing it as I have had the round feet off in order to press them flat again.
With these facts do you have any sage advice ?

Chuck,
The springs are 15" retracted. Jeff inquired about any tips for installation a few posts back. I can leave my ph.# in a PM and we can discuss this.
Feel free to call anytime.

Beagle

Beagle