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05-26-2020, 04:02 PM
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 3,026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAHL
Thanks for the responses. We are headed out this morning so next week I will get to checking more but in the meantime with the ignition switch off the input lights 4 and 17 ore on and output 19 is on. Also the PWR light is on and the NET light is blinking. I don't know where the secondary solidnoid is.
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I have the same lights with the ignition off. The photo shows lights on when ignition is on prior to starting engine.
Outputs 13, 14, which you mentioned as blinking with ignition off, are ignition power.
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05-26-2020, 04:11 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 7,396
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...strongly suggest you review post #14.....think the VANSCO "light investigation" is a "snipe hunt"....but your call......
__________________
Old Scout
2015 IH45 Foretravel
2003 Alpine 40' MDTS [Sold]
New Braunfels, Texas
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05-26-2020, 04:28 PM
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#17
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 3,026
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I read it. Also read where DAHL has VMM lights on when they shouldn’t be on. Coincidentally, those lights indicate the ignition is on when the ignition should be off.
I don’t care who comes up with the correct answer. We won’t know until the issue gets resolved. We’re all trying to help, right?
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05-26-2020, 04:53 PM
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#18
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 7,396
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Yup--"help" is my middle name, well actually its Duane.....know next to nothing about the inner workings of the Vansco system, but tend to view it as symptomatic rather than a root cause, except when it totally fails....just offering a real world scenario experienced by a fellow Alpiner….wasn't my intention to judge other ideas.....
__________________
Old Scout
2015 IH45 Foretravel
2003 Alpine 40' MDTS [Sold]
New Braunfels, Texas
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05-26-2020, 11:28 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lake Wales, FL
Posts: 3,113
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I have not seen where Dahl reset the VMM’s, has that been done? If the key is in the off position the 13, 14 lights should not be blinking.
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Dave, Bobbi and Fenway
2005 38' FDTS Alpine Limited, 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited
Lake Wales, FL
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05-27-2020, 07:49 AM
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#20
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 3,026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDaveMA
I have not seen where Dahl reset the VMM’s, has that been done? If the key is in the off position the 13, 14 lights should not be blinking.
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DAHL has to turn the chassis battery switch to the open position to shut down the engine. Also, it was mentioned in post #12 that “Turning off the battery switch resets everything.”
From that, I would surmise that a reset has occurred.
Swapping VMM positions, front to rear, could solve the problem. Output circuits 13 & 14 on the front unit control Blower 3 and Alarm Audio, respectively. If that fixes the ignition issue, it would be reasonable to conclude that circuits 13 & 14 on the, now front VMM, are malfunctioning. If the ignition issue still exists after the swap, the problem lies elsewhere.
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05-27-2020, 08:38 AM
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#21
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Senior Member
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 545
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Interesting little mystery you have here DAHL. I think Dean may be on to something about corrosion in a connector and maybe heard the same story a couple years ago from the owner. I searched the forum but didn't find any more about it.
For my two cent opinion (provided for free) I think your Vansco is fine. Blinking outputs (13 - 14 in your case) indicates a diagnostic fault condition on those 2 output circuits. A fault can be short, open, back feed, over current or no power detected. I would start looking for bad connections (loose, corroded, oil soaked, bent pins .. ) and damaged wires starting at the rear Vansco connector.
LED 13 - 14 are pins #10 and #11 (top row) of the large connector on the RH side of the Vansco. The wires enter the loom and are markd IGN-R1_A and IGN-R1_B. The next place they show up is at the fuse panel in your battery bay at something marked "280 MICRO RELAY" on the drawing now marked IGN-R1_C. It is in the lower LH corner. I don't know how many connections are on the backside of that relay (could be 4-6) but those relay connections lead to other multi pin connectors, a 50 pin "ECM OEM PORT" (pin 39), and four pin "ECM POWER" (pin 4) and I think a 32 pin "TRANS ECU".
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Carter & Patty
'05 Alpine Limited 36FDTS + '19 Jeep Cherokee
FMCA, ACA & NOWACA
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05-27-2020, 09:11 AM
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#22
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Member
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Dayton Nv.
Posts: 58
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I believe the flashing outputs indicate that both have a current draw of over 6amp, which causes the vansco into a time out and then it will recheck the circuit again. So I think Dahl needs to start looking at both outputs first.
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Mountain Mike
Dayton Nv.
2004 36ft MDDS
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05-27-2020, 11:34 AM
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#23
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Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 23
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Once again thank you everyone for al the help. I did find the problem. I replaced both solid state relays in the battery compartment and that fixed the problem, now the engine will start and stop with the key. I am not sure which relay was bad as I replaced both. I am going to get two more and keep them as spares just in case this happens again. Then I will replace them one at a time. Thanks again for all the help and I am sure there will be more questions. Don Dahl, 2006 Alpine Apex FDQS #595
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05-27-2020, 12:16 PM
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#24
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 7,396
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….very good news and perhaps ground-breaking in the history of Alpine trouble-shooting ...could you post a picture of the offending relays?
__________________
Old Scout
2015 IH45 Foretravel
2003 Alpine 40' MDTS [Sold]
New Braunfels, Texas
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05-27-2020, 01:18 PM
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#25
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Modesto, CA
Posts: 257
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Don,
Would you please post a photo of said relay’s and advise where you purchased. I think I need to carry spares also. Thanks!
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05-27-2020, 05:52 PM
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#26
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Senior Member
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 545
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Did the Vansco output LED's #14 and #15 stop blinking too?
__________________
Carter & Patty
'05 Alpine Limited 36FDTS + '19 Jeep Cherokee
FMCA, ACA & NOWACA
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05-28-2020, 12:40 PM
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#27
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Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 23
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Alpine engine won't shut off.
Well it looks like I spoke too soon with the fix re relays. it worked once so thought problem solved. Today took coach to fuel up and when I got home it would not shut off when I turned the key off. I wiggled the wires around both relays but no go so that must not be it. As I understand it I can swap the front for the back and if so that's my next try. I would send a picture of the relays but don't know how. It's all I can do to work the PC. I am 80 and old school. Don Dahl, Alpine Apex 40 FDQS
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05-28-2020, 02:56 PM
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#28
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 7,396
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So here is an "old school tip" …..stop worrying about the blinking lights and check the multi-pin connector on the ECM for corrosion [smile]….
__________________
Old Scout
2015 IH45 Foretravel
2003 Alpine 40' MDTS [Sold]
New Braunfels, Texas
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