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Old 10-14-2021, 07:49 AM   #1
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2016 Tiffin Phaeton 44OH Slide Issue

So this could be a little long but I got to paint the entire picture of the passenger rear Schwimmer (LCI) problem. Bought this coach in April this year. No issues during PDI checked multiple times everything including the day of pickup. Had taken out on several trips before the following: (BTW never an issue deploying the slide only during retracting it never had an issue at home only on the road.
(1st time failure) slide deployed no issue several days later while retracting it front of slide stopped after a few inches of so back would continue without issue but stopped to avoid binding it. Deployed and retracted same thing. Thinking it might be a sync problem deployed fully retracted as much as it would but wouldn't fully retract so I gently helped it along from the outside while DW pushed switch inside. T
Next stop synced going out and in then deployed fully and synced seem to work...several days later closing things up same issue again, in a few inches and stopped. So closed it up as before. Did not look at controller faults unfortunately just didn't think of it.
Dealer felt it was controller for slide replaced it.
(2nd time) no issues retracting at dealers before leaving nor at home several times I checked. Left for 2 plus month trip back to NE worked at our 4 stops on the way up to NE first stop in NH after 2 week layover went to retract same issue again but this time checked controller and fault per LEDs stated motor 2 ir wire harness shorted.. Had to push it in. Left slide in for rest of trip back to dealer this time dealer diagnosis was the Motor this time. Installed new motor checked wire harness could find any issues.
(3rd which is still in process) dealer pick up and at home close up no issues. First stop for 2 days no issues yesterday after 10 day stop same issue closing up but with a twist and not a good one. Tried first time would only retract at the front of the slide a few inches like other failure times. Redeploy had DW pushed while I went outside to gently pursue it to go in but this time nothing. No movement. Checked everything I could find nothing... fault code on controller thus time said shorted ground at wall switch. Called Tiffin slide spoke to support tried several things he stated need a mobile tech. Called dealer nothing different than Tiffin so called LCI support swapped controllers from drivers side to Passenger side no change. Verified Power to controller measured 13.4 he thought that it should be more in the mid 12 but coach was not only plugged in but on so then swapped motor 1 connector with motor 2 nothing. Disconnected motor 2 checked pin out for signal while wife pressed inside switch nothing he felt it could either be the switch or a wire leading to it at this time. In the end he felt it was time for a mobile tech. Unfortunately none available for over a week so decided to pull both motors pushed in slide made some 2x4 blocks to keep it in while driving. Though I'm pretty handy not just electrically I decided to forego trying to run it to ground so we can finish the trip just in case I caused more issues. Dealer is waiting for it when I get back but everyone from LCI to Tiffin on back to dealer seems perplexed on the cause. BTW the shorted Hall switch to ground did follow to the other controller thus was a different failure mode than on the past failure which was shorted more or wiring harness..
So anyone run across this type of failure before or does anyone have any ideas I'd sure like to hear them. My two cents to the dealer is I didn't feel changing out the controller the first time or the motor second time fixed it based on the way they failed but each time worked for a while. Thanks for your help.
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Old 10-14-2021, 08:03 AM   #2
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Our coach is basically the same layout as yours, just shorter. Is this by chance the large bed slide? I had the same issue and the problem was a kinked wire under the bed. On ours, they tightly bunched the motor controller wires with the ones for electric, 12v, Spyder, etc that move in and out with the bed. I removed them from the bundle and secured them in a loop to the floor and have not had a problem for almost two years. The motor wires do not need to move with the bed, so securing them to the floor kept them from kinking more. Unfortunately, I didn't take any photos of the repair. It's not easy to get to as you have to remove the "floor" of the bed slide to reach the wires.
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Old 10-14-2021, 04:54 PM   #3
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My ds rear slide has been wonky for years and never shows a code. Mine is notorious for retracting several inch's then quitting. As Dan says, you can tear your bed apart and check the wiring. I did that a couple years ago, its a mess, but saw nothing that would prompt a wiring issue for me.
You did not say if you deployed the emergency retract (or extend) at the controller when the slide acts up. This will certainly let you know if its a motor or harness. Mine retracts fine when I use this feature. Then I do the whole re-sync thing. Most times it works, sometimes it doesn't.
Rinse and repeat.
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Old 10-14-2021, 09:26 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Props2 View Post
My ds rear slide has been wonky for years and never shows a code. Mine is notorious for retracting several inch's then quitting. As Dan says, you can tear your bed apart and check the wiring. I did that a couple years ago, its a mess, but saw nothing that would prompt a wiring issue for me.
You did not say if you deployed the emergency retract (or extend) at the controller when the slide acts up. This will certainly let you know if its a motor or harness. Mine retracts fine when I use this feature. Then I do the whole re-sync thing. Most times it works, sometimes it doesn't.
Rinse and repeat.
Unfortunately or fortunately depending how you look at it it's the passenger slide which includes the dresser, TV and double sinks and vanity. Basically impossible to look at anything whether in our out because very little space without taking the heavy wooden trim off. I did use the G6 card emergency retract button before and it did retract it and all the others but this time tried it several times to no avail pulled the other 3 slides in but not this one. I agree that this is probably an odd wiring issue or possibly a bad switch on the spyder panel. There's only storage under our bed that flips up to access it no wiring there.
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Old 10-14-2021, 10:39 PM   #5
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The wiring is under your bed access. You have to do some disassembly to get to the screws to remove those bottom access panels.
Does the 2016 models not use the controllers pictured here? This is where you can do the emergency retract.( or extend) if you have not tried it.





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Old 10-14-2021, 10:44 PM   #6
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Well here is the link. I guess the picture did not load up.



https://www.amazon.com/Lippert-Compo.../dp/B01LOIX79M
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Old 10-14-2021, 11:54 PM   #7
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Angry

Quote:
Originally Posted by Props2 View Post
Well here is the link. I guess the picture did not load up

https://www.amazon.com/Lippert-Compo.../dp/B01LOIX79M
Yes same controllers tried the emergency retract with the passenger side rear controller, as well, 6 times hold on 7th press switch inside several times to no avail. The controllers for both rear electric slides are underneath the passenger slide that doesn't work. In fact with LCI support on the phone we reverse the the wiring before the two controllers to no avail
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Old 10-23-2021, 10:53 AM   #8
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So on my 2plus month trip to NE this summer I had issues with this same slide whereas I came home and they replaced the motor to no avail but I had an instance on my way home where no of the slides would deploy so I used the emergency deploy button on the G6 cartwright deployed all the slides bypassing all the interior switches. With help from Tiffin we found the issue and all the slides worked find afterwards except that one electric o e need help back in. I tried it this time but it only deployed 3 of the 4 slides. The problem slide did nothing this time. I was thinking it could be a problem with the wall switch or wiring to the controller but I tried to deploy them all with the G6 button and it didn't work. Does anyone know the relationship of the G6 card in the compartment underneath the driver's seat. Perhaps maybe have some drawings? Does using the G6 bypass the wall switch completely? Thoughts?
Thxs
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Old 10-23-2021, 11:01 PM   #9
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The G6 slide bypass would definitely bypass the switches, so you can rule that out. The fact that the other three slides deploy leaves a bit of a mystery. Its going to take a meter to identify if the G6 is actually outputting 12v to the controller, which can be measured at the controller itself. Next, is the controller sending the 12v out to the motors. If yes on both accounts, its a pretty sure bet this is a wiring issue. You have had a motor replaced and verified the controller with a known good controller already, plus the slide was working. IDK, to me it seems like a wiring issue and that may not be easy to locate. Let us know what you find.
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Old 10-23-2021, 11:37 PM   #10
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After re-reading your entire post again, something stuck me. You said in one instance none of your slides retracted using the G6. At the G6, do you have a "slides ready" led? Was it lit? I believe in 2016 they started using a safety relay that looks for your "ignition on" and "parking brake set". This would be built in to the G6 card. So maybe a wonky G6 card? Or a erratic signal from either of those, if the led was not lit? Interesting.
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Old 10-25-2021, 10:40 PM   #11
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Quote:
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After re-reading your entire post again, something stuck me. You said in one instance none of your slides retracted using the G6. At the G6, do you have a "slides ready" led? Was it lit? I believe in 2016 they started using a safety relay that looks for your "ignition on" and "parking brake set". This would be built in to the G6 card. So maybe a wonky G6 card? Or a erratic signal from either of those, if the led was not lit? Interesting.
In my Post #8 I stated that originally none of the slides would deploy, I don't see anywhere that I stated they wouldn't retract, although I'm old... When they wouldn't deploy I used the G6 emergency deploy button and all the slides worked at that time. In fact they came back in after I worked with tiffin Slide support for over an hour to reseat some connectors after checking some points out. But the next stop that rear passenger slide wouldn't come back in after deploying with the switch so I was back to square one when I returned.
I was on the phone with Charles from Tiffin Slides today was helpful in me better understanding the Spyder System, which IMHO is way to complicated for what it has to acheive. A simpler approach with less interfaces to me would be easier to troubleshoot. Anyway I ruled out the Wall Switch and feel it has an issue coming from the G6 Card to the Controller since I could see the G6 card received the input from the switch when we tested it today. Off to the dealer and sit down with their tech to get this resolved once and for all I hope but they need to be willing to contact Tiffin Support, as well if they need help.
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Old 10-25-2021, 11:10 PM   #12
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Since you have traced the signal back to the G6 panel, a bad controller board is a distinct possibility. That's one of the things I had to do to ours early on is replace that board. It's the top one in the G6 panel and controls power to all slides and has inputs for parking brake and ignition. There are also two or three small plug in relays that could be the problem. You might try switching out a couple of them to see if the problem moves to another slide.
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Old 10-25-2021, 11:38 PM   #13
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Since you have traced the signal back to the G6 panel, a bad controller board is a distinct possibility. That's one of the things I had to do to ours early on is replace that board. It's the top one in the G6 panel and controls power to all slides and has inputs for parking brake and ignition. There are also two or three small plug in relays that could be the problem. You might try switching out a couple of them to see if the problem moves to another slide.
Funny you mentioned that you mentioned that when I spoke to Tiffin Support today I mentioned whether the G6 board uses a relays that may be sticking causing the original intemittent problem with the front motor on the slide and now that neither of the two motors were working on the slide if it's the same relay. Unfortunately because I had to disconnect the two motors while on my trip in order to move after some extensive Troubleshooting by myself and with Tiffin and LCI I had no choice so I could start the trek home being about 700 miles away. I'm learning from input from Tiffin, LCI and yourself as well as others. Wish I had my garage built I might've tackled finding this issue myself since I enjoy resolving issues like this but back to the dealer for them since it's a warranty issue. I'll pass this information along about the relay. I suggested replacing the entire board to the Tiffin support guy and he said that could be the issue or a wire. Maybe some relay swapping might be a better alternative. Thxs
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Old 10-29-2021, 08:14 AM   #14
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Well its back with the dealer on Tuesday and they started to put it back together and troubleshoot the slide issue. We had a nice long talk which included discussion on all the input from everyone as I tried to fix this on the road including from Tiffin As well as LCI and from this forum. My theory based on the latest failure that none of the motors worked and pretty much eliminated the wall switch as an issue that its either a bad G6 board (relay possibly) or wiring issue from G6 to controller. I based this on the last bit of troubleshooting I did with Tiffin on Monday. Pushing the interior wall switch i saw the G6 board appropriate LED off and on as my DW hit the button on both electric slides. This to me is an indication that the G6 is getting the signal from the wall switch. But didn't have time to verify that the controller was getting the signal from the G6 card. All this was passed onto the dealer Service lead so I hope they can find it this time once and for all. I'm waiting patiently.
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