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08-21-2018, 07:15 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Frankfort, KY
Posts: 1,906
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Tag axle, what's it worth
Having a hard time between a Newmar Ventana with a tag, and a Phaeton without a tag. I know the saying, no one with a tag said they ever wished they didn't have a tag but I have to ask the other way around, what about you that have a 40 foot plus Tiffin without a tag. We haven't owned a coach before and trying to make the right decisions first. Went on a two hour drive this weekend on a Tiffin Bus 45LP with a tag but it was a 2014. Also looking at a Newmar 2018 Ventana 44 ft with a tag. The wife and I would like to get a newer model and looking at Phaeton's, 2017, but wonder how much we would miss a tag axle. Are we making too much of a big deal out of this? Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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08-21-2018, 07:46 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Gulf Streamers Club
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 19,925
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A tag axle not only gives a smoother ride but more directional stability driving down the road. It also gives more weight carrying capacity with the load spread over two axles and 6 tires instead of 4.
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Bob & Donna
'98 Gulf Stream Sun Voyager DP being pushed by a '00 Beetle TDI
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08-21-2018, 07:55 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Country Coach Owners Club Solo Rvers Club iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 37,725
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Depending on the rig it's either a big difference or no difference.
I've had both and the tag is a definate plus. But then the MH weighs 12,000#'s more unloaded than my 40' DSDP did loaded plus it has 300 hp and 900 ft lbs torque more. 350/1050 vs 650/1950.
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2009 45' Magna 630 w/Cummins ISX 650 HP/1950 Lbs Ft, HWH Active Air
Charter Good Sam Lifetime Member, FMCA,
RV'ing since 1957, NRA Benefactor Life, towing '21 Jeep JLU Rubicon Ecodiesel
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08-21-2018, 08:06 PM
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#4
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Community Moderator
Newmar Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Point Pleasant Beach, NJ
Posts: 31,546
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With a tag you will also have two more tires when you make an emergency stop. I love the stability of the tag. Crosswinds and semi's passing you don't cause sway.
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Tony & Ruth........... FMCA#F416727
2016 London Aire 4519, Freightliner chassis, Cummins ISX, 2018 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited, Blue Ox Avail with AF1. TST 507 TPMS
No amount of money can buy you an extra second of time.
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08-21-2018, 08:09 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Fleetwood Owners Club Freightliner Owners Club
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Texas
Posts: 4,283
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No tag here. Plenty of storage without. Less weight. Less tires to replace. Better mpg. Handles very good. Easier to park. Been in any tight spaces and parks, this year, if we had a tag and we would not have been able to park or manuever.
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Full Timers.
2015 Fleetwood Discovery 40E on a Freightliner XCS chassis with a Cummins ISL9 pulling 1 and/or 2 motorcycles, '07 Honda Accord OR a 17' Runabout Boat.
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08-21-2018, 08:30 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 388
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiesta48
No tag here. Plenty of storage without. Less weight. Less tires to replace. Better mpg. Handles very good. Easier to park. Been in any tight spaces and parks, this year, if we had a tag and we would not have been able to park or manuever.
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+1 Have plenty enough ccc in a new Phaeton without a tag and more room. Never experienced handling problems even in 40mph cross winds.
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08-21-2018, 09:41 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Monaco Owners Club Newmar Owners Club Texas Boomers Club Spartan Chassis
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: New Braunfels, Texas
Posts: 1,308
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My 40 foot with tag steers tighter than a previous 40 foot I owned without tag. But then the newer tags, like on the DS have passive steer. I’m not sure if the one on the Ventana has that feature. But you are getting an extra set of brakes and the Newmar comes with Comfort Drive as well and an escape door instead of a window.
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Dan & Linda
FMCA 399045 NKK 22240
2020 Dutch Star 4081 - Spartan K2
2017 Dutch Star 4018 - Sold - Towing Jeep Grand Cherokee Trailhawk
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08-22-2018, 06:08 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Entegra Owners Club
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: If I'm not here, I'm somewhere else.
Posts: 1,222
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I lost no storage room in the basement after upgrading to a tag. I actually have more room with only 2 feet longer total length.
I have no problems even with some tight turns in an RV park because the weight is removed from the tag at slow speeds.
But even if both statements above were false (they're not), I would still get a tag for the sheer driving pleasure.
JMHO
__________________
Ken & Laurie
North in summer, Home in Silver Springs, FL in the Winter
2022 Riverstone 39RKFB - 2022 RAM 3500 Dually Laramie
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08-22-2018, 06:32 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Chester, VA/Zephyrhills, FL
Posts: 1,330
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My 2017 Ventana 4369 has passive steer tag, 400 hp with 1250 lbs torque and handles exceptionally. Would not ever consider another coach without a tag and comfort drive. Currently on 5 month trip with over 7000 miles so far and not one complaint about ride or handling. We have been in all kinds of weather and road conditions. You will not regret the tag or the Ventana.
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Tom and Gloria 2022 Newmar Dutch Star 4081, TOAD: 2017 Buick Enclave/2023 GMC Sierra Denali, Blue Ox Towbar, Baseplate and M&G Braking System
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08-22-2018, 08:19 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Fulltime/ SE Minnesota
Posts: 3,120
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Tag only for us, for all the many benefits.
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08 Foretravel Nimbus 40 ft tag axle / 1000 watts of solar
2019 Ram 1500 Big Horn Hemi 4x4
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08-22-2018, 09:01 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Tiffin Owners Club Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Las Cruces, NM
Posts: 4,040
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A 40 ft Ventana with a tag vs a 40 ft Phaeton - is that your question.
The benefits of a tag axle are many and covered in the response above but the benefits are more to a coach longer than 42 ft. The big negative in shorter coaches is that a tag axle takes up storage space. In the comparison above, the Phaeton will have much more basement storage available and will probably drive about the same.
If you are talking about a 42-45 ft coach, a tag axle is standard in that length.
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Roger & Mary
2017 Winnebago Navion 24V (Sold)
2014 Tiffin Phaeton 36GH (Sold)
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08-22-2018, 09:07 AM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: North Central Florida
Posts: 830
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Personally, I prefer to have a tag for the additional stability and ride comfort, plus I have less concern when loading for a trip.
I have a much older "vintage" coach, and for the older class A rigs there is no comparison.
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08-22-2018, 09:20 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 2,552
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandss
Having a hard time between a Newmar Ventana with a tag, and a Phaeton without a tag. I know the saying, no one with a tag said they ever wished they didn't have a tag but I have to ask the other way around, what about you that have a 40 foot plus Tiffin without a tag. We haven't owned a coach before and trying to make the right decisions first. Went on a two hour drive this weekend on a Tiffin Bus 45LP with a tag but it was a 2014. Also looking at a Newmar 2018 Ventana 44 ft with a tag. The wife and I would like to get a newer model and looking at Phaeton's, 2017, but wonder how much we would miss a tag axle. Are we making too much of a big deal out of this? Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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My advice only comes from countless hours of reading RV forums before I decided to buy my first RV (Thor ACE) and leading up to the purchase of my second one ('19 Ventana -- taking delivery next week).
What I've gathered from all that reading, including a ton when I was searching on 40' vs 43' RVs and the like, is that from a handling perspective, the tag certainly is better, but in general most people seem to say get the floorplan that fits you and that should be the primary consideration.
I can probably count on one hand, out of many thousands of posts I have read, where someone has said, "I love my coach, but for the fact it doesn't have a tag axle." Most will agree that it gives you better stability, but not to the point where driving without one is unpleasant or makes a buyer next time around say, "I have to get a coach with a tag."
So, I would caution you about focusing too much on the tag vs non-tag, but instead focus on floor plan, which coach you think has a better quality reputation, which one has a reliable dealer you can get service from (not them claiming to be reliable, but reports on IRV2 of reliably addressing issues). If it's a used coach, that's out of warranty, the dealer part may be less important, as you can go to independent mechanics for repairs.
__________________
2019 VTDP 4369 (Spartan)
Wrangler JLU / AF1 Braking / Rock Hard Bumper
2018 Thor ACE 30.3
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08-22-2018, 11:27 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 266
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The tag axle allows the vehicle to be heavier, very important on a 43 footer or up. What is important is how much the empty coach can carry and still be under max weight.
You normally trade off a cargo bay for a tag axle. With a tag, you have to replace more tires, there is maintenance associated with the tag air mechanism. It is a compromise, but how will you really use your coach? I have never had any handling problems with a two axle coach and have driven thousands of miles across windy Texas and other places.
40 foot coaches are more maneuverable than 43 and 45 footers, and the Tiffin coaches with the PowerGlide have a very tight turning radius.
In every campground we stop, we can usually see a coach that has hit something maneuvering in tight quarters, for a first time coach owner, I would be leery about going over 40 feet. Does your wife intend to drive and can she handle a big rig?
Sorry to raise a lot of questions, it's intended to help you think through the purchase...……
Full disclosure, one of the coaches you posted for sale is ours, and it's a wonderful coach.
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