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Old 04-13-2023, 05:52 PM   #1
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Upgrading Tiffin RED to lithium

I have a 2020 Tiffin 33AA and the wet cell batteries have died. I’ve ordered 2 new battleborn batteries, a smartshunt and charger. (All recommended by sales rep)

I know I can drop in the batteries. Where should I install the smart shunt and charger? Before or after the existing electronics?

I have a magnum inverter plus solar with the jaboni controller.

Thanks,
Jerry
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Old 04-13-2023, 11:52 PM   #2
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One end of the smart shunt should be connected to the negative terminal of your battery bank. The other terminal should be connected to all of the grounds, which were previously connected to the negative terminal. It's important that nothing is connected directly to his negative terminal, since that would allow unmeasured power, which would throw off your current consumption and state of charge calculations.

Once you get it installed you need to determine your worst case alternator draw, if it's more then 60 amps you should install an LBIM or DC to DC charger, and disable your merge function.
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Old 04-14-2023, 01:33 PM   #3
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One end of the smart shunt should be connected to the negative terminal of your battery bank. The other terminal should be connected to all of the grounds, which were previously connected to the negative terminal. It's important that nothing is connected directly to his negative terminal, since that would allow unmeasured power, which would throw off your current consumption and state of charge calculations.

Once you get it installed you need to determine your worst case alternator draw, if it's more then 60 amps you should install an LBIM or DC to DC charger, and disable your merge function.
Thanks this makes more sense now that you explain it. , I did buy the dc-dc charger. Here is a diagram that Battleborn sent me
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So, negative goes to shunt, which goes on the existing connections.

How do I find the wire coming from the alternator?
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Old 04-14-2023, 05:41 PM   #4
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The schematic shows the supply side connects to the chassis battery, not to the alternator. So, there is no need to find the alternator conductors.

Put another way, the house battery is charged from the chassis battery via the DC/DC charger. The chassis battery is charge by the alternator. You'll have to remove the charge mechanism from the alternator to the house battery.

Good luck.
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2015 Tiffin Breeze 28BR
'03 Country Coach Magna 6298 - SOLD
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Old 04-14-2023, 06:25 PM   #5
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Ok, got it. How do I identify the charging wire from the alternator? Is it the one with the magnum logo?
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Old 04-14-2023, 10:22 PM   #6
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Attachment 390414

Ok, got it. How do I identify the charging wire from the alternator? Is it the one with the magnum logo?
No need to identify the charging wire from the alternator. The battery monitor measures net current into, and out of the battery bank. There can be any number of chargers and many power consumers, but the battery monitor only measures the net, which it does by having all of the current going through the shunt.

You can deduce your max alternator charging current by draining your batteries down to 5 or 10%, then turn on anything you are likely to have on for an extended period while driving, notice the current. Then start the engine. Take the current drain without the engine running and add that to the charging current, that total is your max alternator current.
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Old 04-15-2023, 03:08 PM   #7
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There will be no charging wire from the alternator. What you pointed out was a tempeture sensor for your Magnum inverter/charger.

You need to find your isolation/bridging/charging solenoid and disable it. Then use the chassis cable side of it for your battery to battery charger.
If you leave the original isolation / bridging /charging solenoid connected, it will by pass the B to B charger and your alternator will have no limiter to the house batteries.

Push boost switch on and off while listening for the clunking solenoid. That's the isolstion/bridging/charging/boost starting solenoid.
Pretty busy device.

PS: How many AHs of lithium are you installing. Your inverter/charger may need more the 200 amps to give you full output and most 100 AH lithiums are rated for 100 amp draw.
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Old 04-15-2023, 03:48 PM   #8
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There will be no charging wire from the alternator. What you pointed out was a tempeture sensor for your Magnum inverter/charger.

You need to find your isolation/bridging/charging solenoid and disable it. Then use the chassis cable side of it for your battery to battery charger.
If you leave the original isolation / bridging /charging solenoid connected, it will by pass the B to B charger and your alternator will have no limiter to the house batteries.

Push boost switch on and off while listening for the clunking solenoid. That's the isolstion/bridging/charging/boost starting solenoid.
Pretty busy device.

PS: How many AHs of lithium are you installing. Your inverter/charger may need more the 200 amps to give you full output and most 100 AH lithiums are rated for 100 amp draw.
I’m installing 2 X 100aH batteries. I’ll install more at a later time. For now, I just want to replace the 4 wet cell batteries with the 2 lithium

Where would I find the “boost” switch? What does it do?
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Old 04-15-2023, 04:21 PM   #9
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I’m installing 2 X 100aH batteries. I’ll install more at a later time. For now, I just want to replace the 4 wet cell batteries with the 2 lithium



Where would I find the “boost” switch? What does it do?
May be labled Aux Start, most are right on the dash.
It's used to boost start the generator or Main engine, if either battery is run down.
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Old 04-15-2023, 05:46 PM   #10
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May be labled Aux Start, most are right on the dash.
It's used to boost start the generator or Main engine, if either battery is run down.
Ok, I call it the “bridge switch”. It bridges the batteries. I know where that is.

Thanks
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Old 04-18-2023, 07:00 PM   #11
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Ok, I’m pretty disappointed.

The boost or bridge solenoid is pretty sophisticated, and it’s going to be a big job. This is NOT a drop in job. I’ll have to hire someone. :(
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Old 04-19-2023, 12:05 AM   #12
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Ok, I’m pretty disappointed.

The boost or bridge solenoid is pretty sophisticated, and it’s going to be a big job. This is NOT a drop in job. I’ll have to hire someone. :(

With 2 100ah batteries you probably don't have any issues with too much alternator draw. See my above description for how to measure it. If the current is too high then you can just cut the control wire on the merge relay until you add an LBIM or DC to DC charger.

If you install a LBIM you get the aux start easily. For a DC to DC it's a bit trickier to maintain the AUX start. You can call Tiffin. When I called they sent me the schematics and drawing of the panel that has the merge relay and described what I needed to do. I have a 2015 32SA so it's likely different.

Your statement that it's not a drop in replacement is true. It's not rocket science, you can do it, you just need to decide if you want to figure it out and do the work, or pay someone.
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Old 04-26-2023, 08:20 PM   #13
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I have lithiums installed in my 2019 Red 37pa in October 2020. The Spyder system controls the battery merge. I contacted Spyder before I had my solar/lithium installed by an AmSolar installer. They said nothing needed to be done regarding the alternator. I would suggest you contact Spyder to see if the 2020 models have any changes. From my observation the Spyder system never engages the alternator when driving because the house batteries never get to a low enough voltage for the Spyder system to invoke a join. I’ve seen the Spyder system join the the batteries when the chassis batteries get to a lower voltage during extended stays. On days I’ve traveled and turned off the solar the house batteries discharge due to the residential fridge. When the solar is turned on I usually arrive at a destination campground 100% charged unless it’s a cloudy day.
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