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01-26-2025, 03:06 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 104
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Broken down in west Arkansas hwy 40 welcome center
2005 intrigue Verona power steering suddenly stopped working. Drove it a few miles without power steering to get to the east bound 40 welcome center near Van Buren this morning. Because it stopped working suddenly I'm thinking it might be a PTO driven pump failure. Had a leaking bearing seal earlier that was repaired in September 2023. Time to change the 3 Hydraulic filters but because it stopped suddenly I'm thinking the problem is either a pto driven pump failure. Or perhaps a failure in the powersteering gear box. When the pto driven pump bearing seal was replaced the shop said my dry spline was good without gauling and they didn't know how to do the wet lube conversion so, they just applied antisieze on the spline. I have a repair guy coming Monday morning and hope he is better than the last place that worked on it. Any suggestions on how to diagnose is the problem in the power steering gearbox or in the PTO DRIVEN pump or somewhere else? I think the coolant temp also went up about 10 deg when limping to the welcome center so that points more toward it being a pump failure. Any suggestion to verify this?
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01-26-2025, 04:49 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Winnebago Owners Club Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Kamloops, BC, 60 miles from the Center of the Universe according to the Rinpoche, of the SF monks.
Posts: 8,026
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If you can get to the PS pump filter, take it out and see if there's any fluid movement in the tank when you start your motor. Just bump it over a few times first, because you might have a mess on your hands if it's pumping.
If the splined coupling was good in September after close to 20 years, there's not much likelyhood it will be worn out now. I have seen worn out splines in accessory drive couplings happen though, but not often.
You can also listen or feel the PS lines to see if there's any fluid flow in them. A mechanic's stethoscope would be my way of listening along the lines.
__________________
Happy Glamping, Norman & Elna. 2008 Winnebago Adventurer 38J, W24, dozens of small thirsty ponies. Retired after 40 years wrenching on trucks! 2010 Ford Ranger toad with bicycles or KLR 650 in the back. Easy to spot an RVer, they always walk around with a screwdriver or wrench in one hand!
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01-27-2025, 09:14 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2021
Location: Yuma, AZ
Posts: 455
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Birdhunr2 I think you have Cat power but looked at your public profile and it may be out of date.
With fan motor drive and no power steering since the pumps common your probably correct.
__________________
Dennis and Margaret
2001 40 foot Country Coach Intrigue "Suite of Dreams" Build#11294.
2021 Chevy Equinox toad
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01-27-2025, 10:47 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2024
Posts: 173
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The mechanic either knows what he's doing or he doesn't. Either way he's unlikely to want suggestions from random guys on the internet. Hope you have insurance for a tow to the shop.
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01-27-2025, 11:10 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Watertown NY USA
Posts: 6,753
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Is your P.S. pump belt driven? How about the water pump? Would that be driven by the same belt?
__________________
2002 Fleetwood Storm 30H on Workhorse P32 chassis 8.1 gas.
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01-27-2025, 11:40 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,226
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If you could steer the coach with a lot of effort, the steering box is most likely ok. If it is lack of power assist, the PTO is subject.
You said the splines looked good and the mechanic put anti seize on them? Those splines are supposed to have a good coating of grease if you don't have a wet PTO installed.
I have seen splines worn down to nothing in less than 18,000 miles
When you get it fixed, get the wet PTO kit installed
__________________
Don
2002 Country Coach Intrigue
#11427
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01-28-2025, 01:23 AM
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#7
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Member
Join Date: Feb 2023
Location: AZ
Posts: 36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LETMGROW
Is your P.S. pump belt driven? How about the water pump? Would that be driven by the same belt?
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Different system, it's driven off the transmission side via PTO adapter.
__________________
'05 CC Inspire 330 DaVinci
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01-29-2025, 06:46 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 104
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Update from OP.
I have a cummins engine with a transmission mounted PTO driving a dual Hydraulic pump. The 2 pumps are stacked into one unit to provide fluid to the fan and power steering. I was told the original pump was sauer dan foss but I have a danamatic limited pump. No numbers are readable at all on the pump label. Must have been written in eraseable ink. Waiting on oregon motor coach to tell me the part number for the Sauer dan foss and danamatic limited pumps to see if anything is available to replace or rebuild the pump. I was told a lot of the parts for the pumps were sourced from Ukraine and the war has stopped supply. Shop has parts ordered to replace bearings and shaft for the PTO but no progress on the pump. Shop googled and found pictures of one used in a Monaco coach from north west RV Supply and another one "for country coach" but they can only provide something if they have a part number that we still don't have for my pump since nothing was on the label. I'm not sure if the prior shoo reported the splines were good when they were not good or was there a bearing failure. Causing rapid failure of both splines. Central Hydraulic Shop is breaking down the pump to try to find a shaft and I'll see what they find out. To go from "good splines" to bad splines in less than 7k miles seems strange even if they did use antisize instead of high temp gear grease. Is that the same as high temp bearing grease?
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01-29-2025, 07:56 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2024
Posts: 173
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Are they still letting you park at the rest stop? Surprisingly generous if so.
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01-29-2025, 08:37 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Winnebago Owners Club Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Kamloops, BC, 60 miles from the Center of the Universe according to the Rinpoche, of the SF monks.
Posts: 8,026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Birdhunr2
Update from OP.
To go from "good splines" to bad splines in less than 7k miles seems strange even if they did use antisize instead of high temp gear grease. Is that the same as high temp bearing grease?
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Shop must have missed the worn splines. 3 places to look at. The pump shaft splines, the pto output shaft splines and coupler internal splines. Most often it's the coupler splines that wear out first.
Grease or antisieze would both be OK for assembly.
__________________
Happy Glamping, Norman & Elna. 2008 Winnebago Adventurer 38J, W24, dozens of small thirsty ponies. Retired after 40 years wrenching on trucks! 2010 Ford Ranger toad with bicycles or KLR 650 in the back. Easy to spot an RVer, they always walk around with a screwdriver or wrench in one hand!
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01-29-2025, 09:51 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Jun 2021
Location: Yuma, AZ
Posts: 455
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Birdhunr2
You have the same setup as I do, and I recently replaced the air compressor and reinstalled the existing hydraulic pump on the end of it. The air compressor has an oil feed which I though supplied oil to both ends of the compressor and to the hydraulic - now you've got me thinking. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable may know. My pump was silver or aluminum in color, I recall seeing the data-plate but never took a photo of it.
__________________
Dennis and Margaret
2001 40 foot Country Coach Intrigue "Suite of Dreams" Build#11294.
2021 Chevy Equinox toad
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01-29-2025, 02:45 PM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 37,070
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozzsp250
Birdhunr2
You have the same setup as I do, and I recently replaced the air compressor and reinstalled the existing hydraulic pump on the end of it. The air compressor has an oil feed which I though supplied oil to both ends of the compressor and to the hydraulic - now you've got me thinking. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable may know. My pump was silver or aluminum in color, I recall seeing the data-plate but never took a photo of it.
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There is no air compressor connected to the PTO of the transmission.
You have a pump piggy backed to the engine mounted air compressor. Different setup.
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01-29-2025, 04:06 PM
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#13
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Senior Member
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,226
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Might want to check about a new PTO. This gut has been supplying them for years so might want to check with John
JOHN DAVIS RV SERVICES INC.
__________________
Don
2002 Country Coach Intrigue
#11427
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01-30-2025, 10:32 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 104
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Are you saying that you moved your transmission pto driven pump from the transmission pto to the compressor pto? You got me thinking if t can't get a replacement stacked pump maybe I could split the pumps and put the steering pump on the compressor and only the fan pump on the transmission pto. Thanks for the idea. Might be easier to find separate pumps. If you did move yours then I guess the mounting is the same. Please confirm you moved your pump from the transmission to the compressor or did I misunderstand.
Here are the pump part numbers from oregonmotorcoach.com
Gregg@countrycoach.com was very helpful in providing this since my pump had zero readable info. Looked like nothing had ever been printed on the label.
Table for specs didn't past correctly so I'll try to paste a pic of the table
Sauer Danfoss # 550139087159160
Dynamatic # C45.0/20.5L 39087/159/160 (Pump cost around $1355)
Pump Specs:
Sauer Danfoss #
Steer flow
Fan Speed
Motor pressure
Cummins ISL 400 /Allison 3000MH (03 EPA)
Pumps (tandem, common inlet) CC#35630
550-1-39087-159-160
Fan pump, 2.75 cir, 2550 rpm max,
Steer pump, 1.26 cir, internal bypass, 2300 psi relief
priority flow for steering gear 4.2 gpm
@engine idle(700rpm)
3.8 gpm
@ Max flow
4.2 gpm
Fan Motor CC#35651
551-101299-200
(1.6 cir displacement) w/switch valve mounted on side
@engine idle(700rpm)
1180 rpm
520 psi
@1750 rpm & above
2800 rpm
2950 psi
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