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Old 06-10-2020, 04:09 PM   #1
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CC owner questions

My wife and I looked at at Country Coach Allure 37 foot tag axle coach we were very interested in. It looked great in pictures, but after driving 650 miles to see it, we were very disappointed to say the least, as it had many issues. I do have few questions for the members here as I have never owned a class-a, a diesel pusher, or, a coach with slide-outs.

It had been raining prior to us viewing the coach, and I noticed the carpet next to the rear bed (passenger side) near the closet door, and, the carpet near the couch behind the drivers seat (also passenger side) was soaking wet. When I asked the salesman about that, he told me it had been raining and he closed the slides to show another customer and water ran in from the top of the slide, down the outside of the slide (which was now inside the coach), and onto the carpet. He said that was a common occurrence because the water has nowhere else to go when it is on top of the slide. My question is, It has slide toppers, and the seals looked okay upon initial inspection. Aren't the seals supposed to seal the water out when the slides are bought in? If it is a common occurrence, do you guys close your slides every time it rains?.
Also, in a pic here of the cracked looking paint, is this what is referred to as paint checking? It cracking was even worse in some of the black colored paint.
In the picture of the roof, Is this caused from water intrusion into the roof? Salesman said it was just where the glue separated from the panel.
Basic questions for some I know, but I'm just trying to learn as I go to make the most informed decision, and best purchase.. Sorry the ceiling photo is turned to the left, It keeps changing it when uploaded even if I try to correct the orientation.
Ray
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Old 06-10-2020, 04:57 PM   #2
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The ceiling photo sure seems like damage from a leak.

Yes, you have a photo of gelcoat checking. Our rig has begun to show this condition also.
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Old 06-10-2020, 05:03 PM   #3
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Thank you Dean, I thought it probably was a leak from the front passenger side slide but wasn't sure. Thanks for the info on the paint. Now I know exactly what Im looking at. Strange that the paint would have those issues, it looks decent from about 5 feet away
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Old 06-10-2020, 05:08 PM   #4
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I have the 37’ Allure 470. The paint checking is also on my black where the southern CA sun hits it. Common but nothing to worry about or fix. Cosmetic.

The bubbling in the ceiling is a sign of water intrusion. The closed cell membrane will swell/breakdown with water wetting. I had a leak at a roof vent and the ceiling material is still swollen at that point even after I repaired the lap sealant and confirmed that the wood is dry inside.

CC are great coaches. I will buy another one for sure when I look to upgrade to a Magna or Affinity.
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Old 06-10-2020, 05:25 PM   #5
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I have the 37’ Allure 470. The paint checking is also on my black where the southern CA sun hits it. Common but nothing to worry about or fix. Cosmetic.

The bubbling in the ceiling is a sign of water intrusion. The closed cell membrane will swell/breakdown with water wetting. I had a leak at a roof vent and the ceiling material is still swollen at that point even after I repaired the lap sealant and confirmed that the wood is dry inside.

CC are great coaches. I will buy another one for sure when I look to upgrade to a Magna or Affinity.

Thank you, I would really love to find the 37 footer but realize I may need to go up to the 40 as there are so few of the 37's around
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Old 06-10-2020, 05:34 PM   #6
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Checking can become more then just a cosmetic problem. Our dark maroon paint has an area where the checking has erupted thru the clear coat. The clear coat has started to flake away, and in time this damaged clear coat will work out to the non dark paint areas. For sure not a structural concern, at least in my life time, but no question it does blemish an otherwise fine looking coach. IMO, buying a coach with Dark Painted areas of the micro checking area, you should also budget a visit to a reputable paint shop to have the dark paint sections of the coach ground down, and then glass layered and painted a lighter color. I've had quotes of + or - $12.5 - 20K to just do this for the Dark Paints. So a pretty big size investment. And a reputable shop, will caution you about the high probability that the checking could come back in the future. As you really need to do what Newmar does when they were working with customers to fix checking. Basically hang new exterior side walls with new glass, and paint.

One fell CC owner had a shop in California do the grind and paint of his coach, but as I recall he retained the dark color paint. And within 5-6(? Memory on those years!) it came back.

Also IMO, by changing to lighter color scheme with the old Dark Paint areas, you should get more years before problems come back. And since heat is the accelerator of the outgassing of the bad glass - where you travel makes a difference. (AZ 110F + heat, is going to have a bigger impact on checking, then a person say in the Pacific Northwest Rain Forrests!).

So when looking at coaches of the era of bad glass/checking (Monaco, Beaver, Newmar, CC, Travel Supreme, Etc.)... Either plan to live with it, especially if the checking never erupts thru the clear coat. Or budget accordingly to shift to a higher color paint scheme in place of the dark... Say $15K for this example. And you keep the coach for say 10 years, that's about a $1.5K investment each year, for a coach that may never show problems with checking during that time.

Enough rambling...

And yes, the salesman is correct about water can dump on the inside when bringing in a slide with puddling on the slide topper. Bringing them a bit at time, allowing the topper puddles to dump off as they come in, can make this basically a non issue for water dumping.

And yes I agree, the pictures reflect deeper inspections required... That does look like moisture problems. If caught early, and no wood rot, a place like Premier and OMC in Eugene/Junction City or Eric's Oldstrum in Tucson - can properly repair this, and a coach may well be worth doing this. The key, is how much damage has been done... And that requires a inspector who knows CC well enough.

And IMO (Again, lots of opinions here!), budget accordingly for a solid PDI, and negotiate a price that reflects the condition of what the inspector finds - IF the coach warrants further consideration.

(Tip, as elusive as the CC 37' Tag, Foretravel I believe had a 38' Tag coach, with M11 or ISM (Can't recall.) - and worth a look!)

Happy hunting,
Smitty
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Old 06-10-2020, 05:57 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Smitty77 View Post
Checking can become more then just a cosmetic problem. Our dark maroon paint has an area where the checking has erupted thru the clear coat. The clear coat has started to flake away, and in time this damaged clear coat will work out to the non dark paint areas. For sure not a structural concern, at least in my life time, but no question it does blemish an otherwise fine looking coach. IMO, buying a coach with Dark Painted areas of the micro checking area, you should also budget a visit to a reputable paint shop to have the dark paint sections of the coach ground down, and then glass layered and painted a lighter color. I've had quotes of + or - $12.5 - 20K to just do this for the Dark Paints. So a pretty big size investment. And a reputable shop, will caution you about the high probability that the checking could come back in the future. As you really need to do what Newmar does when they were working with customers to fix checking. Basically hang new exterior side walls with new glass, and paint.

One fell CC owner had a shop in California do the grind and paint of his coach, but as I recall he retained the dark color paint. And within 5-6(? Memory on those years!) it came back.

Also IMO, by changing to lighter color scheme with the old Dark Paint areas, you should get more years before problems come back. And since heat is the accelerator of the outgassing of the bad glass - where you travel makes a difference. (AZ 110F + heat, is going to have a bigger impact on checking, then a person say in the Pacific Northwest Rain Forrests!).

So when looking at coaches of the era of bad glass/checking (Monaco, Beaver, Newmar, CC, Travel Supreme, Etc.)... Either plan to live with it, especially if the checking never erupts thru the clear coat. Or budget accordingly to shift to a higher color paint scheme in place of the dark... Say $15K for this example. And you keep the coach for say 10 years, that's about a $1.5K investment each year, for a coach that may never show problems with checking during that time.

Enough rambling...

And yes, the salesman is correct about water can dump on the inside when bringing in a slide with puddling on the slide topper. Bringing them a bit at time, allowing the topper puddles to dump off as they come in, can make this basically a non issue for water dumping.

And yes I agree, the pictures reflect deeper inspections required... That does look like moisture problems. If caught early, and no wood rot, a place like Premier and OMC in Eugene/Junction City or Eric's Oldstrum in Tucson - can properly repair this, and a coach may well be worth doing this. The key, is how much damage has been done... And that requires a inspector who knows CC well enough.

And IMO (Again, lots of opinions here!), budget accordingly for a solid PDI, and negotiate a price that reflects the condition of what the inspector finds - IF the coach warrants further consideration.

(Tip, as elusive as the CC 37' Tag, Foretravel I believe had a 38' Tag coach, with M11 or ISM (Can't recall.) - and worth a look!)

Happy hunting,
Smitty

Thanks Smitty,
I will look at the foretravel. Water damage is a big deal breaker for me. I will keep in mind closing the slides slowly on the coach I purchase. May have been he closed them too fast but a large section of carpet literally looked like a gallon of water was poured on it so I suspect a larger problem, even with my lack of knowledge about the slides. My only prior ownership was a non slide class-c.
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Old 06-11-2020, 07:58 PM   #8
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Quote:
From Smitty77: And yes, the salesman is correct about water can dump on the inside when bringing in a slide with puddling on the slide topper. Bringing them a bit at time, allowing the topper puddles to dump off as they come in, can make this basically a non issue for water dumping.
I can absolutely verify this. If I roll in the bedroom slide too quickly after a rain, there's a bit of water on the floor. Slowing down (and remembering in the first place) keeps all water out.

That ceiling bulge is cringeworthy.

Steve
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Old 06-11-2020, 08:09 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by tinman 55 View Post
Thank you Dean, I thought it probably was a leak from the front passenger side slide but wasn't sure. Thanks for the info on the paint. Now I know exactly what Im looking at. Strange that the paint would have those issues, it looks decent from about 5 feet away
The paint checking is not the paint. It is the surface of the outside wall itself. Only permanent cure is to replace the entire sidewall. Not a cheap proposition!
Yes, that is water damage to the ceiling.
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Old 06-11-2020, 10:55 PM   #10
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Thank you Steve, I will try and remember to go slow with the slides as well
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Old 06-11-2020, 11:33 PM   #11
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Thank you MrD, Replacing the sidewall is not an option. I did have correspondence with Damon Rapozo who told me the paint issues were greatly reduced around 2007 1/2 when they switched fiberglass.
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Old 07-09-2020, 11:28 PM   #12
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If you are looking for a 36-37’er you might look at Alpine Coach also. Another great handling coach like the CC and a great support team right here on iRV2.
We looked at CC before we bought the Bird.
CC was the only fiberglass coach on our list. The 40’ newer Alpines just didn’t have the cargo carrying capacity with no tag.
36’ers are a real sweet spot and IMO CC and Alpine probably had the best.
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Old 07-11-2020, 12:03 PM   #13
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If you are looking for a 36-37’er you might look at Alpine Coach also. Another great handling coach like the CC and a great support team right here on iRV2.
We looked at CC before we bought the Bird.
CC was the only fiberglass coach on our list. The 40’ newer Alpines just didn’t have the cargo carrying capacity with no tag.
36’ers are a real sweet spot and IMO CC and Alpine probably had the best.
Thank you, I will look at them as well. The search is still on. I drove a 42 foot allure and it just seems a bit too big for what I need and does not fit my parking situation. Guess I’ll stick with the 37-40 foot range.
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Old 07-11-2020, 04:42 PM   #14
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If you're patient but also very ready to buy when the right coach comes along, a great one WILL come your way! I can't think of too many reasons to buy a coach with known major leak(s). The slide leaking as mentioned is a different issue and manageable.

One thing to be aware of on Alpine Coaches is that they did have a seam where the front & rear caps met on the roof, which is a potential water intrusion point, at least on the early 00's Alpine Coaches. CC did not, and for us, that was a big deal, seeing as we're very hellbent on not having roof leaks.

It took us many months to find our CC, but it was worth the wait
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