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Old 05-11-2013, 08:11 PM   #1
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Air leak in chassis leveling system

Could use some help. I have a 04 Dynasty, after a few days the coach sags to the curb side, (just letting it side on the tires). I've been under the coach with snoop leak detector, checking the fitting's on the bags and the air tank. I've also used soapy water on the air bags. I can't hear any air escaping. Just wondering if the dump valve could be at fault. I also looked at the ty-raps to see if any rubbed a hole in the tubing. Does anyone have any suggested areas to check. Thanks Carl
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Old 05-11-2013, 08:29 PM   #2
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Most likely it is not the dump valve because if it was it would go down level. My bet for that year one or more of the air solenoids are leaking on the six pack. You have one six pack which consists of six solenoids for each axle. So if you have a tag axle you have three six packs for a total of 18 solenoids. You have one six pack right over the front axle hanging from the overhead and the back one is located over the rear axle. Spray a soapy solution on these solenoids especially around the middle of the solenoids where the black electromagnet part joins the brass base of the solenoid. Spray and watch with a flashlight. Let me know what you find.
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Old 05-11-2013, 10:00 PM   #3
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Carl Trader.....Just so you know, it's not uncommon for most coaches to do what yours is doing.
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Old 05-12-2013, 03:40 AM   #4
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Don, I disagree. My mh used to stay up forever then it suddenly started dropping. I found six of the eighteen solenoids had dry cracked orings and where leaking. The way that system is designed those bags should stay inflated for a long long time. I built a test stand for those solenoids so I could take them out and test each one with 150 psi air and they leaked. Took them apart and the orings where bad. I am in the process of rebuilding all my solenoids right now. The airlines run directly from the solenoids to the airbags. When they are off there should be no air escaping from the system. I will bet that when I am through rebuilding all the solenoids that my airbags will stay inflated for a long time.
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Old 05-12-2013, 06:29 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diplomat Don View Post
Carl Trader.....Just so you know, it's not uncommon for most coaches to do what yours is doing.
We've had four tag axle Monacos(98,99,00,02), and like Mike said, loosing air from the air bags isn't what is suppose to happen. Our coaches past and present held air in their air bags indefinitely.

We did have one the had leaky fittings on top of the tag bags on one coach, but once fixed, it held too.
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Old 05-12-2013, 06:44 AM   #6
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I don't mean to hijack this thread, but, isn't the leveling system supposed to check "the level of the coach" every 30 minutes or so and turn on an air pump to inflate any low bags and re-level the coach?
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Old 05-12-2013, 07:29 AM   #7
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Pat, you are 100% correct and the auxiliary air pump will keep it level but that is designed to keep the mh level if people are moving around in the mh or to make slight changes and is not designed to overcome an air leak. If the air leak gets too bad then the aux compressor will run all the time.
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Old 05-12-2013, 08:21 AM   #8
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Let me say that I am very familiar with these solenoid because they are almost identical to the solenoids we use for nitrous systems on race cars. I talked to HWH Tech about the problem and they told me they don't leak where this one is leaking BUT I have six of them leaking. The oring inside the solenoid body has dried, hardened and cracked. HWH sells the two orings on the bottom of the solenoid where it attaches to the manifold (six pack) but does not sell the oring that is leaking that is inside the solenoid. I went to an oring store and bought all three orings made of the best material which is Viton for $24. The bad side of this is getting to the six packs. I had to drive the mh up on solid wood ramps then block the frame so I could let 100% of the air out of the mh. I let the mh sit up for two days to make sure it would hold. You still have problem getting to the solenoid on the six pack because they are way up there. Also Monaco installed all this before they put the body onto the frame so the wires for each solenoid goes through weird places and is tie wrapped.

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Old 05-12-2013, 12:03 PM   #9
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I have replaced the O-rings also. First the front would leak down in 2-3 days, so I replaced both O-rings on each solenoid on the front solenoid block. Then last year the rear started leaking down so I replaced O-rings on the rear. Air leveling dumps or increases air side to side or front to rear. It's not a hard job but difficult because the block is up high on the frame. You have to dump all the air and that puts the coach too low to get under so I drove it up on blocks to get the axle higher.(of course that made the manifold harder to reach) but I could sit on ground and reach the solenoids. If you take the nut loose on the top of the solenoid (be sure to tag each one and position on solendiod) you can pull the electric coil off, then unscrew the solenoid. Clean up both surfaces ond replace O-rings. Be sure you don't score or gouge the surfaces.
Not a hard thing to do, just take your time and do it once!
Good luck
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Old 05-12-2013, 12:58 PM   #10
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Air leak

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diplomat Don View Post
Carl Trader.....Just so you know, it's not uncommon for most coaches to do what yours is doing.
Don this just started, coach would stay for weeks before it would lose air.
I wil get under it again after next week end and take a look
at the solenoids that Mike mentioned, thanks Carl
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Old 05-12-2013, 02:03 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Canter View Post
Let me say that I am very familiar with these solenoid because they are almost identical to the solenoids we use for nitrous systems on race cars. I talked to HWH Tech about the problem and they told me they don't leak where this one is leaking BUT I have six of them leaking. The oring inside the solenoid body has dried, hardened and cracked. HWH sells the two orings on the bottom of the solenoid where it attaches to the manifold (six pack) but does not sell the oring that is leaking that is inside the solenoid. I went to an oring store and bought all three orings made of the best material which is Viton for $24. The bad side of this is getting to the six packs. I had to drive the mh up on solid wood ramps then block the frame so I could let 100% of the air out of the mh. I let the mh sit up for two days to make sure it would hold. You still have problem getting to the solenoid on the six pack because they are way up there. Also Monaco installed all this before they put the body onto the frame so the wires for each solenoid goes through weird places and is tie wrapped.

Mike I watched your Video and hope you post the procedure for replacing the O ring that you could not get from HWH and would you post the the size of the Viton O rings or the part & brand #.
Thanks for the Video.
I will have that problem sooner or later.
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Old 05-12-2013, 03:05 PM   #12
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Well....I stand corrected. Our coach will start to drop to one side or the other after 2-3 days. To me, it's not a big issue. My coach never sits for more than a few hours on just the air bags. Either they're empty while camping or parked, the jacks are down or we're driving. Mine has been this way since new.
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Old 05-12-2013, 03:40 PM   #13
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John, it is the oring inside of the solenoid that is leaking on mine and not the two on the bottom that seal against the manifold. You didn't change the internal oring?

It takes a special pin wrench to open up the solenoid. They are available from Nitrous Supply. You can see it on the picture labeled tools sitting on the aluminum block I unscrewed the solenoid from the manifold with a plastic jawed cannon plug pliers which I found on amazon.com which is also shown in the picture below. The base of the solenoid is brass so I didn't want to use steel jawed waterpump adjustaple plies and mess it up.

I used the Dupont Viton orings which are flurocarbon orings and are probably the best out there for this application. The internal oring is a -019 size, the large one on the bottom is a -028 and the small one on the bottom is a -015.

You will see in the pictures below the ramps I made from 2x12s from Homedepot. I think I could have gone higher. As John stated I am not sure I need the large blocks of wood under the cross frame because it did make the six pack manifold way up high.
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Old 05-12-2013, 03:41 PM   #14
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More pictures. When this is all over I will post a complete procedure. I have to go racing for a week now so I have stopped working on the Sig
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