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Skip426 · 04-12-2020, 01:10 PM

Without access to a wiring schematic for your chassis , I would say that normally if the start circuit has a fuse , it would be before the ignition switch , if you have activation power through the ignition switch that should run to the starter relay , then finding the relay and testing for activation power at that end would be important ; before ripping into the wiring harness.

BTW: After two untimely starter relay failures , on my coach , I ran a fused wire with a push button; for emergency starting; from the batteries to the starter .

NOTE: Because this set up , by-passes the safety feature of the factory ignition switch and relay requiring the trans being in neutral , it requires caution before use.

DiplomatDon · 04-12-2020, 06:48 PM

I had similar issue while in Az this winter. Worked a couple times to jump with toad but when that didn't work had wife hold ignition in start position while wiggling starter solenoid wires and viola, noise. Shut power off, remove wire from starter solenoid and turned out to be loose post on the solenoid. Tightened that and started the rest of the trip. I have also had this issue one time on a pickup and turned out to be post on the starter loose. As far as the comment about the ignition switch being made in China junk, Monaco used AC Delco switches made in USA. Good luck, Don

vito.a · 04-12-2020, 07:17 PM

Northwest RV Supply has wiring diagram books for a 2006 Imperial and a 2005 Dynasty. Either one would probably work.
WIRE DIAGRAM: HOLIDAY RAMBLER 2006 IMPERIAL: nwrvsupply.com
http://www.nwrvsupply.com/WIREDIAG/WD-M05DY.html

Dixierail · 04-13-2020, 01:32 PM

Thanks for the lead Vito! I purchased that set of schematics and Im really hoping they did not change much from 2005. Now maybe I can get somewhere.

Dixierail · 04-13-2020, 01:36 PM

Thanks Skip! How can I diagnose the neutral safety switch to see if thats the issue? Im thinking that it is internal on the Allison 3000. My readout on the dash says "N" so I am assuming its ok. Plus when I jumped the starter and cranked it, it didn't leave the barn lol.

Skip426 · 04-13-2020, 02:51 PM

Once you find the starter relay , and identify the power from the ignition switch wire , the other small terminal should show zero OMS to ground.

This picture of a generic starter relay , the large terminals are , battery power in , starter solenoid out.
Small terminals , ignition start power, in, ground through the trans control, to complete the activation of the relay.

Skip426 · 04-13-2020, 03:01 PM

Now this is a real stretch , because my chassis is Freightliner and yours is I believe Roadmaster .
Freightliner uses a VIM ( Vehicle Interface Module ) between the Allison trans controller and the starter relay . Picture below , it's approx 5" square and 3" high, yellow circle , second picture is what's under the cover.
You chassis may not have this VIM. But if you see something similar , it's worth pulling the cover.

That's the Allison control beside it and these pictures are in my engine compartment.

clifford j · 04-13-2020, 03:20 PM

Anti theft devices ,if this vehicle has one could be the problem. My educated guess is Ign. switch or the neutral safety switch at the trans. is in trouble.

CLIFFORD

YC1 · 04-13-2020, 03:42 PM

Post pictures of your starter, and work back from that. Follow the wires back versus trying to go from the ignition.

You may have a starter relay on the starter (which you may already be aware of), and another relay that drives that.

Not knowing how you jumped the starter I can only guess and that can be a bit exciting to say the least.

If you can post the schematics or send them to me I can help diagnose. I'm not a mechanic but am a Certified Electronic Tech and have been on this forum a long time helping folks out. Twinboat is a great source for these types of problems and I'm surprised he has not found this one to help with.

Dixierail · 04-14-2020, 07:44 AM

Thanks YC1. I have tried to follow the exciter wire back to the relay or source but lose it in a huge bundle of wires that seem to head to the front. I will try to post some pics of my relay bank next time I can get over there. I will also post a pic of the schematic when it arrives even though it is for a 2006 Imperial

YC1 · 04-14-2020, 11:01 AM

https://www.amazon.com/Tracer-Circui...xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==

If you don't have a signal tracer here is an example.

Find the control wire to the starter solenoid and disconnect it. Then connect the tone generator to the wire and start sniffing around to follow the wires.

Removing the wire from the starter solenoid will prevent the signal from getting loaded down. In most cases removing a wire like that is not necessary but sure is helpful when dealing with things like this.

Dixierail · 04-27-2020, 08:45 AM

Sorry for the delay folks, but it took me awhile to come to this conclusion.
I tried the signal tracer but lost the wire in the large bundle. I have verified all fuses and relays to the best of my ability. I decided to take the 2006 imperial wiring diagram that I purchased from NWRV.com and re make the circuit. I installed a solenoid in the rear run bay and brought a trigger wire from the dash all the way back. I ran a hot from chassis to the solenoid and a 10 gauge wire from there to the starter solenoid on top of the starter. It works!!! Took awhile to fish the wire but my daughter was a great help with her teenage stature in getting the wire where it needed to be. I can't thank you all enough for your patience and assistance in trying to find a solution. I never did find the hidden solenoid or broken wire but that is now out of the loop.

777 Driver · 04-27-2020, 01:56 PM

Hi Steven,

I'm glad that you found a solution. However, if I understand correctly, your solution has bypassed the transmission neutral safety interlock. That is, even if the transmission was not in neutral (drive or reverse) and you used the switch you installed, the engine would turn over.

I guess that I don't really have a big problem with that. As a kid, it wasn't unusual to tickle the starter with the transmission in gear to jog a vehicle a few inches.

Just be careful.

Take care,
Stu

153stars · 05-01-2020, 12:20 PM

You dont have rear engine start panel, front/rear switch couple gauges and
non-keyed start switch do you ? Not always on OEM build or drawing. Not totally protected from elements. If loss of power through "front setting" on the switch "no start" you can make a short jumper two male spades on a wire to quickly bypass it.