Back Run Bay Problem

[barmcd]

Originally Posted by pwhittle

There are only two wires from the ML-ACR to the switch. The power and ground at the switch can come from anywhere.

You can hook the power at the switch to either battery bank, but if that battery bank is dead, you won’t be able to use the switch to combine them. You do still have the option of manually combining the using the yellow knob on top,of the ML-ACR.

Paul

Thanks for that info Paul. As I understand it, in the original Monaco configuration, both battery banks charge independent of each other. Is there any problem with always charging both banks when one bank starts charging after the ML-ACR is installed?

[YC1]

If your batteries were/are at 3 volts and have any age at all on them you have really crippled them. I would not even consider trying to charge them up.

The noise in the video is likely a thermal breaker tripping open and shut. A voltmeter would tell the tale checking those little black breakers.

It is NOT a solenoid clicking sound and that would be easy to diagnose with test light placed on the small terminals of them. You would see the light go on and off on one of the small terminals if that was the case.

You might not be able to use a test light because of the very low battery voltages.

Your system sounds like you had lost 110 volts, based on the no light situation of the microwave. Losing shoreline 110 and perhaps having the inverter set to run when that is lost would have hammered the batteries, especially if not programmed to shut down with low battery voltage.

You reset breakers which can be hard to tell if tripped in some cases and your microwave lights came back on.

Once the microwave and your inverter/charger were happy again the charger is trying to bring back the hammered batteries and the extreme current the batteries are trying to consume is causing a thermal breaker to cycle on and off. Once it does this several times it can get really hot and stay off/open much longer.

When one of those breakers goes through this exercise for a long time they become weak and may open much easier so in fact has been "crippled".

Changing to a different setup while in the middle of the issue could lead you to more problems. Sorry, I just feel strongly you need to properly diagnose the situation and then if you want to update the system to something new you will have so much more knowledge.

Working with batteries can be deadly if you are not careful. I have seen a few explosions in my days and the results were not pretty. Some were mostly disasterous to the laundry lady. But one hurt two folks and burned their vehicle severly.

[jacwjames]

Originally Posted by barmcd

Thanks for that info Paul. As I understand it, in the original Monaco configuration, both battery banks charge independent of each other. Is there any problem with always charging both banks when one bank starts charging after the ML-ACR is installed?

Dennis,
I installed my Bluesea in June of 2021 and installed it as soon as I got it. I've had it on automatic the whole time since I installed it.

Driving down the road the house battery charges, I've put about 10K miles on the rig since install.

When plugged in the chassis battery charges.

Time will tell if there will be any ill affect on my batteries but so far I can't see any.



I have not utilized the automatic cut out if I'm running the generator while driving. This is done at the switch buy utilizing the generator sense wire. I figure I can easily use the dash switch if I want to.
There is also the ability to disable the Bluesea while starting, haven't done that either.

[barmcd]

Originally Posted by YC1

If your batteries were/are at 3 volts and have any age at all on them you have really crippled them. I would not even consider trying to charge them up.

The noise in the video is likely a thermal breaker tripping open and shut. A voltmeter would tell the tale checking those little black breakers.

It is NOT a solenoid clicking sound and that would be easy to diagnose with test light placed on the small terminals of them. You would see the light go on and off on one of the small terminals if that was the case.

You might not be able to use a test light because of the very low battery voltages.

Your system sounds like you had lost 110 volts, based on the no light situation of the microwave. Losing shoreline 110 and perhaps having the inverter set to run when that is lost would have hammered the batteries, especially if not programmed to shut down with low battery voltage.

You reset breakers which can be hard to tell if tripped in some cases and your microwave lights came back on.

Once the microwave and your inverter/charger were happy again the charger is trying to bring back the hammered batteries and the extreme current the batteries are trying to consume is causing a thermal breaker to cycle on and off. Once it does this several times it can get really hot and stay off/open much longer.

When one of those breakers goes through this exercise for a long time they become weak and may open much easier so in fact has been "crippled".

Changing to a different setup while in the middle of the issue could lead you to more problems. Sorry, I just feel strongly you need to properly diagnose the situation and then if you want to update the system to something new you will have so much more knowledge.

Working with batteries can be deadly if you are not careful. I have seen a few explosions in my days and the results were not pretty. Some were mostly disasterous to the laundry lady. But one hurt two folks and burned their vehicle severly.

Yes, I think I lost shore power and ran the batteries down pretty low. While stored, I had the inverter set to shut down if DC voltage went below 12 volts, but I know there are enough things running on 12V in the coach that the batteries will discharge without shore power for any length of time.

The clicking stopped and now the batteries have been on float charge a couple of days. With the charger off, the battery voltage only reads 12.6 volts so they aren't charging as well as they were when I bought them 6 years ago. They are AGM batteries.

[YC1]

Six years old and went that low. I suspect they have very limited capacity. Agm's might take the hit better but at six years you are really pressing the issue.

RV's batteries are only rented. Most are crippled or murdered prematurely as yours have been crippled. I have killed my share of batteries but like beer, just get some fresh and let the live their cycle.

[barmcd]

Originally Posted by YC1

Six years old and went that low. I suspect they have very limited capacity. Agm's might take the hit better but at six years you are really pressing the issue.

RV's batteries are only rented. Most are crippled or murdered prematurely as yours have been crippled. I have killed my share of batteries but like beer, just get some fresh and let the live their cycle.

The good news is we don't boondock much so they don't have much to do.

[pwhittle]

Originally Posted by barmcd

Thanks for that info Paul. As I understand it, in the original Monaco configuration, both battery banks charge independent of each other. Is there any problem with always charging both banks when one bank starts charging after the ML-ACR is installed?

I typically use the manual disconnect when I have the engine alternator charging the chassis batteries and the inverter charging the house batteries (shore or generator). The rest of the time it is in Auto, except for when I want a battery boost and I select On/combine at the switch.

Paul

[153stars]

My install where old diode isolator was. Bus bar went to one lug of old diode isolator. If you have alternator diode i isolator you will want to put there as well. Those with IRD or BIRD will install it where big boy type solenoid is. I made the cable to reach the other lug but was wrong I just looped it around. I may shorten it or make/but another. The fuse zipstripped to it feeds to the my front dash center console . At the switch has the proper smaller inline fuse to it. I fused the larger to match the wire if I want to use house power to something else at dash , let's say future four camera system with night vision. The short cord and wires is in new plastic armor. You need a ground at ACR I grabbed one on fire wall, it has armor mostly covering it. Now I have small boat fuse block instead of DIY inline fuse holder. Also to back "2nd" fused the wire with old 90 chassis watt solar panel/charge controller to I moved to house batteries. If I was to short that other wire at bus bar it wouldn't have been protected. I didn't think of it. I don't think panels were landed to battery ever I mentioned earlier. I left the huge jump start solenoid it was not tied into and charge system just momentary boost switch at dash. So you may want to pick up inline fuses or or small surface mount. Maybe like me primary fuse to match wire used and second fuse at switch.

[barmcd]

Originally Posted by pwhittle

I typically use the manual disconnect when I have the engine alternator charging the chassis batteries and the inverter charging the house batteries (shore or generator). The rest of the time it is in Auto, except for when I want a battery boost and I select On/combine at the switch.

Paul

I'm having a hard time understanding the operation of the ML-ACR compared to the original setup with the Lambert Battery Maintainer and the battery isolator.

Does this statement address driving with the generator running, which we do most of the time so we can run the rooftop AC? If so, when does the shore part of the equation come into play? When plugged into shore power, if you manually disconnect the battery banks, you won't charge the chassis battery will you?

"I typically use the manual disconnect when I have the engine alternator charging the chassis batteries and the inverter charging the house batteries (shore or generator)."

We generally operate in one of five conditions.

1. The coach is stored plugged into shore power.
2. Driving the coach with the generator off.
3. Driving the coach with the generator on.
4. Using the coach when plugged into shore power.
5. Using the coach on generator.

We don't have to do anything when changing from one condition to another with the original setup. It looks like should use auto for 1,2, 4, & 5 since there is only one charging source in those conditions? In 3, there are two charging sources and the battery banks should be manually isolated?

[jacwjames]

Dennis,
IMHO the Bluesea ML-ACR replaces the original system and does essentially the same thing and can provide the same flexibility if you take the time to wire in all the features.
If you leave it in automatic mode and if it senses a charge from any source (Alt, Shore/inverter, or generator/inverter) it will automatically close and charge both battery banks.

You can manually turn to be on all the time where it will combine both banks, but this would result in both batteries being dead if you were parked and not plugged in or running generator.
Or you can turn it off where it will not connect both banks at all.



The wiring coming off of the ML-ACR allows for the connection to the switch so you can do this remotely from the drivers seat. Or there is a manual switch on top that you can use (in fact you can buy one without the remote switch if you want.

There is also an option to wire in sense wire that will not combine both banks if you are running the generator.

And there is also one that will drop the connection out for ~2 minutes while you are starting the engine.



But if you system is working correctly and you are confident in it you can leave it. I had lost confidence in my system so I installed the Bluesea.



Here is a flyer that I downloaded

[barmcd]

Originally Posted by jacwjames

Dennis,
IMHO the Bluesea ML-ACR replaces the original system and does essentially the same thing and can provide the same flexibility if you take the time to wire in all the features.
If you leave it in automatic mode and if it senses a charge from any source (Alt, Shore/inverter, or generator/inverter) it will automatically close and charge both battery banks.

You can manually turn to be on all the time where it will combine both banks, but this would result in both batteries being dead if you were parked and not plugged in or running generator.
Or you can turn it off where it will not connect both banks at all.



The wiring coming off of the ML-ACR allows for the connection to the switch so you can do this remotely from the drivers seat. Or there is a manual switch on top that you can use (in fact you can buy one without the remote switch if you want.

There is also an option to wire in sense wire that will not combine both banks if you are running the generator.

And there is also one that will drop the connection out for ~2 minutes while you are starting the engine.



But if you system is working correctly and you are confident in it you can leave it. I had lost confidence in my system so I installed the Bluesea.



Here is a flyer that I downloaded

Thanks Jim, I'm still trying to understand the ins and outs of the system. Are those unused wires on the schematic marked "isolation" for these functions?

Originally Posted by jacwjames

There is also an option to wire in sense wire that will not combine both banks if you are running the generator.

And there is also one that will drop the connection out for ~2 minutes while you are starting the engine.

[barmcd]

Never mind, I see that's what they are for.

Configuring for engine starting isolation looks pretty easy. Isolating for two engines running at the same time, looks a little more difficult. Just off of the top of my head I'm thinking I can use the lead for the generator hour meter. I'm using a lead off of that for the inverter already.

[barmcd]

I'd like to have a modern charging system that replicates all the functionality of the original.

[jacwjames]

Originally Posted by barmcd

I'd like to have a modern charging system that replicates all the functionality of the original.

Newer rigs come with a different type of latching relay, my wifes friend has a Thor Outlaw that came with one, can't remember the name. But I believe the Bluesea accomplishes the same thing,

The generator isolation is pretty easy, I've actually wired it up but did not put a fuse in figuring I'd see if there was actually a problem with the generator running with the engine running but haven't done that yer. I figure if I see a problem I can just use the dash switch and turn if off.

I asked VanWill what he did and he said he didn't utilize that function (if my memory serves we correctly).