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Old 11-05-2022, 04:40 PM   #1
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Boost relay problem

While trying out the features of my new-to-me MH, I ran the chassis battery down to where I could not start the engine. I tried the boost switch but no "boost". The house batteries were fully charged.

I chased down the problem. The house batteries were at about 12.6 volts. When I tried the boost relay the voltage on the coil would only be about 10.7 volts which is not enough to fully actuate the relay. If I used a jumper wire at the relay, then it would pull in fully and I could start the engine.

It seems that the long run of wire from the switch on the dashboard to the boost relay has too much voltage drop to work properly. I am thinking of adding a Bosch type relay to solve the problem.

Has anyone else has this problem?
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Old 11-05-2022, 06:58 PM   #2
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Is this test repeatable, and was the solenoid clunking ?

Many times the internal contacts burn up and cause it to connect intermittently .

If you have a BIRD system, the coil voltage is pulsed after initial pull in. That pulsing lowers the voltage.

Never read any reports of what your thinking it may be.
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Old 11-05-2022, 07:03 PM   #3
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Probably a bad connection in the switch wiring, that length is not a problem.

See if your getting full 12v to and across the switch (when on) on dash, it could be fuse not making good contact in the fuse box
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Old 11-06-2022, 05:53 AM   #4
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You should not have to reinvent or re-engineer a good simple system.

Your boost signal from the dash may pass through some connections on a (bird) device that is designed to send a signal to combine the batteries.

Post your yr and specific model. Someone may have the schematic.

Find a good ground or make one for testing and begin at the switch as suggested. Switches can become arced or corroded/contaminated and not give proper connections. What goes in, must go out. No voltage drop across a switch.

Take a look below the driver in the outside compartment. Take some pictures and post to take the guess work out for us.

It could be a push on connector just needs some exercise but getting voltage reading before tugging and pulling on things is a must to be sure you have corrected the issue.

While you are at it, post a picture of the boost solenoid too. And the surrounding area.

Disregard the text information. This was working with another person on a 2000 coach as well. If this looks like something you have that may be in a rear area versus the front area, the item 7 is the BiRD device that needs to be looked at. It may have a boost connection.
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Old 11-06-2022, 09:21 PM   #5
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Here is a picture of my high current DC panel. The boost relay has the American flag sticker.

Click image for larger version

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Here is a picture of the drawing. I see that this is upside down, I don't know why that happened. It is correct on my computer.

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I have a 2002 Monaco signature 45 footer.
The switch on the dash connects the terminal on the boost relay to ground. The long run seems to drop the voltage on the coil to only about 10.7 volts. This does not seem to be enough to slam the contacts closed.
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Old 11-06-2022, 10:16 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monaco_hwy View Post
Here is a picture of my high current DC panel. The boost relay has the American flag sticker.

Attachment 380371

Here is a picture of the drawing. I see that this is upside down, I don't know why that happened. It is correct on my computer.

Attachment 380372

I have a 2002 Monaco signature 45 footer.
The switch on the dash connects the terminal on the boost relay to ground. The long run seems to drop the voltage on the coil to only about 10.7 volts. This does not seem to be enough to slam the contacts closed.


Ok if thatís correct your looking for a bad ground connection, check the ohms from the dash switch to a good chassis ground point, looking for 0 ohms or slightly above but less than 1 and make sure you also get 0 ohms across the switch when closed.

You can also verify if the wire running to the back is good by grounding it and see if the solenoid closes. If not its a wiring issue.

I see no signs of an automatic combiner such as a BIRD system in the pics, it appears your solenoid is just manually activated from the dash.
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Old 11-07-2022, 03:08 AM   #7
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Remove the wire from the solenoid and see if you get 12.6+ volts on it.
If it reads battery voltage, then voltage drop from the long run may be the issue.

If it still reads low, there's a connection problem. Should read higher with no load.
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Old 11-07-2022, 06:11 AM   #8
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Prop the boost switch on or have someone hold it.

Put your voltmeter negative lead on a good clean ground somewhere near that panel or inside is fine. Probe each large terminal on the solenoid. You should see a good battery voltage of 12.7 if charged. This is just a reference test to be sure you are using the meter correctly.

Take a measurement on each little terminal. Post those results.

You should see 0 volts on one terminal, and close to 12.5 on the other.

If you see 0 volts on one small terminal, and 10. something on the other (probably the purple wire), you do have a loss of control voltage.

If you are seeing voltage on both the small terminals, such as 12.5 on one and 2.5 on the other, then the lower voltage is the ground terminal and is not working as it should.

I will try to find the schematic represented by your layout.

Not knowing precisely how you energized the solenoid in you diagnostics these tests will prove where the problem lies.

In most cases I have found the purple wire to be the control. Kind of a standard practice for Monaco.

There are some tricky control circuits that reduce the voltage purposely after the solenoid is energized but the manual button likely bypasses that function.
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Old 11-07-2022, 06:34 AM   #9
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Seeing the picture, there are no devices ( BIRD, IRD BIM ) in this rig connected to the solenoid.
The large boost solenoid is just that and serves no other function. The dash switch is the only control.

Engine running charging is handled with the battery isolator on the left and the Lambert device, on the right, handles house to chassis charging.
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Old 11-07-2022, 07:04 AM   #10
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Going out on a limb here. This is from a different yr model.

Using your picture. There is a breaker just below the large solenoid. It has a jumper right off that large terminal strip.

The other end of the breaker is not visible but it may be the power feed to one of the solenoid small terminals. If so, you should see whatever voltage is on the large terminal strip below on the solenoid IF the corrosion seen in your picture is not causing a voltage drop or there is a loose connection.

The other wire which shows on the schematic attached is orange and is a ground coming from your boost switch when pushed. Again, the corrosion could be a real factor but in any case, with the boost switch pushed that orange wire should be very close to zero volts.

Again, this might not be precise but my previous post will diagnose it in any case.
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Old 11-07-2022, 07:44 AM   #11
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Old 11-07-2022, 11:01 AM   #12
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OK, I did lots of measurements. All voltages measured to ground.

Nothing turned on and connected to shore power. House battery charger is running.
House battery voltage: 13.51v
Chassis battery voltage: 12.07v
Relay terminals: 13.53, 13.53, 0 amps

Boost switch on dashboard pressed.
House battery voltage: 13.40v
Chassis battery voltage: 12.07v
Relay terminals: 13.40, 1.85v, 1.8 amps

I used a clip lead to ground the terminal on the boost relay.
House battery voltage: 13.35v
Chassis battery voltage: 13.31v
Relay terminals: 13.26v, 0.2v, 2 amps

The significant thing that I see is that at 1.8 amps, the relay does not pull in fully and does not make contact. At 2 amps, the boost relay does pull in and make contact. It seems that the voltage drop of 1.85v from the switch on the dash is too much for the relay to work.

Also, it seems that my Lambert device is not working. The LED is showing green, but there is about 1.5 volts difference between the terminals. The center connection is connected to ground, as it should be. Is this correct, my Lambert device is bad?
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Old 11-07-2022, 11:41 AM   #13
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OK, I did lots of measurements. All voltages measured to ground.

Nothing turned on and connected to shore power. House battery charger is running.
House battery voltage: 13.51v
Chassis battery voltage: 12.07v
Relay terminals: 13.53, 13.53, 0 amps

Boost switch on dashboard pressed.
House battery voltage: 13.40v
Chassis battery voltage: 12.07v Device that is supposed to charge chassis battery broken
Relay terminals: 13.40, 1.85v, 1.8 amps and your boost switch is not going all the way to ground.

I used a clip lead to ground the terminal on the boost relay.
House battery voltage: 13.35v
Chassis battery voltage: 13.31v Perfect. This proves the solenoid contacts are working.
Relay terminals: 13.26v, 0.2v, 2 amps Two, to 2.5 amps is normal for this solenoid. It gets hot when on for a long time.

The significant thing that I see is that at 1.8 amps, the relay does not pull in fully and does not make contact. At 2 amps, the boost relay does pull in and make contact. It seems that the voltage drop of 1.85v from the switch on the dash is too much for the relay to work. It is the voltage drop that causes the drop in current. Normally one does not measure current when working on a problem like this, but it demonstrates your confidence in your test equipment and methods.
This is spot on. The relay is not pulling in due to the 1.5 volts loss in the ground path. Your temporary ground proved the relay/solenoid is functioning. You have essentially the same voltage across the large terminals. To help identify where the poor ground is you can start right at the switch. You should be able to determine which wire on the switch is the wire that goes to the solenoid because it would have approx. 13 volts on one of the contacts. That volage should go to zero when you push the switch, if the switch is working properly and the ground side of the switch is working. Or just take measurements on the switch in its idle position, then take the same measurements while pushing it. Then post those.


Also, it seems that my Lambert device is not working. The LED is showing green, but there is about 1.5 volts difference between the terminals. The center connection is connected to ground, as it should be. Is this correct, my Lambert device is bad?
I need to check that out but you are definitely not getting the proper charge.
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Old 11-07-2022, 12:03 PM   #14
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https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/lam...ml#post3344799

Searching for the Lambert this old post came up. Post 2 from DR4films has the lambert troubleshooting diagram but I am including it now.

Based on that it does appear yours is defective. There are lots of great products out there to replace it.
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