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Old 09-28-2020, 05:54 PM   #1
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Decisions have been made.

About 4 years ago, we sprung for a Monaco Windsor PBDD, in great condition, Just enough miles to be broken in, stored inside and generally in great shape.
Only minor issues over the years. but some parts were aging. We either needed to upgrade to somethign newer or put some money into this one.

We primarily boondock and really rely on the ability to be off-grid if needed (especially in this day and age)

After thinking it through, the wife and I have decided to keep our little gem. Our came the wallet, had the mechanic go thru the entire coach, we replaced all the airbags, one was leaking, got all the fluids changed out. Now the big one: Batteries are 7 years old and just not holding a charge. Sooooo... AGM? Liquid? Or take the jump, well, several phone calls and a chunk of change later and I will be going LiPo. This will be a full upgrade, I have 600W of solar on the top, upgrading the Solar Controller, the Inverter, Starting with 500A of Lithium in the GC2 case, Moving the batteries forward and inside a storage bay for Climate control. Fuses, Remote Control, Monitors and Managers and Isolators... Thats what I ordered. I would like to Publish the upgrade for anyone interested, its a pretty big step but I estimate having almost 3 times the capability and should be good for 10-15 years. Went with Battle Born out of Nevada for the parts - Part list as follows:

Victron BAM030712000R Battery Monitor with Bluetooth
SmartSolar MPPT 150/70-Tr VE.Can
225 amp BIM Li-Ion Battery Isolation Manager
5 -- Battle Born 100Ah GC2
3000 Watt, 12V Inverter/125 Amp PFC Charger, Mobile version Hybrid with Load Support, Dual Input/Output, 50Amp tranfer, RVC
Magnum Advanced Remote Control 50"
400A ANL Fuse + Fuse Holder

This should get me started, can add a couple more batteries down the road if I desire along with taking the Solar up to 1000 Watts

Hoping to find some folks that "have a clue" on the specifics of an installation like this. I am borderline over my head, not on the mechanical side, but the engineering/connections side and will certianly be looking for some help. Is there anyone out there who might be willing to Mentor me? I am in the N-Phx area and would even pay someone for their time and knowledge as I tackle this. This stuff can lend itself to some very expensive, if not flamable mistakes. PM Me if you can help me with this. I will post the progress with Pics for those interested in tackling this as well. - Thanks everyone, Hoping quartzite is a go this year. Brian
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Old 09-28-2020, 07:57 PM   #2
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Funny thing I am in surprise az and looking to do the same thing.

I feel the same way as you needing some mentor to come along.

Of course we could try to bang our heads together on it.

My setup will not have the solar you have to start.

I am ok on the design side but not on the get the hands dirty and move the cables side.
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Old 09-29-2020, 06:57 AM   #3
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This guys vids show many simple diagrams that I believe are from AM Solar websight this inverter install might be exactly what your considering. Under U tube vid is resources ,descriptions ect. I would poke around on AM Solar the sell Magnum also. There are a ton of RV installs for the thing You want to do.I can read schematics & line drawings but these type picta-drawings are always easier to wrap your mind around .There is a going green subforum on here.
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Old 09-29-2020, 06:36 PM   #4
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I posted a detailed thread on swapping the Trace Xantrex Inverter for a Magnum Hybrid:
https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/swa...re-386835.html

Best of luck with the rest of your update!
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Old 09-30-2020, 09:16 AM   #5
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Paste must not have took.
https://youtu.be/7xKOyRyxdNk
Quote:
Originally Posted by 153stars View Post
This guys vids show many simple diagrams that I believe are from AM Solar websight this inverter install might be exactly what your considering. Under U tube vid is resources ,descriptions ect. I would poke around on AM Solar the sell Magnum also. There are a ton of RV installs for the thing You want to do.I can read schematics & line drawings but these type picta-drawings are always easier to wrap your mind around .There is a going green subforum on here.
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Old 10-01-2020, 02:32 AM   #6
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Thank you everyone, have had some really smart guys reach out who are local, I will capture and post the process. Ordered everything Tuesday and showing a delivery of several hundred pounds of Lithium toys on Friday, really excited to get it moving. Thanks for all the links and advice so far, should have some questions coming up. Have a great week - Brian
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Old 10-12-2020, 01:02 AM   #7
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Update

Well I got a bunch of heavy boxes in and came up with a tentative plan. Started and now I am getting a bit nervous as to the undertaking I am confronted with - I have been drowning in 10 year old powder dust from underneath the coach as I try to trace, pull and reroute wires. I can saw, weld, hammer and glue, but this electric stuff has my head spinning.

So Far - To optimize cable lengths and minimize voltage drops, I have decided to relocate the Inverter from the center bay of the rear of the coach to the top shelf of the battery compartment where the Chassis batteries used to sit. The 5 LiPO's will be mounted underneath the inverter. I pulled out three massive 4/0 cables that went to the old inverter – 25 foot each for the Pos, Batt Neg and Chassis Neg, after the move, those cables will all be 4 Footers. This also Freed up ¾ of a Bay that I did not have access to previously. Never thought it was wise to put a pile of your high voltage cables and an inverter directly below your grey and black tanks, does not make sense to me at all.
I upgraded the engine batteries to AGM's and have relocated them to the engine bay.

Solar -- I am mounting the new Solar Controller in the bay where the inverter used to be. It will go next to the transfer switch. The old Heliotrope RV-30D controller was above the front door, So, the 10 gauge cables ran from the roof - to the fridge vent - to the controller at the front of the coach, then all the way to the back where the batteries are. I ran new 4 Gauge wire pretty much straight down to the bay where the new controller will be. Then it will only be about 15 feet to the batteries. The heliotrope could charge 2 sets of batteries, apparently the SmartSolar MPPT 150/70-Tr VE can only charge one set of batteries. I now have four 100w Panels and two 170 watt panels on top now so an update is vital.

Now for this batch of questions/worries/concerns.

Solar - One thought I had was to keep the old solar controller and just use 2 100w panels for the Engine Batteries, that will allow me to send 540 watts to the LiPO batteries with the new controller – or should I skip that and just use a battery tender on the engine batteries and send all 740 watts to the LiPO?

Generator - The MagnaSine Hybrid MSH3012RV does not have auto GenStart built in, so I ordered a ME-AGS-N - I was hoping the labels would match up a bit better than they do, but in reality, the labels to not match up very well - I do not have a yellow wire like I have seen mentioned.
I have a bundle of wires, - 2 Green, 2 Red, 2 Black and 2 Blue that was wired up to the Trace inverter as follows - Green pair = Gen Run 2, Red Pair = Gen Start 2, Black Pair = both Gen Run 1 and Gen Start 1, The Blue pair was not connected to anything, just twisted together with a wire Nut. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Inverter – Sounds like I need to ensure I have a 4/0 Ground from Battery Neg to the Inverter and I am placing a 4/0 Ground from Battery Neg to the Chassis Ground Lug by the engine. Done on that.
(Please excuse me if this comes out as gibberish)
The old 2000W Trace Inverter, as I understand had Dual Input/Dual output, but as I understand one leg was pass thru – I pulled out 4 Romex Lines – 2 In and 2 out – These are 10/2 Romex and my panels are fused for 30 Amps on each leg. I will need to extend each of these lines about 15 feet to reach the new Inverter Location which I planned on doing in a Junction Box.
The 3 possibilities for the new inverter show; Single In/Single Out, Dual in/Single out or Dual in/Dual out. Now the part worrying me is A-They all show 50-amp breakers (I have 30) and from what I am reading, the Romex should be 6/2 (I have 10/2).
1. Do I need to run new Romex to my panels?
2. Am I OK with the 10/2 wire if I leave the 30 Amp breakers in place?
3. Do I lose capability by leaving it 30 Amp?
4. Do I need to replace the Wiring with 6/2 (which may not be to bad since my panels are directly above the new Inverter location.
5. Which Wiring schematic should I follow? Single/Single, Single/Double or Double/Double?

I still have a bunch of other questions about the “225 amp BIM Li-Ion Battery Isolation Manager” and what components I need to pull out and what I can keep, Thoughts on maintaining the Chassis batteries. I have committed to having to pull some wiring to the front of the coach, just want to do it once with everything

That is where I am at so far – Thank you to all the smart folks that have messaged and are helping me figure this out – need to get back on the road, but do not want to burn down the coach or blow up some very expensive parts in the process – Cannot wait to get some clarity on this mess – Thanks again – Brian

Attached – Old Inverter position and batteries and the PDF of coach Inverter wiring schematic from factory
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File Type: pdf 2003 Windsor wiring diagrams 19.pdf (79.3 KB, 2 views)
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Old 10-16-2020, 07:41 AM   #8
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From what I've read (I don't claim to be an expert but rather someone who researches before making a leap) that Lithium needs a climate controlled storage area mostly for cold weather. I've seen installations where they monitor temps and install heaters to maintain proper heat. Will you able to do that in the current battery location.
My battery location is fairly exposed, it would take a lot of work to keep it warm in any type of cold weather. I ultimately figured if I ever made the leap I'd locate the batteries in the house somewhere I could monitor and keep controlled, which I have limited options for doing this.
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Old 10-16-2020, 07:46 AM   #9
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Lithium only need to stay above freezing when charging.

I also believe the battle borne BMS will not allow charging at low temps.

My solution is use the wheels to keep the temps up.
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Old 10-16-2020, 07:52 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biljol View Post
Lithium only need to stay above freezing when charging.

I also believe the battle borne BMS will not allow charging at low temps.

My solution is use the wheels to keep the temps up.

So if you are in a cold climate you can't charge the batteries if they storage area they are in is not climate controlled. That's my point and just trying to confirm the OP has thought about this.



One option for me would be to keep my current battery configuration but add lithium as a second source for powering my residential using a separate smaller inverter. That way I could simply disconnect and remove the battery while in storage where there could be a higher potential of freezing.
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Old 10-16-2020, 11:33 PM   #11
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As I understand it, you are correct - they will not charge below freezing, My solution would be to use a heating blanket if needed. Being as I am in AZ, Freezing is not that much of an issue - I could seal off the location fairly easy if I need to and the batteries are in with the inverter which produces a fair amount of heat as well when it is working. The muffler is right below the batteries, not sure how much heat would be transferred via that, may have to take a look at that on one of our trips.

Good point though, if I had to, worst case, I believe it would be pretty easy to would not be to difficult to relocate the batteries under the bed if I had to. All good points, j
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