Free 7 Day Trial RV GPS App RV Trip Planner Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Free 7 Day Trial ×
RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > THE OWNER'S CORNER FORUMS > Monaco Owner's Forum
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-30-2021, 05:12 PM   #1
Junior Member
 
Holiday Rambler Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Livingston TX
Posts: 7
Help and Advice Adding BB Lithium to Monaco Coach

Good Day! I am looking for some advice on installing BB Lithium batteries in my 2013 40 ft Holiday Rambler or 2012 or 13 Monaco coach. I think I need to replace both Big Boy relay and Bi-Directional Isolator Relay Delay diesel-2 with a
Li-Bim 225? BUT both the Ignition and Ground wires are tied into other wires. Plus the Solenoid (which is attached to the SIG on the BiM) to be able to use the Battery Boost. I am most interested any 2012 or 2013 40 ft, not 38 (different setup) coach MFG by Navistar.
Thank you all in advance
rwkerchner is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 07-31-2021, 06:38 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
gsgriffin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 684
So, you are replacing only the chassis batteries or also the house batteries? I put in Big Batteries (17kwh) for the house, but not the chassis. I use a trickle charge from house to chassis to make sure those are always charged.
__________________
2004 Monaco DST 40'-Cummins 330ISC/Onan 7.5K Quiet Diesel Gen/Silverleaf VMSpc/Garmin 760MLT/WeBoost 4Gx-OTR/EEZ Tire Monitor/ReadyBrake->Roadmaster All Terrain->'21 Gladiator Willys EcoDiesel-17KWh LFP BigBatt-/RO-100G/2400W solar roof/Victron MPPTs
gsgriffin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2021, 09:43 AM   #3
Junior Member
 
Holiday Rambler Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Livingston TX
Posts: 7
Good Day! Thanks for your reply. I am replacing 4 6v 420Ah US batteries with 6 BB Lithium. Keeping the chassis batteries lead acid.
rwkerchner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2021, 12:03 PM   #4
NRF
Senior Member
 
NRF's Avatar
 
Monaco Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Friendswood, Texas
Posts: 175
Good question. Looking to replace my 4 6V L16 Lead-acid batteries with 2 200AH Lithium. Noted that my positive cable on the house batteries receives a feed from the chassis (lead acid) batteries . Wondering if this would be detrimental to the new lithium batteries......
NRF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2021, 12:27 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Jon_C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Southeast Texas
Posts: 587
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwkerchner View Post
Good Day! I am looking for some advice on installing BB Lithium batteries in my 2013 40 ft Holiday Rambler or 2012 or 13 Monaco coach. I think I need to replace both Big Boy relay and Bi-Directional Isolator Relay Delay diesel-2 with a
Li-Bim 225? BUT both the Ignition and Ground wires are tied into other wires. Plus the Solenoid (which is attached to the SIG on the BiM) to be able to use the Battery Boost. I am most interested any 2012 or 2013 40 ft, not 38 (different setup) coach MFG by Navistar.
Thank you all in advance
Assuming you want to charge the house battery’s with alternator, if so you’re going to need alternator protection. The BIRD system has very limited protection based on voltage, not good enough (in my opinion) to be called protection. The charging voltage has to drop to below 12.0 volts (very heavy load) before the solenoid opens and it closes again when voltage rises to 13.3v which probably won’t be very long in most cases.

The BiM also has some protection as it cycles the alternator charging on for15 minutes then off for 20 to allow alt to cool. However, with 600 ah of batteries, your alternator will be under VERY heavy load for the 15 minutes if your house batts are low. Lithium batterys accept a much higher rate of charge than lead acid. Over time this could damage the alternator.

The BEST solution (IMO) is use a dc-dc charger that limits the alternator current to the house batteries, these come in different sizes such as 20, 30 60 amp etc. this keeps the charging current to a level not damaging to your alternator at all times. You could still use your existing BIRD relay with manual switch to manually tie the banks together if needed.

You should also consider a new converter designed to charge lithium as they require higher voltage and different charge profile than lead acid. Your existing will work but will not charge lithium fully.

Here are links so you can look at
BIRD2: https://www.mikerobotics.com/Intelli...300839.100.pdf

BiM 225: https://1t1pye1e13di20waq11old70-wpe...uick-Guide.pdf

Dc-dc charger:
https://www.amazon.com/Orion-Tr-12-3...7755583&sr=8-3
Jon_C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2021, 01:20 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
vito.a's Avatar
 
Monaco Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 5,403
Having just been through this I can explain the issues.
Your first problem is fitting the Battle Born batteries. Lead acid GC2 6V batteries are 10.3" long X 7.11" wide and 11.07" high.
The standard Battle Born 100ah battery is 12.76" long × 6.86" wide × 8.95" high. Four of these will not fit in the upper battery tray. You could put them in another location such as the storage area behind the main battery bay. Some folks are installing them under the bed.
However, Battle Born makes a GC2 replacement. It is 10.31" long × 7.28" wide × 11.02" high. Although tight, I think four of these will fit. They are slightly more expensive and sometimes difficult to get.

Your next issue is to separate the Battle Born batteries from the chassis battery and alternator. I would install a Blue Sea ML-ACR. This is a great way to control your house and chassis battery connection and maintain your Boost function. There is another thread on this forum that explains the installation.
https://www.bluesea.com/products/cat...Relays/ML-ACRs

Most folks are installing a DC to DC charge controller to protect the alternator. The requirement for this has been debated. If you use the on board generator and inverter to keep your batteries relatively charged you may not need a DC to DC charger. You can read about these in the "Going Green" section.
https://www.irv2.com/forums/f56/

Your next issue is to keep the Battle Born batteries from freezing as well as from over heating. They make an automatic heating pad to prevent freezing but the high temperature can be a real problem depending on where you live and travel (like the desert southwest).

Now down to the important part. Do you already own this coach?
If not, I would encourage you to research Navistar International. In my opinion just about everything they have touched has been a disaster starting with the class action lawsuit over the Ford Powerstroke engine failures (manufactured by Navistar) and on to the MaxForce diesel engine failures.
Monaco Coach filed bankruptcy in Mar 2009. They were just preparing for 2010 model production. I would recommend staying with a 2002-2009 model Monaco coach. Remember, most 2009 coaches were built in 2008.

Best of luck!
__________________
97 Monaco Windsor- Sold
07 Monaco Executive McKinley- Sold
04 Monaco Signature Chateau IV
vito.a is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2021, 05:49 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Jon_C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Southeast Texas
Posts: 587
Quote:
Originally Posted by vito.a View Post
Having just been through this I can explain the issues.
Your first problem is fitting the Battle Born batteries. Lead acid GC2 6V batteries are 10.3" long X 7.11" wide and 11.07" high.
The standard Battle Born 100ah battery is 12.76" long × 6.86" wide × 8.95" high. Four of these will not fit in the upper battery tray. You could put them in another location such as the storage area behind the main battery bay. Some folks are installing them under the bed.
However, Battle Born makes a GC2 replacement. It is 10.31" long × 7.28" wide × 11.02" high. Although tight, I think four of these will fit. They are slightly more expensive and sometimes difficult to get.

Your next issue is to separate the Battle Born batteries from the chassis battery and alternator. I would install a Blue Sea ML-ACR. This is a great way to control your house and chassis battery connection and maintain your Boost function. There is another thread on this forum that explains the installation.
https://www.bluesea.com/products/cat...Relays/ML-ACRs

Most folks are installing a DC to DC charge controller to protect the alternator. The requirement for this has been debated. If you use the on board generator and inverter to keep your batteries relatively charged you may not need a DC to DC charger. You can read about these in the "Going Green" section.
https://www.irv2.com/forums/f56/

Your next issue is to keep the Battle Born batteries from freezing as well as from over heating. They make an automatic heating pad to prevent freezing but the high temperature can be a real problem depending on where you live and travel (like the desert southwest).

Now down to the important part. Do you already own this coach?
If not, I would encourage you to research Navistar International. In my opinion just about everything they have touched has been a disaster starting with the class action lawsuit over the Ford Powerstroke engine failures (manufactured by Navistar) and on to the MaxForce diesel engine failures.
Monaco Coach filed bankruptcy in Mar 2009. They were just preparing for 2010 model production. I would recommend staying with a 2002-2009 model Monaco coach. Remember, most 2009 coaches were built in 2008.

Best of luck!


Hey Vito, if you don’t mind how many BB batteries do you have and what size is your alternator and do you charge your house batts with the alternator from low charge? And how long have you had this setup?

The acr drops out at 12.75 volts which is better than the BiM but im wondering is that sufficient to protect the alternator ?
Im still not on board with protection via voltage as its the current that overheats the alt. Using ohms law (current = voltage/ resistance) the battery internal resistance is an unknown and changes so voltage alone is not a good measure of current load. Thanks
Jon_C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2021, 05:13 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
gsgriffin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 684
Not sure if your battery bay is similar to mine. I was going to use Battle Born until I saw Big Battery and their stackable steel cases with voltage display and on/off button. I love using the Anderson connectors. The batteries automatically sync with one another (ie. I press the power button on one and they all turn on or off). It has the typical low temp cut-off, full charge cut-off, and wants a high charge voltage.

The difference is that when I considered the amperage for the time I was driving, I didn't feel it was really worth trying to get full charge amperage from the engine while driving. I went the solar route. I use the LSL 15amp charge module that simply allows current to flow only when there is a voltage high enough.

In the end, I rotated my chassis batteries to go along the back and found that I could place 8 - 170ah batteries in the same space. They are all at a slight angle to allow for the Anderson connector that comes out the top back side.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20210313_122328.jpg
Views:	7
Size:	252.7 KB
ID:	337971   Click image for larger version

Name:	20210313_155613.jpg
Views:	7
Size:	356.3 KB
ID:	337972  

Click image for larger version

Name:	20210313_161921.jpg
Views:	8
Size:	243.3 KB
ID:	337973   Click image for larger version

Name:	20210313_165156.jpg
Views:	8
Size:	229.8 KB
ID:	337974  

__________________
2004 Monaco DST 40'-Cummins 330ISC/Onan 7.5K Quiet Diesel Gen/Silverleaf VMSpc/Garmin 760MLT/WeBoost 4Gx-OTR/EEZ Tire Monitor/ReadyBrake->Roadmaster All Terrain->'21 Gladiator Willys EcoDiesel-17KWh LFP BigBatt-/RO-100G/2400W solar roof/Victron MPPTs
gsgriffin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2021, 09:39 AM   #9
Junior Member
 
Holiday Rambler Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Livingston TX
Posts: 7
Thank You. My coach has a single "dumb" relay BIG BOY between the coach batteries and the chassis batteries .
rwkerchner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2021, 09:49 AM   #10
Junior Member
 
Holiday Rambler Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Livingston TX
Posts: 7
Thank You. We purchased the HR in 2013 it came with 4 6V 420Ah batteries. Battery car-meant is 25Hx27Wx19D. Yes we did have one engine issue. Navistar had a recall in 2014.We took the coach in, the fix was made and have no problems since. Getting between 7.5 to 8 MPG and don't need DEF.
rwkerchner is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
advice, lithium, monaco



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Batteries to lithium or not to lithium sciblades RV Systems & Appliances 18 03-21-2021 10:40 PM
RV Lithium Lite & Lithium Super Upgrade Systems - Mike Mas Idleup iRV2.com General Discussion 10 02-20-2021 04:26 PM
Adding lithium and inverter problem on Sprinter Jpetzrick Going Green 17 03-21-2020 08:00 PM
need help with adding,removing potable water and adding antifreeze to holding tank highway dave Class A Motorhome Discussions 12 11-04-2015 11:54 AM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.