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Old 10-13-2007, 05:33 PM   #1
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OK you 'lectrical gurus, the Dynasty power system feeds both AC units, the water heater the MW and the receptacles where the coffee pot is located off the same 120V leg. I assume that the two distribution panels are set up so that these heavy loads will not be on the inverter (I also "assume" that that one of these panels is fed from the inverter when it is on). Now, is it feasible to switch one of the AC units to the inverter panel (assuming that I never-ever operate the AC unit when depending on the inverter to power that panel)? Or am I totally clueless concerning the function of the inverter?

The reason I ask this is that I keep tripping out my 50 amp Franks Voltage Booster (which is actually a 35 amp booster) when running both AC units and adding another heavy load. My in-progress plan is to replace the Franks with a Hughes true 50-amp booster, but looks like the evil-bay auction is not going to work out.
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Old 10-13-2007, 05:33 PM   #2
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OK you 'lectrical gurus, the Dynasty power system feeds both AC units, the water heater the MW and the receptacles where the coffee pot is located off the same 120V leg. I assume that the two distribution panels are set up so that these heavy loads will not be on the inverter (I also "assume" that that one of these panels is fed from the inverter when it is on). Now, is it feasible to switch one of the AC units to the inverter panel (assuming that I never-ever operate the AC unit when depending on the inverter to power that panel)? Or am I totally clueless concerning the function of the inverter?

The reason I ask this is that I keep tripping out my 50 amp Franks Voltage Booster (which is actually a 35 amp booster) when running both AC units and adding another heavy load. My in-progress plan is to replace the Franks with a Hughes true 50-amp booster, but looks like the evil-bay auction is not going to work out.
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Old 10-14-2007, 03:37 AM   #3
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Hey Ron -

I don't have a Dynasty schematic, so I can't even guess without more info. What did catch my eye tho is that both AC units are coming off one leg of the supply-line. It may be so, but I woulda thought one would be on each leg to balance-out the high-draw appliances a bit more. What big-draw items are on the other leg?
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Old 10-14-2007, 02:06 PM   #4
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Duuuhhh, I gotta dig out the schematics and see what they show.

The reason I "assumed" that both AC units are on the same leg is that the booster always trips out on the same leg and it takes the ACs off line.
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Old 10-14-2007, 06:47 PM   #5
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Duuuhhh, I gotta dig out the schematics and see what they show. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hey Bama... come on...this does not sound like you at all...has someone stolen your computer and started posting under your log-on??!



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Old 10-15-2007, 01:16 PM   #6
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I used my sawzall to open the schematics.
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Old 10-16-2007, 06:12 AM   #7
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Ron, I'm no electrical guru either, but my understanding is that on any coach only one AC unit can be run when connected to a 30A shore power connection. My AC units are on two different breakers in the electrical supply panels in my coach, so they must be on separate circuits. The microwave, AC outlets in the living area and the TVs are on the inverter, but the ACs are not. Of course, your Dynasty may be different, but I doubt it. It seems to follow to me that if your Frank's power booster is actually only supplying 35A of current that when you have two ACs running and then add another heavy load like the water heater or micro wave that the current draw would be high enough to trip out the power booster. Can you bypass this unit when connected to a 50A shore power feed to see if your coach's electrical system holds up to the load? What happens when you are running this load on the gen set?
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Old 10-16-2007, 09:04 AM   #8
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RonNBama:
The reason I ask this is that I keep tripping out my 50 amp Franks Voltage Booster (which is actually a 35 amp booster) when running both AC units and adding another heavy load. My in-progress plan is to replace the Franks with a Hughes true 50-amp booster, </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Ron,

Couple of points for you to consider... First, while I don't know the power layout of the Dynasty, I seriously doubt that both AC units are on one leg. They are always wired on seperate 50a legs. Take a look at the panel where the AC units are fed. That one panel probably serves both legs, with the breakers from one leg being on the left, the other on the right, and the two "mains" in the middle.

Also, keep in mind that the Franks and Hughes units do NOT boost your power. They are voltage boosters - nothing more than a step-up transformer to aid in low voltage situations. When they are boosting voltage, you actually have LESS power available to use, so they won't help you operate a greater load (like running another AC unit or appliance that you couldn't otherwise run). In keeping with Ohm's Law, the unit will "trade" volts for watts, at a given amount of current (Power = Voltage x Amperage). So, doing the math, if a Hughes Autoformer is giving you 10% more voltage (to keep your appliances happy when there's low voltage in the campground), then it is also giving you 10% less Watts, because the availabe amperage (current) at the pedistal is the constant in the equation.
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Old 10-16-2007, 09:18 AM   #9
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BIGRED1:
Ron, I'm no electrical guru either, but my understanding is that on any coach only one AC unit can be run when connected to a 30A shore power connection. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bigred,

You are correct, of course, given a 50A motohome. But if you had an '00 Discovery (which was only a 30A coach), rather than an '00 Monaco, you might be surprised to learn that you could run BOTH AC units from 30 amps. They way they did that was through a shedding control unit that would not let both AC compressors run at the same time. While both units were running, the compressors in the front and back units would alternate when they came on.

I had a '99 Discovery before I bought my Diplomat. I once had a guy swear to me that my coach must be 50 amps because I had two ac's running.
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Old 10-17-2007, 06:24 AM   #10
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Robin, I think your Discovery was an exception to the rule, but even with load shedding, it was not actually running both AC units at the same time on a 30A power feed. It was switching one of them off. That is what I meant in my earlier post.
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Old 10-17-2007, 06:43 AM   #11
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Yes, that's what it was doing. The system was part of the Intellitec Climate Control system. It worked very smoothly shedding only the comrpressors, not the fan, so you couldn't really sense that they were shedding at all, unless you knew what was going on. That Intellitec system was used on a lot of 30 amp coaches - probably still is.
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Old 10-17-2007, 05:08 PM   #12
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A picture is supposed to be worth a thousand words, but I don't have room for either here. Looking at the 120V wiring diagram doesn't help much. The main panel is fed from the transfer switch through a 50 amp breaker (double pole). The main bkr occupies positions #4 and #5 in the panel. Positions #6 and #3 are 30 amp (single pole) breakers feeding the inverter. Positions #7 and #8 are 20 amp breakers feeding AC units rear and front respectively. Positions #1 is for the washer/dryer and #2 is for the water heater. I will have to pull the panel cover to see how the bus is split, but it sure looks like one side of the main feeds the "top" (positions 6,7 & 8) and the other feeds the "bottom" (positions 1,2 & 3).

This gets more puzzling as I dig deeper. I "thought" that the water heater was the overload culprit causing trips but it could be load passing through the inverter to the sub panel (microwave, fridge, receptacles).

Known Fact: when I get the trip, it takes out both AC units, the fridge and the coffee pot receptacle. I need to check to see what else still has power.

The inverter is fed from two 30 amp breakers and in turn feeds two 30amp breakers in the sub panel. I "assume" these are the "mains" for the sub panel buses and that if one of the 30 amp inputs from the main panel is de-energized, then the corresponding 30 amp "output" to the sub-panel is also de-energized along with that half of the sub-panel load.

Whew, I'm gonna go have a cold beer or three and scratch my head for a few minutes. Then when I am completely in command of my facilities, I am going to get out the trusty Fluke and test this convoluted hypothesis.

Geez, I sure hope this isn't one of those well thought out diatribes that one reads in the light of day and says, "WHAT WAS I THINKING"! Then prays that no one else has read it before it can be deleted!

Edit: Hmmmm, wonder if the solution could be as simple as switching breaker positions between one of the AC units and the washer/dryer (which I never use). Naw, that'd be too simple. There is probably a staggered-lug, reversible/progressive, left-hand-thread, metric volumizing setup behind that simple looking panel cover.
Oh, one more thing. No one need try to read this and explain it to me. My therapist said I should share my mental mal-functions with others and I would be healed.
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Old 10-18-2007, 08:13 AM   #13
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RonNBama:
The main bkr occupies positions #4 and #5 in the panel. Positions #6 and #3 are 30 amp (single pole) breakers feeding the inverter. Positions #7 and #8 are 20 amp breakers feeding AC units rear and front respectively. Positions #1 is for the washer/dryer and #2 is for the water heater. I will have to pull the panel cover to see how the bus is split, but it sure looks like one side of the main feeds the "top" (positions 6,7 & 8) and the other feeds the "bottom" (positions 1,2 & 3). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Ron, That assumption would make sense. Accordingly, it also implies that you were correct when you said both AC units are running off one 50a leg. Very odd, in my experience, but there it is. That would also explain why they both go out together while other stuff remains powered.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Hmmmm, wonder if the solution could be as simple as switching breaker positions between one of the AC units and the washer/dryer (which I never use). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
May be. But I'd sure want to have someone experienced take a look at the entire load distribution, with a schematic, before doing that.
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Old 10-18-2007, 01:01 PM   #14
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Ah Ha! You guys were absolutely correct. The bus is split even/odd breaker slots and the AC units are indeed on opposite legs. I have solved my problem. Well, I now know what my problem is and how to handle it.
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