Propane Fired Hot Tub ?

[Isaac-1]

You mention shopping for a $1,500 tub, be careful there are a lot of junk tubs out there and a lot of people wanting you to pay them to haul them away. A good brand name hot tub will sell for around $8,000+ new, there are a lot of fly by night brands out there that sell in the $4,500 new range, these tubs tend to be junk, and will fall apart within 5 years, at which point people will advertise them for sale for $1,500 and want you to haul them off.


Hot tubs are a bit like RV's, leaks and wood rot are the primary killers, cheap tubs spring leaks in the plumbing fittings which are often embedded in foam and very difficult to access in order to repair.


p.s. one of the corners that tends to be cut on cheap tubs is lack of insulation, also remember more is not better when it comes to number of jets. Many cheap tubs advertise based on number of jets, a tub with 5 well designed and reasonably powered jets can be better than one with 72 poorly placed under powered jets.

[K7JV]

Isaac-1 has "Been there, done that!" His advice is very good! I can speak to the quality of the hot tubs manufactured by Hot Spring (Watkins). They aren't inexpensive, but in a home use environment, and well maintained, they should be able to give you 20 years of service.

Cost of operation? It depend on how you are going to use it. Energy is used in three ways, in these things. FIRST: There is the energy to bring it up to temperature when it is filled with fresh water, or to recover from being turned off long enough for it to cool down. SECOND: There is the energy to keep it at your thermostat set point so it will be ready to use when you want to use it. THIRD: There is the energy for the jet pump, circulating pump, light, etc.

FIRST: This is pretty big. On electrical supply it will take hours, if not a day, depending on the heater rating, to get up to temperature. A fossil fuel fired heater will do it in FAR less time. If you keep your tub up to temperature 24/7, this bump in heating cost will really be minimal. If you let it cool down after every use, then you will use more energy ($$$) depending on how often you heat it up to use it.

SECOND: If you buy a well insulated tub and cover, you really won't be able to see much if any change in your utility bill if you keep it up to temperature. A warm spell or a cold spell will have far more effect on your home utility HVAC bill than will your hot tub, so it really will be hard to nail down the increase in cost due to your hot tub. It will use the heater more than you might think when the lid is off and you are actually using it, but it only takes minutes for the heater to make that up after you get out of the tub.

THIRD: Like one of your earlier responders said, energy use from the pumps and the light really are a non-item. You may even find that that you don't use the jet pump all the time you are in the tub. We actually rarely use ours. It makes talking a little harder, it gets little water droplets in your margarita, it can toss you around a bit, but it really does feel awesome!

My take: I would lean towards a high quality tub, especially if I was going to use it fairly often, and leave it in one spot, not moving it from campground to campground. If I was going to use it for the occasional Friday night party, or football game party, I might consider just heating it when I wanted to use it, and propane would be a good choice for that application. (You'll put way more heat into it in way less time with propane than with electric energy.) If I was going to want to use it more frequently, it really is more cost effective to buy a good tub, heat it with electricity if you can (unless your energy costs are out the roof for your utility company) and keep it up to temperature 24/7.

Whatever you do, ENJOY!!! We love our hot tub, and we REEEEELY miss it when we are away from home in our RV.

[BobJones]

Massive thanks to both of you for setting me straight on getting a used tub as well as the breakdown on where the costs occur during operation. It all makes sense and as I've been looking at the new tubs from Arctic I've been coming to the same conclusion.

So it sounds like the way to fly is to go new, get a good one, and that the single largest operating cost is the initial heating of the tub. Once that's done you get some increased costs when using it (not a big deal, after all, it's in use!) and when it's idle and properly covered it will draw little power.

One of the reasons why I was hoping to go used was due to my being in a park. Ie, if I had to leave (and perhaps even leave it behind) it would not be a big deal. At $1,500 or $2k it would not be the end of the world especially if I had used it for some time.

But, if I'm going into a new one, let's say $10k then I would have to weigh all that out. In that event, should I leave, it would have to go with me or, more accurately, off to somewhere else.

My folks live in the neighboring town (10 mins away) and they have a patio with power right there....hmmm....come to think of it, they should buy one and I'll just go over there to help them use it

But seriously, what I'm tossing around right now is, if I get one for my park lot then I would have to have a deal with mom & dad where if I leave it goes to their patio (or some variation of that). These are all the things I have to weigh out but it sounds like getting a new Arctic model is the way to fly and that electricity is not going to as evil as I had heard. That alone gets me way further down the road.

[K7JV]

Bob, a used one could work, but I'd be nervous about why it is on the market. If "they" just wanted a bigger tub, or a smaller tub, and traded it in, that is one thing. If you could be satisfied by the seller as to the reason it is on the used market, it could be an option. I'd definitely shop brands, if I was going to do that. I wish I had more experience to offer as to good brands versus bad ones, but I don't. I do konw that the Hot Springs line is generally a very good one. For new, I think your budget of $10,000 would move than cover anything you might want to try, including some pretty nice party tubs.

One think you will want to keep in mind is the source of power for your tub. Ours is a 120 volt tub, and it connects "to the world" via a cord with a GFI male plug on the end, and it is plugged into a normal 20 amp outlet that we had installed in, on a dedicated circuit, for that purpose. Most hot tubs, and likely all 240 volt hot tubs, require a panel with a disconnect within a certain distance from the tub, and the tub is connected by "permanent" conduit and wiring. So you will likely be involved with a licensed electrician for the installation of that equipment. The hot tub retailer will be able to help you get that done. But it is something you will be looking at, if you go with an electrically heated tub.

A 120 volt tub will take much longer to heat up than a 240 volt tub. It won't cost any more to heat it. It will just take twice as long to get it up to temperature. Also, it is likely that if it is a 120 volt tub, the heater will have to shut off whenever the jet pump is operated, due to the 20 amp current limitation of the power supply. Again, that is what we have in our home, and it works great for us, but our tub is a very small, two person tub. Like I mentioned in a previous post, we probably use ours five times a week, and we've had hot tubs for over 25 years, now.

Lots to think about! But I think you are on the right track.

I have heard about inflatable, propane (or even wood burner) powered and easily taken down, stored and re-inflated and used tubs for true portability. Depending on your needs, could be interesting. I've never seen one, just heard about them. Likely no jets. Likely no filtration systems. Life span probably pretty limited. Wouldn't work for us, but worth mentioning. Probably very inexpensive, and disposable when it wears out or the charm factor fades.

[Isaac-1]

Good used hot tubs are out there, you just have to dig through a lot of junk to find one, I paid $1,200 for my Hot Spring Jetsetter, then had to invest about $400 hooking it up and getting it working right. That was about 5 years ago, since then I have had to put another $450 or so into it (mostly new heater and new circulation pump). Mine though may be a bit of an exception, it had spent its entire life indoors, I bought it from an electrician who probably got it for free, pulling it out when the new home owner did not want a hot tub. He then kept it in a storage shed for 5 or 6 years until I bought it. Time had taken some toll, the $150 water circulation pump died within a week of my installing it, and the bearings had failed in a couple of the spinning jets, ... Still overall I am happy with the tub, though it was a good year, as 1998 was the last year that Hot Spring used real redwood for the cabinets, in 1999 they went to fake plastic redwood which did not age well (turned orange with age). When people look at mine they never guess it is 20 years old.

Ike

p.s. and just to show better deals than mine show up, just a week after I bought it I ran across an ad where someone was selling a 3 year old Hot Spring Jetsetter for just $1,500 a few miles from my house. (they were taking a job out of state and did not want to haul a 550 pound tub with them)

[NLOVNIT]

We installed a 2-person Softub spa in our S&B basement 8 years ago. Runs off std household current. They're not cheap new, but occasionally I've seen them for sale 1/2 price on the internet.

Lori-

[TonyMac]

I've had a Bullfrog 552 tub for a decade. It heats up at 5 degrees per hour, using a 220vac heater. I doubt a propane heater would be much faster. It has two pumps, one of which is filtered. That pump is suggested to run for two 2 hour periods, 12 hours apart, as filter cycles. We keep our tub at 102*F, 98*F would feel cold, that's body temp. When you fill your tub with tap water, it will take about 6 hours to get it up to heat. In the winter, the heat comes out of the water at a good pace, the steam make it look like our house is on fire, but the electric heater can easily keep up if I start that pump on low about when I open the tub. I use electricity freely, and could not possibly care less how much our hot tub costs in electrical power. It feels that good.

[FloridaCanuk]

We have an Intex inflatable hot tub. It could technically be taken in the basement of the average RV, though we leave ours set up at home. It uses very little electricity, however you wouldn’t want to use it in colder climates because of the lack of insulation. Very comfortable to sit in, though, and great for year-round use in South Florida. Cost is under $500 dollars and it’s lasted about 4 years so far.

[BobJones]

I'm thinking, more and more, of getting a 6 man tub and just biting the bullet. Now here's what's really funny. I was over at my Dad's today and at lunch they mentioned that I could not, under any circumstances, put my hot tub on their patio.....

It seems that Dad has been reading the forums (!!) and saw my post So now I'm in dutch, so to speak. Now the good news is that, at 85, he does not know how to reply to the post, and good thing too, or he might try and spank me publicly, right here, on this forum

But...I am thinking....a brand new 6 person hot tub (filled with young women!) and the built-in stereo, along with the ability to turn it on and off with my cell phone

Oh boy, when I drop by their place tomorrow I'm sure I won't hear the end of it now