Wandering, sway bars, alignment, ride height, oh my!!

[mydogmax]

I installed my own, its really not hard.

[CrazyKnight]

If any of you are at the HR419 Maintenance Session in Goshen IN.
Van Williams (VanWill) , myself (CrazyKnight) and Mike Hughes (MHughes) of Monaco Watts are all in attendance. Feel free to come on by and say hello at site 260, we are all parked together.

Van and I will be presenting 2 seminars. Chassis info including Watts Links and Steering Gears. Mike Hughes (Monaco Watts) has a vendor booth set up and will be doing some installations.

Cheers,

Craig

[zo66]

Originally Posted by mydogmax

I installed my own, its really not hard.

X2.....

If you are mechanically inclined, it really isn't a difficult project. It does however made a big improvement

[10Boomer]

Originally Posted by CrazyKnight

If any of you are at the HR419 Maintenance Session in Goshen IN.

Van Williams (VanWill) , myself (CrazyKnight) and Mike Hughes (MHughes) of Monaco Watts are all in attendance. Feel free to come on by and say hello at site 260, we are all parked together.



Van and I will be presenting 2 seminars. Chassis info including Watts Links and Steering Gears. Mike Hughes (Monaco Watts) has a vendor booth set up and will be doing some installations.



Cheers,



Craig

Wow, the three of you together, now that’s a party! Have a great time!

[islandboy54]

How would I go about getting notices for Roadmaster chassis maintenance sessions? I have not seen them before. Thanks.

[CrazyKnight]

Originally Posted by islandboy54

How would I go about getting notices for Roadmaster chassis maintenance sessions? I have not seen them before. Thanks.

I try to let owners know if Van and/or I are attending a rally or maintenance session on the iRV2 forum on both this thread and the TRW steering gear swap thread. We enjoying sharing what we know in person .

We both are in Goshen, IN now at a 250 coach Holiday Rambler 419 chapter maintenance session. GREAT group of people and LOTS to learn. Mike Hughes of Monaco Watts is also here.

I think Van will be attending Gillette, WY and I might be able to stop by, other commitments.

Cheers and safe travels,

Craig

[islandboy54]

Originally Posted by CrazyKnight

I try to let owners know if Van and/or I are attending a rally or maintenance session on the iRV2 forum on both this thread and the TRW steering gear swap thread. We enjoying sharing what we know in person .

We both are in Goshen, IN now at a 250 coach Holiday Rambler 419 chapter maintenance session. GREAT group of people and LOTS to learn. Mike Hughes of Monaco Watts is also here.

I think Van will be attending Gillette, WY and I might be able to stop by, other commitments.

Cheers and safe travels,

Craig

Thanks. Any Roadmaster maintenance events scheduled after October?

[windsorbill]

Originally Posted by islandboy54

Thanks. Any Roadmaster maintenance events scheduled after October?

Quartzite AZ is next January.

[CrazyKnight]

Thought I would pass along a nice email I just received from a 2012 HR 36 PFT owner. Always makes me smile when Van and my seminar travels pay off.

"Craig we purchased and installed both the front Watts Link and the rear cross bar kits. What a difference!!
We had the coach weighed and brought the tire pressure down from 120lbs to he recommend d 85lbs. and Wow what a difference!

Now it is manageable to drive. Thank You! Thank You! Thank You!

Now Craig we have determined that the previous owner already replaced the Sheppard gear for the TRW box but there is still too much play n the steering and I'm having a time finding some one to adjust the slack out of it.

I though about trying to adjust the gear box myself after watching Ching a YouTube video on it but then I've been reading on it in different blogs and some say the adjustment on the side is for the initial setting and you shouldn't mess with it again because it you'll limit your turning radius and I don't want that.

Can you shed any light on this last issue or know who might be able to help me.

We are headed to Gillette next week for the FMCA rally. Hoping maybe someone there could help with this and maybe the full wall adjustment.

Hope all is well with you and Thank You again!

George Portele"

GLAD to hear !!!
I sent him a return email about TRW adjustment :-).


Cheers,

Craig French

[Ivylog]

I had so much slop in my new ride’s steering it took 1/2 turn on the TRW adjustment to fix. I’d start with a 1/4th turn CW now. Limiting turning radius is BS.

I wonder if going from 120 to 85 psi was most of the impoverishment???

[CountryB]

Originally Posted by CrazyKnight

Now Craig we have determined that the previous owner already replaced the Sheppard gear for the TRW box but there is still too much play n the steering and I'm having a time finding some one to adjust the slack out of it.

I though about trying to adjust the gear box myself after watching Ching a YouTube video on it but then I've been reading on it in different blogs and some say the adjustment on the side is for the initial setting and you shouldn't mess with it again because it you'll limit your turning radius and I don't want that.

My understanding ...
That adjustment is for "sector gear to Piston-rack tooth engagement" (backlash). Too tight and the steering wheel may not return to center effortlessly (may require some driver input to get wheel centered. Such as, under correct adjustment, if one removes hands from wheel and the vehicle centers itself).
But that adjustment will not affect the amount the steering wheels turn.

[Red Rocker]

Originally Posted by Ivylog

I had so much slop in my new ride’s steering it took 1/2 turn on the TRW adjustment to fix. I’d start with a 1/4th turn CW now. Limiting turning radius is BS.

I wonder if going from 120 to 85 psi was most of the impoverishment???

Same here, but I haven't driven it since I did the adjustment. I got my Watts link installed & could definitely tell the difference, but only drove it for a few miles. It was after that that I adjusted the box, so looking forward to testing that out. It's a real PIA to get my coach in & out of my property with a mile of gravel road to hit pavement, so I don't just jump in & run down the street.

[geordi]

Finally fixed!

I have to thank Craig for his help and of course doing all the initial research on this process. I had nearly 4 inches of dead space in the wheel between action left and right, and this was on a Diplomat with 86k miles on it. Evacuating from the hurricanes last year (and the year before) wasn't much fun, especially every time a truck passed me.

No, I wasn't about to spend thousands on sway bars and links when it was fairly plain where the actual problem was. Unless I was making concerted input to go a certain direction, the wheels were pretty much going where they wanted b/c the steering box wasn't really doing a lot!

Anyway... I contacted Craig a number of months ago now, and he got me started. I finally picked up the TRW from the supplier (brand-spanking new, not even a rebuild!) and set to it... And promptly was stopped b/c I had ZERO ability to get the bolts off! Luckily the city where I store my Monaco has a Petro with a service shop, and although they were a bit hesitant to do a swap like this, once I informed them that I had *everything* needed already, their master mechanic had a look and grunted out "Sure, no problem. Gonna be a couple hours of labor."

I'm glad that I did have someone do it, because after he got the drag link off, he alerted me to a problem that I would have had ZERO recognition of - The drag link ball joint was SHOT. Of course - it was the rear one, on the wheel knuckle and the non-replaceable one. *bangs head on wall repeatedly* This ball joint is installed into the drag link bar and unlike the front which is threaded and clamped for security, this one is CRIMPED and this heavy-wall pipe has been squeezed in obviously a very large press. It will need to be cut off to replace, or you have to replace the entire pipe. I didn't want to do that for cost reasons.

Be smart if you do this - GET THE MECHANIC TO BREAK THE BALL JOINTS LOOSE. I didn't, figuring on taking the drag link bar out and to a truck specialist after it was parked back in storage... And spent the next 3 days bashing on the steering knuckle end with a sledge trying to get the stupid thing off. Just have the massive press they have pop it loose and put it back "only a bit tight" with some grease IF you need to move the coach before removing the drag link.

I took the bar to a truck steering specialist about 50 miles away, and they were completely unsuccessful in matching the Monaco part with anything else. Monaco was quite nice and offered to MAKE a replacement for me (or have their supplier, naturally) for the low low price of $1800! To note: A SuperSteer bar with two replaceable ball joints (with grease fittings!) was $1400.

Once the truck shop got the one joint removed that was actually serviceable, they provided me with two matching ball joints and I took all that to a machine shop and asked them to cut off the old ball joint at the end of the pipe (do not damage the pipe!) and drill / tap the crimped end to allow the threaded new joints to be installed.

They were a bit hesitant about that, only because of possibly removing material from the pipe - but that is exactly how the front end is, so no worry there (these were real old-school machinists who knew their stuff) and they were also possibly concerned about the lack of a clamp to secure the threads and keep the ball joint from moving / weakening the threads. I ended up using a heavy U-joint muffler clamp, but it hasn't really been tight enough to make me happy - but the bar also isn't going anywhere since the front IS clamped the way it was originally. I probably need to remove the drag link again and grind a short slot in the end of the pipe so that the U-bolt can actually act on something. This pipe is quite thick.

If you do this - take the opportunity to ask the machine shop to chase the threads of the factory-threaded end of the drag link - It will help a lot. I didn't, and caused myself another delay in fixing that. Once the threads were cleaned and lubed with anti-seize, the two ball joints threaded in completely and pretty.

Driving down the road now, the wheels may not return to center just by castering (self-centering) because the TRW is so new, but everything is tight and it feels like the RV is on rails. Trucks can pass and I feel nothing - exactly as it should be.

It ended up being a bit more expensive than I planned (no shock there) but being able to actually steer the RV where I want it to go rather than letting Sir Isaac Newton drive, that is worth the money.

TRW steering box: $700
Pitman Arm: $225
Core charge: $200 (returned)
Two ball joints: $150
Truck shop labor: $300
Machine shop labor: $275
Other tools: $250
Fuel for generator while dry camping fixing this: $150
Oil change for generator: $50

[Red Rocker]

Originally Posted by geordi

Finally fixed!

I have to thank Craig for his help and of course doing all the initial research on this process. I had nearly 4 inches of dead space in the wheel between action left and right, and this was on a Diplomat with 86k miles on it. Evacuating from the hurricanes last year (and the year before) wasn't much fun, especially every time a truck passed me.

No, I wasn't about to spend thousands on sway bars and links when it was fairly plain where the actual problem was. Unless I was making concerted input to go a certain direction, the wheels were pretty much going where they wanted b/c the steering box wasn't really doing a lot!

Anyway... I contacted Craig a number of months ago now, and he got me started. I finally picked up the TRW from the supplier (brand-spanking new, not even a rebuild!) and set to it... And promptly was stopped b/c I had ZERO ability to get the bolts off! Luckily the city where I store my Monaco has a Petro with a service shop, and although they were a bit hesitant to do a swap like this, once I informed them that I had *everything* needed already, their master mechanic had a look and grunted out "Sure, no problem. Gonna be a couple hours of labor."

I'm glad that I did have someone do it, because after he got the drag link off, he alerted me to a problem that I would have had ZERO recognition of - The drag link ball joint was SHOT. Of course - it was the rear one, on the wheel knuckle and the non-replaceable one. *bangs head on wall repeatedly* This ball joint is installed into the drag link bar and unlike the front which is threaded and clamped for security, this one is CRIMPED and this heavy-wall pipe has been squeezed in obviously a very large press. It will need to be cut off to replace, or you have to replace the entire pipe. I didn't want to do that for cost reasons.

Be smart if you do this - GET THE MECHANIC TO BREAK THE BALL JOINTS LOOSE. I didn't, figuring on taking the drag link bar out and to a truck specialist after it was parked back in storage... And spent the next 3 days bashing on the steering knuckle end with a sledge trying to get the stupid thing off. Just have the massive press they have pop it loose and put it back "only a bit tight" with some grease IF you need to move the coach before removing the drag link.

I took the bar to a truck steering specialist about 50 miles away, and they were completely unsuccessful in matching the Monaco part with anything else. Monaco was quite nice and offered to MAKE a replacement for me (or have their supplier, naturally) for the low low price of $1800! To note: A SuperSteer bar with two replaceable ball joints (with grease fittings!) was $1400.

Once the truck shop got the one joint removed that was actually serviceable, they provided me with two matching ball joints and I took all that to a machine shop and asked them to cut off the old ball joint at the end of the pipe (do not damage the pipe!) and drill / tap the crimped end to allow the threaded new joints to be installed.

They were a bit hesitant about that, only because of possibly removing material from the pipe - but that is exactly how the front end is, so no worry there (these were real old-school machinists who knew their stuff) and they were also possibly concerned about the lack of a clamp to secure the threads and keep the ball joint from moving / weakening the threads. I ended up using a heavy U-joint muffler clamp, but it hasn't really been tight enough to make me happy - but the bar also isn't going anywhere since the front IS clamped the way it was originally. I probably need to remove the drag link again and grind a short slot in the end of the pipe so that the U-bolt can actually act on something. This pipe is quite thick.

If you do this - take the opportunity to ask the machine shop to chase the threads of the factory-threaded end of the drag link - It will help a lot. I didn't, and caused myself another delay in fixing that. Once the threads were cleaned and lubed with anti-seize, the two ball joints threaded in completely and pretty.

Driving down the road now, the wheels may not return to center just by castering (self-centering) because the TRW is so new, but everything is tight and it feels like the RV is on rails. Trucks can pass and I feel nothing - exactly as it should be.

It ended up being a bit more expensive than I planned (no shock there) but being able to actually steer the RV where I want it to go rather than letting Sir Isaac Newton drive, that is worth the money.

TRW steering box: $700
Pitman Arm: $225
Core charge: $200 (returned)
Two ball joints: $150
Truck shop labor: $300
Machine shop labor: $275
Other tools: $250
Fuel for generator while dry camping fixing this: $150
Oil change for generator: $50

What size were the ball joints, pitch & diameter?