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Old 07-21-2016, 10:39 AM   #1
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Water manifold froze up !

So..in getting the coach we have had for only a year, it was time to check the water supply system.

1. Cleaned water heater and installed new anode and heating element.

Thought i had better check the 2 water filters that are on the coach before turning the water on. Well, i took off the canisters and found one with the bottom cracked off....water left in it must have frozen it. So i order 2 new canisters and filters from rvwaterfilterstore and installed them.

2. Turned water on to check for leaks. Not good but not not a flood ! Found the cold water line at the vanity faucet leaking at the fitting. Then i noticed a bigger leak at the bottom of the main manifold. So i sized up the problem and elected to disconnect the manifold and remove it. Not a bad job as this is a well layed out piping system. Found the bottom of the manifold cracked from freezing water over the winter. I then realized i missed the second drain valve to have open. So now will have to order a new manifold !

3. With all this happening i also looked at the pressure accumulator. Disconnected it and removed it to clean the floor underneath it. As i started to drain the water out it started out a light brown color and then went to a deep brown color. The more i shook the tank to get it to drain out the darker the brown color got. Also there was no air charge on the tank ! I figure the internal bladder has developed a leak. So i will be ordering a new pressure tank !! The one good thing is the water pump is new !!

4. Now i need to put a new fitting on the broken vanity line. Do i just remove the swedge collar ( black ) and remove the fitting then install the new fitting ? How do i put a new swedge fitting on ?Click image for larger version

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Old 07-21-2016, 10:57 AM   #2
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This is the only photo i could get to upload. I keep getting a 'invalid file' message when i try to upload 2 other pics.

Anyhow....i got the new manifold ordered ( $155 ).

"Viega acquired Vanguard in 2005.

Vanguard had a program in place selling custom Manablocs to RV manufacturers, to where when Viega took over we do not supply new RVs with our Manablocs anymore. However, we still support any existing RVís out there with the Manabloc installed. We do not sell this item to general public, only RV owners that call in, therefore the part number referenced will not be publicize in our catalog or our website."

p: (800) 976-9819 Ext. 541 | Viega - The global leader in plumbing, heating and pipe joining systems

Very nice people to business with !!

Chuck
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Old 07-21-2016, 12:23 PM   #3
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You will need a sledge tool. Cut the old black band off carefully then you can reuse the tubing without having to cut and shortening it.
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Old 07-21-2016, 01:01 PM   #4
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I am a bit confused as to why you need to replace the fitting you have in the picture. Is the pipe leading up to that fitting broken? Or are you replacing the fitting just to replace the crushed cone washer sitting on it? It is much simpler just to replace the bad cone washer. (Or am I way off the mark here? I am having trouble getting a clear idea of the fitting in your picture.)

In the picture this looks like a standard PEX pipe fitting. But, I don't think Monaco used PEX in their coaches until much later. And I cannot tell if that band is copper or some sort of plastic. If you could give more information on this it would really help in coming up with a better way to move forward.
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Old 07-21-2016, 10:23 PM   #5
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There is a plastic connector that goes on top of the metal washer but it broke off. The connector ( female threaded ) is what connects the fitting to the cold water faucet line. It definitely is PEX tubing.

So you are suggesting that maybe all i need is a new threaded connector cap that attaches to the faucet water line ? Didn't think about that being a possibility ! Sure would save me from having to cut the swedge fitting off.

Thanks

Chuck
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Old 07-21-2016, 11:00 PM   #6
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Chuck,
Replacing that fitting would be my last thought. In most cases the brass parts don't get damaged. And PEX pipe can be fairly resistant to freeze damage. So, if that line is OK I would try to figure out a replacement for whatever attaches to the part in the photo.

What I cannot figure out, however, is how the vanity fitting attaches to the part you have in your photo. If it had an integrated plastic part attached to it, you may have to replace it. But, I am lost just seeing your photo. It looks like there is a part number on the side of the fitting, but I cannot make out what it is in the picture you posted. It would also be helpful to see a picture of the other fitting to your vanity to get an idea of what a complete unit looks like.

My only other thought is that you have a female threaded nut that is held on by that retaining clip. You would have to get that clip off the brass fitting, replace the female nut, rebend the retention clips, force it over the vertical pipe, and get the pins bent back to make sure it cannot come off the vertical stem. It would actually be better to get a replacement clip along with the replacement washer. But, this opens a complete can of worms as to where you could source the parts.

On edit: Does this look like the part that broke?

If you have to replace the fitting, however, it is really not that big a chore. I used a Dremel like drill with a metal cutting blade to cut the copper ring on my pipe. And then I trimmed off the part of the pipe that had the ring grove in it. (You could also just cut the PEX about an 1/8th of an inch behind the ring.)

Now, you have two ways to attach a new fitting. The easiest is to get a Shark Bite fitting that meets your needs and just shove it on the PEX pipe. These fittings have "teeth" that grip on the PEX and make a firm seal. The alternative is to get the fitting you need, plus a crimper and some 1/2 inch copper rings from Home Depot and properly crimp a new fitting on. (Home Depot used to have a crimper that required Vise Grip pliers to make it work. But, that seems to have disappeared.)

I have done both methods. Both are holding well, but I do wonder how the Shark Bite fittings will work over time with all the shaking that takes place in an RV.
Bob
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Old 07-22-2016, 07:12 AM   #7
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I agree with Bob on using a Drimmel tool with cutoff wheel to remove the ring, just don't cut the pipe.... I bought the compression tool at Lowes and the new rings there also. When I used to have winterize my coach I cut a valve inline to the pressure tank so I did not have to fill that with antifreeze also ( about 1.5 gallons). Mine was installed pointing down so all water drained out. Now I just go south when it starts to get cold.....

Good Luck
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Old 07-22-2016, 08:43 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djhinds View Post
I agree with Bob on using a Drimmel tool with cutoff wheel to remove the ring, just don't cut the pipe.... I bought the compression tool at Lowes and the new rings there also. When I used to have winterize my coach I cut a valve inline to the pressure tank so I did not have to fill that with antifreeze also ( about 1.5 gallons). Mine was installed pointing down so all water drained out. Now I just go south when it starts to get cold.....

Good Luck
Dave
Thanks Dave ! My pressure tank mounts horizontally on the floor, which means that some water will still be in the tank come winter....not a good setup. So i may just make a new bracket to let me install the tank vertical, as there is already a drain valve nearby to drain the tank. I will go to Lowes and look for the fittings.

Chuck
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Old 07-22-2016, 08:53 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob&AnnaMari View Post
Chuck,
Replacing that fitting would be my last thought. In most cases the brass parts don't get damaged. And PEX pipe can be fairly resistant to freeze damage. So, if that line is OK I would try to figure out a replacement for whatever attaches to the part in the photo.

What I cannot figure out, however, is how the vanity fitting attaches to the part you have in your photo. If it had an integrated plastic part attached to it, you may have to replace it. But, I am lost just seeing your photo. It looks like there is a part number on the side of the fitting, but I cannot make out what it is in the picture you posted. It would also be helpful to see a picture of the other fitting to your vanity to get an idea of what a complete unit looks like.

My only other thought is that you have a female threaded nut that is held on by that retaining clip. You would have to get that clip off the brass fitting, replace the female nut, rebend the retention clips, force it over the vertical pipe, and get the pins bent back to make sure it cannot come off the vertical stem. It would actually be better to get a replacement clip along with the replacement washer. But, this opens a complete can of worms as to where you could source the parts.

On edit: Does this look like the part that broke?

If you have to replace the fitting, however, it is really not that big a chore. I used a Dremel like drill with a metal cutting blade to cut the copper ring on my pipe. And then I trimmed off the part of the pipe that had the ring grove in it. (You could also just cut the PEX about an 1/8th of an inch behind the ring.)

Now, you have two ways to attach a new fitting. The easiest is to get a Shark Bite fitting that meets your needs and just shove it on the PEX pipe. These fittings have "teeth" that grip on the PEX and make a firm seal. The alternative is to get the fitting you need, plus a crimper and some 1/2 inch copper rings from Home Depot and properly crimp a new fitting on. (Home Depot used to have a crimper that required Vise Grip pliers to make it work. But, that seems to have disappeared.)

I have done both methods. Both are holding well, but I do wonder how the Shark Bite fittings will work over time with all the shaking that takes place in an RV.
Bob
Thanks Bob ! Yes, that fitting you posted is what i would need. The white female plastic coupling on the fitting you posted is what is broke off. This is what attaches to the water line on the faucet. Think i will opt for putting a new fitting on !! I will search online for this fitting that is broken for a possible replacement part, if no luck then change the fitting out.

Chuck
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Old 07-22-2016, 10:32 AM   #10
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Chuck,

In case you missed it, that site was Home Depot. You should be able to get the connection locally from either Home Depot or Lowe's. I doubt you will beat that price, especially after shipping. Your most expensive component will be the tool to do the crimp. I would also suggest watching the videos on the website I referenced as to how to make the connection. It covers the method very well.

Happy trails,
Bob
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Old 07-22-2016, 10:38 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob&AnnaMari View Post
Chuck,

In case you missed it, that site was Home Depot. You should be able to get the connection locally from either Home Depot or Lowe's. I would also suggest watching the videos on the website I referenced as to how to make the connection. It covers the method very well.

Happy trails,
Bob
Thanks Bob, will get it fixed when i get back to Tenn. Plus installing the new manifold and pressure tank. Videos are always nice !!

Chuck
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