RV News RVBusiness 2021 Top 10 RVs of the Year, plus 56 additional debuts and must-see units → ×
RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > THE OWNER'S CORNER FORUMS > Thor Industries Owner's Forum > Damon
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-29-2014, 09:57 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
Damon Owners Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NAS Pensacola, FL
Posts: 329
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redapple View Post
I have charging power on both sides of the disconnect relay. I only have chassis power on the output side if the isolator relay
Sorry this doesn't make sense. I assume your describing the main relay connections. Charging power on both sides of the disconnect relay is good when the relay is latched connecting the coach batteries to the converter. But you should have power on both sides of the isolation relay too: one side chassis battery power - the other side coach/converter charging power through the bus bar. Since the aux start works, I think you have some bad readings.

If we are talking about the control wiring to the isolator relay, both side should have the same power to ground. The BIRD and the Aux start switch insert a ground to complete the circuit to energize the relay.

If we are talking about the disconnect relay, once latched there should be no power to the control wiring. To latch closed the relay, the switch applies + to one lead and grounds the other. To open (unlatch) the relay the switch reverses the application grounding the first wire and applying + to the other. JM2˘...
__________________
Ted Fulltiming in the DreamCatcher a
2008 Challenger 371PE on F53 w/ 2010 Cobalt
R'V there yet?
teddyu is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 06-29-2014, 10:49 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
Redapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,104
Quote:
Originally Posted by teddyu View Post
Sorry this doesn't make sense. I assume your describing the main relay connections. Charging power on both sides of the disconnect relay is good when the relay is latched connecting the coach batteries to the converter. But you should have power on both sides of the isolation relay too: one side chassis battery power - the other side coach/converter charging power through the bus bar. Since the aux start works, I think you have some bad readings.

If we are talking about the control wiring to the isolator relay, both side should have the same power to ground. The BIRD and the Aux start switch insert a ground to complete the circuit to energize the relay.

If we are talking about the disconnect relay, once latched there should be no power to the control wiring. To latch closed the relay, the switch applies + to one lead and grounds the other. To open (unlatch) the relay the switch reverses the application grounding the first wire and applying + to the other. JM2˘...
Hi teddyu,

You are correct. Disconnect relay is working properly. Isolator relay is not latching. When I hit the aux start, it latches. It will not latch to charge chassis batt. There are two small terminals that activate the relay. One is 12v the other is ground. I only have 12v when aux start is pressed. Brand new relay, new board. Not too many choices left, 1. Bad board, 2. Bad relay, 3. Bad ground, 4, low or bad battery. So I was going to change the board back to the original, but have since decided to charge the chassis batt to full. House Batts reading 13.3. Getting 14.6 from converter in charge mode.
__________________
2020 Grand Design Reflection 315RLTS
2019 GMC Sierra Denali Duramax
Redapple is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 09:12 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
dwhit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Wandering
Posts: 625
"House Batts reading 13.3. Getting 14.6 from converter in charge mode."

14.6 vdc is a serious charge rate...so then reading from the coach batts should be 14.6 also? If the chassis batt is 12.6, coach batt is 13.3 where is the 14.6 going? Voltage at the coach batts has to drop to 13.2 before pwb is supposed to bring in relay to charge chassis batt. You are allowing the converter to run long time to bring and maintain coach batts to full charge right? MAYBE the BCC is acting correctly.

My batts are always connected to shore at home...all batts say 13.6...I've never seen 13.2 as converter says it will drop to...I assume batts are aging and not able to maintain at 13.2...and I also have two pulsing desulphators attached to the separate banks. My BCC relays don't hum but are always warm.

If I discharge my COACH bank, converter will charge them first, BCC will not latch the chassis batt for charging until coach bank reaches full charge. I've two 12vdc coach batts and one 12vdc chassis/engine battery...all are older and with MH when purchased in Feb 2013. All batteries were flat dead when we tried to test drive MH. Added desulphators have brought them as far back as they're going to...no problems.

EDIT-REDAPPLE, I've re-read his entire thread more than once. What is the original problem? Engine slow to start from discharged chassis battery? Maybe the new coach batts are absorbing available current from converter preventing BCC from bridging the chassis battery? This was a problem you had BEFORE you replaced coach batts?

It is possible to manually ground the other terminal of the relay coil to actuate the isolator relay which would bridge the converter charge current to the chassis/engine battery using an alligator clip...I've done this myself on my previous MH that had no provision to charge the chassis battery. Worked fine but I didn't always leave it attached.

I apologize for being such a nudge...this issue interests me.
__________________
2014 XLR415AMP Thunderbird ToyHauler, 2019 Sandpiper 379FLOK, F350 Lariat Diesel DRW, NRA Benefactors FullTime RV'er KN4YBP APRS
dwhit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 10:40 AM   #18
Senior Member
 
Redapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,104
Hi dwhit,

I measured the Batts at the Batts to see the batt voltage. I have a progressive PD9160 that has 3 charging modes. I manually put it to a hard charge to ensure the converter is operating correctly. The house Batts are less than a year old and in good shape. The chassis batt is about 3 years old now and may be be bad due to many full discharge cycles. I took it out and slapped a 6 amp charger on it to verify it will hold a full charge. A low chassis batt will also keep the isolator relay from latching. I will put the b a to back in tonight to see. I will also take your suggestion regarding ground verification at the relay.

Thanks,
Bill
__________________
2020 Grand Design Reflection 315RLTS
2019 GMC Sierra Denali Duramax
Redapple is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 10:57 AM   #19
Senior Member
 
dwhit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Wandering
Posts: 625
"I measured the Batts at the Batts to see the batt voltage."

What? I have a headache....
__________________
2014 XLR415AMP Thunderbird ToyHauler, 2019 Sandpiper 379FLOK, F350 Lariat Diesel DRW, NRA Benefactors FullTime RV'er KN4YBP APRS
dwhit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 12:09 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
wa8yxm's Avatar
 
Damon Owners Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 24,023
The Emergency start solenoid is not a latching model

The house disconnect IS
I'm not sure if you have a chassis and if it is latching or not
The isolator I also am not sure of May be the same as the E-Start,

I looked for the manual but it appears it does not exist on any of my current computers.. Can not check older drives at this time.
__________________
Home is where I park it!
wa8yxm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 01:00 PM   #21
Senior Member
 
dwhit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Wandering
Posts: 625
My batts are always connected to shore at home...all batts say 13.6...I've never seen 13.2 as converter says it will drop to...I assume batts are aging and not able to maintain at 13.2...and I also have two pulsing desulphators attached to the separate banks.

I learned something today...went out to install a muffin fan and a 90 degree snap disc to ventilate the converter area as my WFCO55
has a load-actuated internal fan. Case and area temps can be toasty at low charge/supply voltages. When I accessed the under-bed chamber my continuous voltmeter read 13.25...this is the first time I've seen lower than 13.6...proof to me that desulphation can bring back batteries over time...in this case several months.

Yes, I'm fan crazed...refer has six fans...works extremely well. I'll put a fan on anything....fan fetish.


wa8yxm...he says he has a 635-100 single disconnect BCC. I've included two manuals for this controller. I'm still wondering exactly what voltage is at the coach battery bank when the converter is saying it's making 14.6...if the coach set never falls to 13.2 would the isolator relay EVER energize?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG2702.jpg
Views:	59
Size:	46.3 KB
ID:	66506   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMAG2703.jpg
Views:	60
Size:	52.9 KB
ID:	66507  

__________________
2014 XLR415AMP Thunderbird ToyHauler, 2019 Sandpiper 379FLOK, F350 Lariat Diesel DRW, NRA Benefactors FullTime RV'er KN4YBP APRS
dwhit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2014, 02:20 PM   #22
Senior Member
 
Redapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,104
Okay folks...been away for a hit but here goes...

Regular converter voltage is 12.72. Charging converter voltage is 14. Battery was in state of discharge...12.3.

Took out the battery and bench charged it. It Would Not Hold A charge. Replaced with warranty, perform bench charge...install w battery at 12.8. Charge from converter did not kick in. This is the threshold voltage for isolation. Ran engine to charge the battery. once it gets above 12.8, isolator should parallel them when in a charging cycle. Stay tuned. This is exactly what happened 3 years ago to me. Weak battery breaks the entire function. I feel 12.8 is too high. It should be 12.6, even that borders on too high.

Thanks for all your help.
__________________
2020 Grand Design Reflection 315RLTS
2019 GMC Sierra Denali Duramax
Redapple is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2014, 07:51 AM   #23
Senior Member
 
dwhit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Wandering
Posts: 625
Regular converter voltage is 12.72. (that would be static battery voltage) Charging converter voltage is 14. Battery was in state of discharge...12.3.

I'm listening...you are correct a battery problem brings the whole tent down.
__________________
2014 XLR415AMP Thunderbird ToyHauler, 2019 Sandpiper 379FLOK, F350 Lariat Diesel DRW, NRA Benefactors FullTime RV'er KN4YBP APRS
dwhit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2014, 09:56 PM   #24
Senior Member
 
Redapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,104
SUCCESS!

Thanks to both of you and your patience. I didn't do a very good job explaining myself, however, the problem is solved.

After I verified the board and both relays it could only be one of three things...Bad aux switch...nope...Bad battery...Replaced with new... Bad ground...yep...

I traced every wire and found a bad ground in the bowels of the wiring behind the bcc in the engine compartment.

Thanks to both of you!!!
__________________
2020 Grand Design Reflection 315RLTS
2019 GMC Sierra Denali Duramax
Redapple is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2014, 08:10 AM   #25
Senior Member
 
dwhit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Wandering
Posts: 625
Ahhhh....PERSEVERANCE is rewarded!
__________________
2014 XLR415AMP Thunderbird ToyHauler, 2019 Sandpiper 379FLOK, F350 Lariat Diesel DRW, NRA Benefactors FullTime RV'er KN4YBP APRS
dwhit is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
battery



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Help Diagnosing Battery Isolator Relay RustyTravelr Class A Motorhome Discussions 13 09-06-2014 08:59 PM
Adding a second battery wincrasher Class B Motorhome Discussions 14 06-05-2014 11:47 PM
2012 Thor Ace 29.1 Chassis Battery ThorEvo1029 Thor Industries Owner's Forum 5 05-22-2014 09:51 PM
Comfort Control Center daisylou RV Systems & Appliances 2 02-13-2014 09:15 AM
Battery Advice sjkted Class A Motorhome Discussions 33 02-06-2014 09:12 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.