Venetian: 2017 Venetian Experience

[tailwind22]

Let us know the outcome.

[z3406]

Dealer called me about 4 hours after I dropped it off. They found the main 300 amp fuse blown. I have no idea where that is located but I will after I pick it up next Friday, I'll also have the part number for spare and will pass the info along.

[z3406]

The fuse is a Class T or Type T 300 amp fuse. It's located in the rear passenger side compartment next to the inverter. It's uinder a Magnum Power white colored cover. The fuse that blew had no external sign that it had done it's job. It took an ohm meter to show that it had lost continuity. If you lose your external power or the generator power it's possibly the transfer switch. If you lose all the A/C , external, generator and inverter check the T fuse.
Another thing on my coach when you lose pedestal power the inverter will try to run everything, microwave, entertainment, space heaters etc. That may be more load that it can produce and can possibly cause the inverter to fail. but that the way my coach is designed. Anyone at Thor reading this you folks have a LOT to learn about how to make a motor home. It's been my experience that about 10% of the time the RV park power pole have problems, losing park power is not an uncommon event. Having an inverter that will try to fry itself every time there is an external power problem is really really slipshod engineering.

[paddler1954]

Sorry for you troubles Al & Brenda. So you are saying if you lose pedestal power your inverter will try to provide power to the whole coach? In our old Expedition, Fleetwood had the inverter tied into the system in such a way it only powered certain outlets and devices. Maybe you need to disable the inverter once you connect up to a campground pedestal, until you figure out exactly what gets powered by the inverter.

[z3406]

paddler
That is exactly what I am saying. My prior coach was a Bounder and it was set up the same way your Expedition was. I was told in a phone call last week by Thor customer service that the inverter will try and run the entire coach if the coach loses pedestal power. I tried what you suggested about turning the inverter off, The firefly system automatically turned it on when the coach lost pedestal power. Starting the generator is also bizarre. After it starts the load shifts to the generator but in the interval between starting and picking up the load the inverter tries to run everything. To the point of smelling hot wires.

[z3406]

While I'm in a griping mood. If you have the Firefly system in your coach this is something to pay attention to in the climate control section. If your changing the function of the HVAC system set the actual and set temp to the same number before trying to change the function. If the actual and set temp is more that 1 degree apart and you pass thru the Auto setting the rooftop units will kick in and try to correct the difference with whatever functions does that. For instance you expect a cold evening and want to turn the furnace on. The actual temp is 70 and the set temp is 68. As you scroll thru Auto the air conditioner will kick in as you move the function to furnace. The rooftop units will shut down after the compressor timeout expire but it sure is strange standing there with the A/C blowing and the HVAC set to Furnace.

[MisterT]

Originally Posted by z3406

... After it starts, the load shifts to the generator, but in the interval between starting and picking up the load the inverter tries to run everything. To the point of smelling hot wires.

hmmm.... what would the 'inverter trying to run everything' have to do with 'smelling hot wires'? The inverter simply uses the batteries to provide 120v power to those items within the coach that needs it, such as the fridge, and anything that's using a 120v outlet. No different than when you are plugged into Shore Power, other than the few things that are NOT run thru the inverter, such as the Water Heater and Air Conditioners, of course.
WHY would you want an Inverter that only runs 'some' of the 120v items or outlets? A correctly sized inverter can easily handle the outlets and items in your coach it is installed for, which should be ALL 120v outlets, not just a few. Yours is designed to do just that.

we LOVE the fact that our Palazzo's Magnum MS2012 Inverter runs EVERYTHING whenever we unplug from Shore Power, whether we are getting ready to start the generator, or while traveling down the road and allowing the engine's Alternator to provide additional amps to the House batteries. The AGS(automatic Generator Starter) kicks on the generator when needed, and YES, it takes a few moments for the ATS(automatic Transfer Switch) to move the power from the Inverter to the Generator.
The fact that the Inverter provides power to the coach during the switching between Shore Power and the Generator keeps the 120v items in the coach from going dead(losing power) and resetting, such as the clock on the Microwave, satellite Receivers, or desktop Computers, etc. I would NOT want to have to deal with those EVERYTIME I unplugged from Shore Power.

the only option to provide a 'inverter free' time period between power sources is to crank the Generator before you unplug from Shore Power. The generator takes precedence and the ATS will switch to it in about 15 or so seconds.

but, WHY the displeasure with using the Inverter or allowing it to do it's job? Our inverter has never been 'off' in over 3 1/2 years of travel, parking, or sitting, even while on Shore Power. The Inverter is our 'back up' power supply if the RV Park shore power is lost. The AGS is then the 'back up' to the 'back up' providing battery recharging while on the inverter.

: )

[revflyer]

You are 100% right on what happens if you lose power at the pedestal, we found out the 3rd week we had our new T42 that the inverter tried to power too many things. When we lost power we had the fireplace, tv, micro, lights and frig on. The lights flickered and lost power to everything, started the generator and still did not have any power. Using a flashlight to read the manual found where the breaker is on the inverter. Reset the inverter breaker and had power back on. The next day I did a test and found that everything but the A/C units ran thru the inverter. Called Thor and they told me that for sure the fireplace and hot water heater should not be going thru the inverter. They did send a Thor tech out to where we where at and he reworked some of the wiring and took care of all the other things wrong that we had found on our shake down trip. It took him 3 days, but he was very good and stuck with it. Thor has treated us really good this last year.

[z3406]

MrT
Please look at REV's reply above. The inverter in my coach is not correctly sized for everything that may run thru it. This is not my first coach with an inverter but it is the first coach that has given the acrid electrical odor when turning the generator on.(I suspect it was the inverter overheating due to excess load)
The manual for the Magnum Energy CMS2000 inverter installed in my coach states that the max amperage output is 17 AMP's If you think you can run all your A/C items off of 17 amps then your coach is configured a lot differently than mine is.
My opinion about invertor preferences is quite a bit different than your. If I'm away from the coach and the exterior power fails the only thing I want the inverter to run is the residential refrigerator. I'll gladly sacrifice the clock time on the microwave having to be reset as opposed to replacing all the food in the fridge.

[paddler1954]

Al, you've got me to thinking. Our inverter powers the receptacles located in the cockpit area of our coach. Does it also power all the other receptacles? How about the fireplace? I know its running the fridge and microwave. Once we get past this cool spell, I think its time to see what all the inverter can run.

I always make it a habit of killing the inverter when we hook up at a campground. But I have never checked to see if it stays dead if the pedestal power gets turned off. (I'm not worried about food spoilage, a residential fridge will keep things cold for hours if the doors are not opened) So I guess I need to verify it will stay off. I'll let you know what I find. Your problem might not be Thor's alone.

[z3406]

Paddler
Fleetwood was very cooperative about providing technical information on their coach when I had one of their products. May I suggest you go to the Fleetwood web site and somewhere in the customer service section there is a form you can fill and they will send you any schematics you want. Both of my Bounders had the front electrical outlets working off the inverter as part of the entertainment system I can't recall any other easily available outlets that were inverter powered.Thor has been cooperative about sharing any information I've asked for. Getting the info from Thor so far has required a phone call to their customer service number.
It's not uncommon for us to take day trips while on the road so I like the assurance of knowing I have a couple of days worth of power stored in the battery bank. In the past I've always had the inverter on 24/7, With this coach it looks like I won't be able to leave the dryer running when I go to a movie for fear of coming home to a coach with a dead battery or worse.

[MisterT]

"With this coach it looks like I won't be able to leave the dryer running when I go to a movie for fear of coming home to a coach with a dead battery or worse."

no, this would not happen. The dryer works on 240v and can only be powered by Shore Power(or maybe generator), but would NOT be powered by the Inverter, so no worries there if your were to lose Shore Power - the dryer would just lose power and shut down.

also, some advice to make you feel better about potential battery issues:
A) your Magnum Inverter/Charger is well designed to allow you to program it to fit your needs - YOU can decide what limits you want to employ for various situations or scenarios
B) the Magnum SETTINGS provide for, among many others, the LBCO(Low Battery CutOff) limits. The LBCO allows you to decide at what point your Inverter STOPS drawing power from the batteries. You set the VOLTS for this, such as 11.5 or even lower. It's a 'worst case' scenario setting to preserve your batteries in the event your generator is not available, or you don't want it to start during 'quiet time' hours.
C) you also have the 'AGS'(AutomaticGeneratorStarter) to provide for cranking your Generator in the case you lose Shore Power, or are off-gridding and need the generator to recharge the batteries when needed. You can set it at 12.0 or even a little lower, and it will give you the 'back up' power that will sooth your concerns.

Your coach is designed for many different POWER scenarios, and can easily be set to handle just about EVERY situation. Let the Inverter be your 'back up' power if you were to lose Shore Power. Let the Generator, thru the AGS, be your 'back up to your back up' and recharge the batteries if they fall too low while on the Inverter. Let the LBCO be the 'guarantee' that your Inverter will not deplete your House Batteries!

It all works together, just give some thought to how these all interact in various situations and you'll be just fine.


p.s. : Magnum 'Shore Max' setting... this provides for you to limit the amount of Amps that the CHARGER will use. The Charger sometimes is the culprit for a tripped Shore Power breaker when it is really trying hard to recharge the batteries. Setting this 'Shore Max' down to a low number, such as 5a or 10a when parked for the night, will preserve many more amps to go to the other necessary 120v draws, such as the AirConditioners, Fridge, Water Heater, and Microwave usage during hot weather and at suppertime!
But, if you really need the Charger to max out it's amps and quickly charge the batteries, you can move this setting up to 50a or even 60amps, being aware that it could limit all the other 120v draws you might use during that time, otherwise a breaker could easily trip.
The 'Shore Max' setting is even more important when you are plugged into only 30amp service, which is 70amps less than 50amp service(really 100amps!).

[MisterT]

Originally Posted by paddler1954

...
I always make it a habit of killing the inverter when we hook up at a campground. But I have never checked to see if it stays dead if the pedestal power gets turned off. ...

no, it will not, because you turned it OFF, of course.... BUT, there is another setting that you can use to allow it to Automatically power up for various scenarios:
it's called the 'SEARCH WATTS' feature setting...

per Magnum:
What is the “Search Watts” feature? This feature is used to help save
battery power by reducing the inverter’s output to search pulses when there
is no detectable load. If someone turns on a load greater than the wattage
level setting while the inverter is “searching”, the inverter will start “inverting” to provide full voltage on its output.
Should I use the “Search Watts” feature? If the inverter can spend a
great deal of time “searching” (to reduce the power drain on your batteries)
and you can tolerate small loads (less than 5 watts) from being on, then the
search mode feature should be used. However, if you require some small
load (i.e. digital clocks, satellite receivers, answering machines, etc.) to
always be on, then this feature should be turned off (Search = Off).
I want to use the Search Watts feature, how do I determine where to
set it? The search watts setting should be adjusted to the same power level (or the next lower setting) of the smallest load that you want to run. If you don’t know the wattage of the smallest load you want to run, turn the load on and decrease the Search Watts setting until the load comes on and stays on.
...Example: You have reviewed all the loads you want to run and determined that the smallest load is a 30 watt light, then set the Search = 30W. Whenever you turn on any load (because all the loads are greater than 30 watts), the inverter will stop “searching” and start “inverting” to deliver power to the load.
Note: Even though the search feature is on, some connected equipment
may draw enough current even while in the “off” position to
keep the inverter in the “inverting mode”.

[z3406]

Mr T
Just so you know the dryer in this coach is a whirlpool 120 volt not 220 volt and the inverter will try and power it. It appears that you aren't familare with the Firefly system that controls the inverter in this coach, most of the inverter control functions are not available. This coach does not have the separate inverter control panel. This Firefly Venetian is quite a bit different from a Palazzo and most of your responses to this thread are showing how different they are.
You seem to assume that I don't have any prior experience with an inverter equipped coach and that is not the case. The inverter equipped coaches I have had were just better integrated than this coach is. There is no way the inverter can power the entire coach with 17 amps but that is how it is presently wired. As far as I know now the only things the inverter is not wired to power are the three heat pumps on the roof. Please look at post #36 by Rev for confirmation.