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Old 12-07-2022, 09:37 AM   #1
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ISC330 (2001) Crank but No Run Issue

Hello all,

So I am on the verge of throwing up...We have a 2001 Holiday Rambler Endeavor with the Cummins ISC330 diesel engine.

In 2018 I had the Lift Pump replaced since it failed. Then in 2020 the CAPS pump failed and we had that replaced ($10,000 since it required multiple towing, and some other issues related to getting the proper parts), now this past July (2022), after starting the coach for a planned 1-day trip, the engine shut off abruptly after about 90 seconds of running. I could not get it to restart.

Our local diesel specialist (JG Parks) came out to the coach to investigate the issue ($750). They determined the CAPS pump that was installed in May of 2020 by Cummins of Richmond, VA (but supplied by TamerX Diesel) had failed as well and is out of warranty.

I had to buy another CAPS pump from TamerX who gave me a bit of a discount ($2,500), and I had my local JG Parks Diesel Specialist install it ($950). Still No Run! Tech said the fuel pressure is in speck and engine codes have cleared, but the engine will still not run. They are now thinking it could be that when the CAPS failed the 2nd time, that is clogged the injectors. JG Parks is now suggesting I have them pull and clean the injectors ($1,300).

The question I have is when a CAPS Pump is replaced, is any type of ECM reprogramming required? Wondering if this could be the issue?

I also spoke with at Tech at a Cummins shop (Baltimore) who felt the next step as suggested of having the injectors pulled and cleaned seemed appropriate; so the bleeding goes on!

It is our intension to sell the coach and downsize to a bit smaller and newer coach, so I just want to get it running so I can put it up for sale.

Any thoughts I should consider?

Thanks.
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Old 12-07-2022, 10:14 AM   #2
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I can't see all injectors being clogged at once. At least one should pass fuel and give some indication of running.

There is an emergency shutoff in the engine compartment (or should be). By any chance has that been activated?
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Old 12-07-2022, 11:10 AM   #3
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So when Parks came out to diagnose the problem initially what kind of fault codes did they get to indicate the CAPS pump was bad??? Did they explain the problem or just say they needed to change the CAPS pump.



If you are not getting any codes now with a NO start situation the ECM may be suspect. Not sure if there is a way to test the ECM while it is in the coach. I would think Parks would know how.

At minimum I would have Parks copy the ECU to their computer (a good shop would do that anyway) and that way if something happens you have the copy to set up a replacement.

Cummins and other companies do offer remanufacture/repair options but the ECM has to be readable to do that. Cost will be ~$1500 or more.



When I first bought my coach I took it to Cummins for a complete inspection and service. I did not have any maintenance history so I wanted a benchmark. I knew the manager and he took care of me. He had my ECM copied to a CD and I have in my coach. He also gave me a printed readout of the settings.
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Old 12-07-2022, 12:19 PM   #4
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Before I would pay for injector cleaning I would double check the timing on the injection pump. Also maybe unplug the intake air heater and try some starting fluid if it fires but don't do it without disabling the Intake air heater
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Old 12-08-2022, 08:30 AM   #5
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All good suggestions...

1) Where is the air intake heater?

2) I will ask about copying the ECM to the PC and if that could be part of the issue.

3) I agree that it would be crazy that all 6 injectors were clogged at the same time. This seems suspect...

4) How difficult is it to replace the injectors, as I can buy six remanufactured Bosch injectors for $950 (shipped), and was thinking in could possibly install?
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Old 12-08-2022, 09:17 AM   #6
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I cannot answer the code fault question, as I did not get any details on which codes were active. I will say, I was present when he connected the PC and there were active codes that I saw on his PC. I just do not know what they were.

After the CAPS pump install the tech said the codes and no longer active and fuel pressure is now in spec., but it will not run. It makes me sick to think that I could have $5,750 into this diagnosis and repair and that in the end it still may not run! Since its in my barn, and difficult to get a tow truck to it to get it towed to Cummins in Baltimore, I am kind of at the mercy of the JG Parks tech....

Just skeptical, but don't want to question the tech's abilities....
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Old 12-08-2022, 10:34 AM   #7
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I worked for several different mining companies and involved in maintenance quite a bit. I was in management and worked with both company staff and contractors.
I learned long ago that being skeptical of someone's ability until they prove themselves is prudent.

I learned to always ask questions, fortunately I was in a position that the people who worked for me and/or contractors were pretty much obligated to respond. I would ask the same questions different ways always looking for discrepancies in the response and the hone in on those.

Over the years I've seen a little bit of everything, some real odd ball stuff. We got a piece of equipment in that had continual engine problems, spent many hours working with company reps and mechanics on the issue. We pulled the engine a couple time and sent it in for rebuild/repair. Ultimately we found the the injector pump had been set up to put out way too much HP for the application causing overheating and engine failure. It was a painful experience but we eventually figured it out.



I'd did a little deeper on the initial codes on the first injection pump. You might have to the foreman of the mechanic who's coming out to work on the rig. Get a copy of his report, it should have the fault codes listed. If it doesn't I would be questioning what they are doing and why, it would be a big red flag. And it may be time to ask for the A team mechanic!!



You say you rig is parked in a barn, do you have problems with rodents. A chewed wire would cause a problem for sure.



The gird heaters are on top of the engine.
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Old 12-08-2022, 10:41 AM   #8
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I have the complete service manual from the Cummins Quickserve site downloaded to my laptop.

Attached is the section on the preheat circuit. The technician can actually disable this using the laptop Insite program.



But they may not agree to put ether into the air intake, this can be very bad for an engine if it is abused.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Preheat.pdf (163.3 KB, 6 views)
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Old 12-08-2022, 01:06 PM   #9
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I once witnessed over 80 hours labor, two injector pumps, eight injectors, one lift pump, countless filters and all new fuel lines once on one of our old Ford 3208 cabover bucket trucks. (one apprentice and one mechanic who shoulda known better)
Turns out it was a sandwich baggie inside the fuel tank…
Point is, never overlook the obvious basics.
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Old 12-08-2022, 02:25 PM   #10
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I changed my fuel injectors its not difficult just awkward took me 4 hrs but now that I've done it could do in 2
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Old 12-08-2022, 08:02 PM   #11
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When the first replacement main pump was installed, did they also replace the transient high voltage suppressor? If not, a bad suppressor can/will very easily ruin the main pump and ECM.
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Old 12-09-2022, 04:52 AM   #12
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Thanks for sharing the document. Is there a section on injector removal, thinking I could possibly do that myself and save $850 in labor and clean them myself?
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Old 12-09-2022, 04:58 AM   #13
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Any special tools or post change needed, like bleeding air or anything that an experienced tech is needed for? I'm handy, got tools, just never gone to this level of work on the big diesel.
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Old 12-09-2022, 05:00 AM   #14
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Upon first diagnosis, they first replaced the suppressor, so the suppressor is new as is the CAPS pump now.
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