Community Forums

Craig1960 · 06-29-2022, 08:45 AM

So I'm waiting for my oil pan and have been cleaning, cleaning and more cleaning in the meantime. I knew I had a bit of a leak on my injection pump but now it seems to be worse then I thought.
I don't really want to do the job but it's almost impossible to get anyone around here to work on engines in motorhomes. I can't say that I blame them either. So I'm looking at taking it off and my question is can the shaft seal be replaced without taking it into a shop for disassembly?
The pump works great and I know if I take it to a shop they will want to rebuild it most likely and I don't want to spend that money right now. If I have to take it in I will but hoping I can do it at my place.

Skip426 · 06-29-2022, 11:49 AM

Engine oil , or fuel leak ??

YOU WILL want Cummins info on removal , there is specific procedure to make sure injector timing is maintained during re-installation.

The pump is HEAVY , take every precaution , even dropping 2" can break fingers if yours happened to get in the way.

Craig1960 · 06-29-2022, 12:51 PM

Yes I know it's heavy and not something I really want to do "but" nobody around here will work on it. Thought I found a shop this morning but the only guy in the shop that had worked on the FI pumps before is the owner and he said he just doesn't have time and referred me to Freightliner who said $3000 for a rough quote on just R&R and didn't know when they would be able to get it in.:(

I'm still cleaning so that I can see for sure but I did notice the throttle shaft was leaking a bit when I fixed the cruise control last fall so I'm thinking it's fuel. I do have an oil leak at the pan and have ordered the parts for that which should be here next week.

As for the proper procedure I'm not a mechanic but I'm pretty sure I know what to do as far as the timing on both the engine and pump. We did a couple in our shop where I was the equipment manager a few years ago but they were easy to get at and the mechanic I put on the job had lots of exprience, if he was still around I'd try to get him to help but he's retired in South America now. My biggest concern is like you said they are heavey and there's not much room to work in there.
The joys of owning an older dp. lol

Skip426 · 06-29-2022, 01:03 PM

I worked on the P-7100 on a few Dodge / Cummins , it's been a number of years , but ,if memory serves the throttle shaft into the rear housing is an engine oil lubricated area.

I'll see if I can pull up info to confirm , but it maybe an external press in seal , that MIGHT be changeable with the pump in place.

EDIT: Online info says; you can try , but results may vary . I will keep looking for something more definite.

Craig1960 · 06-29-2022, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip426

I worked on the P-7100 on a few Dodge / Cummins , it's been a number of years , but ,if memory serves the throttle shaft into the rear housing is an engine oil lubricated area.

I'll see if I can pull up info to confirm , but it maybe an external press in seal , that MIGHT be changeable with the pump in place.

EDIT: Online info says; you can try , but results may vary . I will keep looking for something more definite.

Thanks Skip, and you could be right about it being oil, I haven't run it again since I've been cleaning. When I was looking for the oil pan leaks I had a 4x8 sheet of aluminum under the engine. It looked like fuel that was mixed with oil residue that I hadn't cleaned and it was under the FI pump.
I'm going to take the air filter off after I run it to get a better look and see if there may be other leaks in that area and I think I'll need to move the hyd. tank out of the way when I go to work on it.

That would be great if you can find any info on it as I'm not having much luck yet.

Craig1960 · 06-29-2022, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip426

I worked on the P-7100 on a few Dodge / Cummins , it's been a number of years , but ,if memory serves the throttle shaft into the rear housing is an engine oil lubricated area.

I'll see if I can pull up info to confirm , but it maybe an external press in seal , that MIGHT be changeable with the pump in place.

EDIT: Online info says; you can try , but results may vary . I will keep looking for something more definite.

You are right, it is oil lubricated. I just ran it for close to a 1/2 hour and had a couple drips which were oil. As far as I could tell today it's just the shaft leaking and of course the pin hole in the pan. If the rain holds off tomorrow I will pull the air cleaner and have a good look around the pump for any other leaks.

I just saw the same info online about the "results may vary" and can see why they say that. I'm going to see if I can find out how it can be done and decide from there what to do, it sure would be nice if I could do it without pulling the pump off.
Thanks again for your advice.

Craig1960 · 06-30-2022, 10:39 AM

Any idea where I can find a parts breakdown for the pump so I can order the seal? I couldn't find anything on Quickserve and not having any luck finding it online either.

Skip426 · 06-30-2022, 11:39 AM

I saw a seal advertised yesterday , but it looked more like the pump to timing gear housing seal ring than a throttle shaft seal . I will let you know if I can find anything useful .

Craig1960 · 06-30-2022, 12:49 PM

Thanks Skip, I think I saw the same one and it did look like the o ring for the pump to the timing gear housing.

Skip426 · 06-30-2022, 07:04 PM

Ok , I found a site that sells a throttle shaft seal for the VE pump ; that the pump used on Dodge Cummins , before the P 7100 ; and a blog ( I think that's what it was

) where the fellow had the shaft leak on a P pump .

He discussed the method to replace the seal , on the engine , but didn't mention a part number ; went on to describe pitting on the shaft that took out the seal , then went deep into removing the shaft , redoing the surface ( rather than buy a new shaft ) and bushing the housing due to wear .

I think the pitting and possible wear of the housing ; is the reason the other site said " limited success " with just the seal replacement .

If you care to contact , these people, they say online , if there is a part available they will find it.

www.puredieselpower.com

715-254-1833

Craig1960 · 06-30-2022, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip426

Ok , I found a site that sells a throttle shaft seal for the VE pump ; that the pump used on Dodge Cummins , before the P 7100 ; and a blog ( I think that's what it was

) where the fellow had the shaft leak on a P pump .

He discussed the method to replace the seal , on the engine , but didn't mention a part number ; went on to describe pitting on the shaft that took out the seal , then went deep into removing the shaft , redoing the surface ( rather than buy a new shaft ) and bushing the housing due to wear .

I think the pitting and possible wear of the housing ; is the reason the other site said " limited success " with just the seal replacement .

If you care to contact , these people, they say online , if there is a part available they will find it.

www.puredieselpower.com

715-254-1833

Again thanks for your help on this Skip. I think I read that one as well and a couple others where one guy drilled 2 holes in the seal, then screwed in a couple screws and pulled the old one out that way while on the truck.
I don't know if I have room to do that, it will be pretty close.
I have a friend in Campbell River that is planning on coming here next weekend to pick up parts for his hotrod and he use to be a HD mechanic. So I think I will see if I can get the seal out before he gets here and if that doesn't work I will have someone with some experience that can help me take the pump out of there.
I haven't told him yet about my plan but I'm pretty sure he will give me a hand. lol

Skip426 · 07-01-2022, 08:24 AM

Ok , good luck , if memory serves , there is only one special tool to remove the pump , the gear puller ; this picture below was the Dodge/Cummins tool ; used because of limited clearance between the timing gear cover and radiator shroud on the PUs.
I also saw on one site a HD timing lock for the P pumps , don't know why it'd be necessary , just an item of interest .

Have your beer fridge full : I'm sure he'll help then . lol

Craig1960 · 07-01-2022, 08:44 AM

Yup saw that and ordered this kit which included that.
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B07...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

shootist · 07-01-2022, 09:02 AM

https://www.google.com/search?q=shaf...=firefox-b-1-m I used these on a big rototiller in the past as well as crank shafts. Might check out if you can get one for the shaft you're dealing with.