Urgent: Where's my oil going?

[WILDEBILL308]

Originally Posted by Dtwallace

I didn't see what engine you have but it's been my experience with the Cat C-7, Cummins 8+ ltr, and the Big internationals, you just may have some high pressure oil in your injector pockets leaking into the combustion chamber. Normally when this happens, you will hear a stumble from the effected cylinders. But I've found on DP motorhomes, that stumble or indication of weak cylinder is impossible to hear or feel from up front. From your posts, you have completely eliminated the turbo, and valve seals problems on a non-normally aspirated engine will show up as massive blow back at the oil cap where you found no issues. How ever, if you have someone that can assist you, you can confirm you findings by using the power brake test.
if you're not familiar with this term, It's done by having your assistant put the coach in gear, forward preferably, with parking brake applied, left foot always on brake pedal. Give the engine enough fuel to load the engine to just the amount used to pull off. You are at the back of the coach at this time, and can do the oil cap of test. you should get just a little blow back but no pressure build up. Also you'll be in the position to see how much if any oil smoke comes out of you exhaust system. This test should take no more than three minutes and will not harm your transmission in any way. You can also confirm the integrity of your air charge system this way detecting any leaks in the intercooler or associated hoses. I would suspect from the amount of oil your engine is using, it's being burned during the combustion process. It will be misted into the combustion chamber like normal fuel, and burn just as clean, hence no oil smoke. You may detect an oil burn odor from the exhaust system.
Injector seals are not that difficult to replace with the right tools and proper training, but might not be something you'd want to tackle in the parking lot. I would use this information to and have a full diagnostic check done on the high oil pressure system. This internal leak should show up as lower than normal pressure under load. Then you'll have your problem pinpointed, and no money wasted.
I hope this 2ct helps.

Why don't you go back and review the earlier post? You might want to look at the pictures.
Bill

[Dtwallace]

Thanks Bill,
I had not seen these and I'm sure now I was about mid way through all the other posts. Looks like a complete rebuild is in order here and he'll have a like new engine again. Best of luck, and if it were my project, I'd stick with it to the end. The end result should be well worth it. Too bad this is not a sleeve engine.

[Piker]

The guy with the portable boring machine finally made it out to look things over last night. He said it would be a piece of cake, and would not have any problems getting those two cylinders bored and honed to .040" over... he also said he could break the glaze on the other 4 cylinders with a ball hone.

He has done this several times in the past on farm tractors with good results, and also has a customer with a 5.9 Cummins that has had two .040 over pistons in it for almost 300,000 miles. This all makes me feel more confident.

The guy seemed intelligent and forthcoming, so I asked him what the cost would be, thinking in my head it would probably be $500 or $600... but he responded with "how 'bout $150?" To which I said, "no way, how 'bout $250." I dunno, maybe I'm crazy, but I've been in business for myself before, and I know how hard it can be... it didn't seem like he would make very good money for his time at $150. What's the point in someone feeling like they have to rush through a job because they know they aren't going to make wages? Better off just to pay them what their worth to you as opposed to just what the market will support. But I digress...

At any rate, hopefully within the next 2 weeks he can make it out to actually get the boring done. I'll try to post pictures of the process when he comes.

-cheers

[PushedAround]

That's great news. I had a feeling that it could be fixed in place.

[MnTom]

That is good news! I think you made the right choice about the price. That would probably help with the quality of work too!

[Mekanic]

Originally Posted by MnTom

That is good news! I think you made the right choice about the price. That would probably help with the quality of work too!

X2 on that.

Glad to hear the project is moving in a forward direction.

[DieselTech39]

Piker,
Sorry to hear you are having all these problems. Most of my experience was with the 4 cyl version of your motor. (4BT) The mid 90's had CAC (Charge Air Coolers) none had inter-coolers.

That said I did read you are installing a new turbo capsule, that's good. It's important to clean all the air induction areas between the turbo outlet and the intake manifold.

If it's equipped with an inter-cooler or a CAC it's hard to get those small particles out of those parts, especially sandy dust. It can be done, but after all your work it would be a shame if something was left in them and became dislodged and entered a cylinder.

JMHO and trying to help.

[Piker]

Originally Posted by DieselTech39

Piker,
Sorry to hear you are having all these problems. Most of my experience was with the 4 cyl version of your motor. (4BT) The mid 90's had CAC (Charge Air Coolers) none had inter-coolers.

That said I did read you are installing a new turbo capsule, that's good. It's important to clean all the air induction areas between the turbo outlet and the intake manifold.

If it's equipped with an inter-cooler or a CAC it's hard to get those small particles out of those parts, especially sandy dust. It can be done, but after all your work it would be a shame if something was left in them and became dislodged and entered a cylinder.

JMHO and trying to help.

Ya, I've been wondering myself how I'm going to get the CAC clean... I don't think I want to even guess at what a new one costs. I know it has to be removed to have any hope of a successful scrubbing... I think with the engine disassembled that there's enough room in the engine compartment to get it out through the inside. What I do with it then... I have no idea.

I figure I'll have to shake the heck out of it with some sort of detergent solution sloshing around inside. I was thinking that dishwasher detergent or cloths washer detergent would help lift any grime that might be stuck inside? I dunno. I'm sure it will take hours.

I've also got to figure out how I'm going to change the air cleaner setup so this doesn't happen again. That's down the road though... right now I've got to concentrate on this just one step at a time, so for now, I'm just concentrating on getting the cylinders bored.

Thanks for the insight.

-cheers

[Annierufus]

Just thinking out loud... What if you made an adaptor to connect a garden hose to flush water through it under pressure ?


Joe 1998 Itasca Sunflyer Ford 460

[Piker]

Originally Posted by Annierufus

Just thinking out loud... What if you made an adaptor to connect a garden hose to flush water through it under pressure ?


Joe 1998 Itasca Sunflyer Ford 460

Thought about that too... issue is, the cross section of the CAC is huge, so while you might be able to pressurize it with a hose, the velocity of the water flowing through it would be very slow. I mean, a hose has a 1/2" hole in the center... the CAC has 4" holes.

I think some sort of powerful detergent is going to be necessary... and lots of time and patience.

This whole thing still just bums me out sometimes. I had plans of painting new stripes on the old girl this summer... not rebuilding the engine...

Ah well... We'll get through it.

-cheers

[Annierufus]

Perhaps if you restrict the exit of the water to allow the whole thing to pressurize ? Hopefully someone here will have a method. Good luck and stay strong


Joe 1998 Itasca Sunflyer Ford 460

[Piker]

Originally Posted by Annierufus

Perhaps if you restrict the exit of the water to allow the whole thing to pressurize ? Hopefully someone here will have a method. Good luck and stay strong


Joe 1998 Itasca Sunflyer Ford 460

Well, I think if you restrict the outlet, you just speed up the water right at the place where you restrict it. Through the whole CAC the water would just kind of still be meandering through.

I think you'd need a firehose... lol

-cheers

[Mekanic]

Purple Stuff cleaner is a good cleaner for thick aluminum.
A CAC is much thicker than a radiator core.
I'd use it on the inside of a CAC but not inside a radiator.

[WILDEBILL308]

Why not call Cummins and see if they have any suggestions. You are not the first with this problem. Try a local truck repair shop. There has to be a way to clean one when it was made.
Bill