New Platform for amazing zero emission, high performance RV?

[nothermark]

I can say that trucking may be Tesla's Waterloo. There is a long thread about electric buses and trying to equate them to an electric MH. Simply put, there is a huge difference between how people use their RV and how a heavy truck is used. Same with total cost. For the latter a truck driving 1000 miles a day will balance out the cost of fuel against twice the purchase price a lot faster than somebody driving 400 miles ever 3 days or week. That is based on spoke and hub trucking with a recharge in the middle.

As far as charging stations go there may be a lot but they are mostly clustered along the interstates. Good for trucks but not good for folks who want to get off the super slabs and see the country. It's not even practical for somebody like me to own a pure RV in upstate NY because I tend to head toward the southern border to recreate. The loop trips are longer than an EV's range with no recharge in the middle. That includes the free super slab across the bottom of the state that passes through some middle sized cities. The point is that it will take thousands or 10's of thousands to really get sufficient charging stations to equal what can be easily done on gasoline or diesel.

If you want to go the on board generator route then it will take one the size of the truck main engine plus a fuel tank to back it up to run the truck off the generator. If you want to reduce the generator size then increase the run time correspondingly. No free lunch on power usage.

[nothermark]

Here is the electric bus thread:

http://www.irv2.com/forums/f59/elect...325890-43.html

43 pages of why heavy duty EV's may, may not, be a good idea for the RV community.

[Chargerman]

Don’t you think that the Tesla Engineers knew the carrying capacity needs and the target distance prior to designing the rig? Also, Walmart has already signed on to purchase them for their fleet. You can bet that there are milestones and performance minimums in that contract. My bet is that there will be an electric RV of some size within ten years

[EdInArk]

Originally Posted by George Schweikle

Don't forget what Confucius said, or P.T. Barnum, or maybe it was Murphy: "If it seems too good to be true, it probably is".

Elon Musk is a neat person, but I think his mouth sometimes gets ahead of reality, and I haven't drunk his Tesla koolaid just yet. Just google "Tesla production hell" to see what he acknowledges are some problems with the Model 3 car.

Now, it's late and I had a beer before writing the above, so I acknowledge there is no progress without dreamers.... I like his progress in reusable rockets.

Just think of the pitfalls of any new technology. There were certainly people at the beginning of the automobile age who said they didn't need to slow, unreliable contraptions. And they were right for the time

I'm certainly no pioneer; I wasn't even willing to accept the complication of a hybrid when we replaced my wife's personal automobile.

[nothermark]

Originally Posted by Chargerman

Don’t you think that the Tesla Engineers knew the carrying capacity needs and the target distance prior to designing the rig? Also, Walmart has already signed on to purchase them for their fleet. You can bet that there are milestones and performance minimums in that contract. My bet is that there will be an electric RV of some size within ten years

Yes, I think Tesla had a target. If you followed the longer bus thread you would see that I already addressed it. With a hub and spoke freight system anybody with a steady stream of dedicated freight can move between terminals ~500 miles apart and recharge during a lunch break to flip or head for the next terminal and sleep time. That's fine for dedicated routes.

Anybody with a MH will have to be very careful where they plan on landing to make sure they have a charging port. Not that easy in much of the country despite the hoopla about charging stations getting put in. They will pay a significant upcharge for the all electric unit. I think Tesla is running around $100,000 extra for the truck. That is not likely to drop.

Right now the vehicles are essentially free of fuel tax. That will have to end if there is much market penetration. The various government entities are all too dependent on the money from road and fuel taxes. The added electrical infrastructure will need to be paid for. That cancels a lot of the fuel cost savings.

The availability of an EV chassis will almost guarantee somebody with a point to make and deep pockets will do an EV motor home. Most MH buyers won't pay the extra or want the limitations. There will be limitations.

[100Akers]

I for one am excited over the possibilities presented by the Tesla Semi. So excited that I've placed my deposit. And hope to take it to Showhauler in a few years for them to do their magic. Crazy? Probably. For everyone? Certainly not. Cure-all for all the world's problems? Maybe not for even one of them. But the possibilities are huge, so I'm going to pursue them. Btw, the deposit is refundable for any reason up to the start of production of my unit.

[engine103]

All batteries have a useful life don't they? Not sure I would trust the guy selling me a used electric vehicle in the future claiming it's got a lot of life left in it. " Yes ms. Walmart person, I'd like a 500 kwh battery and here's my core oh and I have a coupon." ( actually I'm too old to even worry about it.) Jim E. OKC

[rheil]

Great conversations....

Couple notes/thoughts:

Much of the new Tesla Truck is purported to be from existing Model 3 parts - same motors, same electronics, same displays... so lots fo reuse of existing mainline parts. On an investors conference call Musk noted they'll have much better margins from the semi than Model 3. https://insideevs.com/tesla-semi-use...ngeable-parts/

Batteries do lose performance over a well known steady power curve. For automotive uses Lithiums are great to 70-80% of life which is about 5-10 years. Tesla plans on recycling these automotive batteries then into solar/energy applications in industrial powerewalls where weight to power doesnt matter and work great down to 20% (so 15-20 years). Point is in a few years Tesla will likely buying back powerpacks for their second and third life value. They are also recyclable, which is part of the Nevada battery plant.

So for RV use batteries should be no issue as to lifespan... https://www.greencarreports.com/news...ta-show-so-far

Showhauler would be a great idea... looking at some of the early pictures it looks like the chassis 'might' be easy to extend. The powertrain is distinct from the battery pack via same huge cables (look like gauge 00 or 000 ). Fun project!!! https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-semi...train-gearbox/

[CBQ]

I think given Tesla's inability to ramp up production on cars, you are going to have a very, very long wait before that show up on truck conversions. Still an interesting idea though.

[FatDog]

This is our dualie electric yard truck. It has more torque then our similarly sized diesel 5th wheel pullers. It regularly pulls 40K+ pound trailers as if they were empty.


But quiet this generation of truck is not. Its a different noise then the diesels, it has an annoying whine. You get used to it and future generations will undoubtably be quieter.

[nothermark]

I would not count on it getting quieter. All the technology there is relatively old. There is a lot of power moving around in that motor and it's controller. Anything that can vibrate will. Ditto the motor rotor winding up.

BTW - that is an excellent use for an EV. The battery weight works to keep the cab in charge for the weight balance. No long range driving between chances to charge.

[nothermark]

I saw this and thought it belonged here too:

https://hardware.slashdot.org/story/...lectric-planes

I still won't hold my breath waiting for an electric MH for reasons previously stated. On the other hand this might be a breakthrough for battery technology that brings us closer. They still benefit from moving between known destinations that will need to have the proper terminal equipment to service the planes.

[radar]

Good article Nothermark. Interesting developments.

I think we are less than theee years from seeing the first Electric RV’s based on Semis. A standard 50 amp 240 plug in an RV Park would be more than adequate for many of us who usually stay 3 to 7 days in each location. Meter it so the campground can make it a profit centre or maybe just higher daily use fees. EVSE’s would have to be set to 40 amp Max. Assuming a 300 KWh battery for a good fifth wheel hauler, a full charge would be 30 hours. Then again, most of us with EV’s rarely arrive at our destination on empty.

We are an all EV household...except for the Diesel pusher. Looking forward to our first EVRV. For us it will probably be a model 3 or model Y hauling an Aliner. Almost time to downsize.

[Fiesta48]

Let's put electricity into perspective. Most charging stations come from the power grid. There is a 60% line loss of power getting it to the charging stations. Yes your only getting 40% of the power used at the generating station. Same at home. And generating stations are not emissions free.
This is bad science unless the the power is clean and effecient.