Another Siezed Brake - Lazy Days RV, Tampa

[erkme73]

I bought my used 2002 Damon Intruder in April 2009 (just about a year ago). A month later, an ABS light came on. I took it to the dealer from whom I'd purchased it, and, not knowing about the pending recall, paid $200 to have it replaced. The dealer either didn't know about the interim notice, or it hadn't been issued at that point.

A year later (just a couple of weeks ago), on 5/14/2010 the MH brakes STB. I noticed sluggishness, and a horrible break smell. I thought (hoped) it was "the car in front of me". Then the ABS light came on. By the time I got to the campground (just a few more miles away), the coach wouldn't pull forward at idle on flat ground, and the brake pedal had gone to the floor. Only the last 1/2" of travel provided any real stopping power.

I called the WH recall number, and they suggested I have it towed (at my expense) to Lazy Days RV in Tampa - only 20 miles from the campground. After completing my camping for the weekend, and the pedal having recovered, I drove it to Lazy Days.

Armed with the recall information, the previous ABS sensor failure, and having experienced all FIVE of the warning signs listed on the interim notic just a few days earlier, I figured it was a slam dunk. Today, I got the estimate email from Lazy Days:

Brake pedal goes to the floor -- Need to replace the ABS sensor, clean and lube the guide pins on the brake calipers (recommended annually by workhorse), brake flush which would eliminate the high moisture content as verified w/ test strip and install a zert fitting in the bell crank for the master cylinder $1000

I replied defensively, reiterating the facts - including that another dealership had replaced the ABS sensor just a year earlier. Their reply:

The brake flush is in the newer manual and it is recommended. The interim letter, is true and you may have experience the symptoms but does not fall under the interim letter at this time. The tech stated that if the sensor was replace they should have done the maintenance or recommended to you as a prevention from this issue possibly happening.

So, now I don't know what to do. I don't know how far I can push Lazy Days.

Should I insist they work this up the ladder with WH?
Should I simply take my MH and go elsewhere?
What keeps me from paying $1k now, and having a problem in 6-12 mo and they come up w/some other reason?
I am mechanically inclined, and wouldn't mind tackling the repair job myself, but...

I've only been at Lazy Day's service for one other issue, and the experience left me with a sour taste. I knew I shouldn't have gone there, but not knowing how serious the brake failure may be, I didn't want to push my luck taking it to a center further away.

BTW, anyone know where to get a 1 1/8" tire iron?

[Oemtech]

Originally Posted by erkme73

.

Should I insist they work this up the ladder with WH?
Should I simply take my MH and go elsewhere?
What keeps me from paying $1k now, and having a problem in 6-12 mo and they come up w/some other reason?
I am mechanically inclined, and wouldn't mind tackling the repair job myself, but...

I've only been at Lazy Day's service for one other issue, and the experience left me with a sour taste. I knew I shouldn't have gone there, but not knowing how serious the brake failure may be, I didn't want to push my luck taking it to a center further away.

BTW, anyone know where to get a 1 1/8" tire iron?

I would have them call Workhorse first and see what they say.

[max49]

It sounds like they are blaming it on you, same old story. They probably figure the odds of getting money out of you is better than than the odds of getting it from WH. And they'll get more from you.
Pretty sorry situation.
Fix it yourself or take it else where, they're wanting to charge you for a bunch of flunky work that's not going to "fix" it any way.

[Full-Timers]

If you are a pretty good “do it your selfer”, the work is pretty easy however you should not have to do it yourself. I would push the issue and only do it yourself if and when you get fed up with Lazy Days.

[jdsr]

Originally Posted by erkme73

I bought my used 2002 Damon Intruder in April 2009 (just about a year ago). A month later, an ABS light came on. I took it to the dealer from whom I'd purchased it, and, not knowing about the pending recall, paid $200 to have it replaced. The dealer either didn't know about the interim notice, or it hadn't been issued at that point.

A year later (just a couple of weeks ago), on 5/14/2010 the MH brakes STB. I noticed sluggishness, and a horrible break smell. I thought (hoped) it was "the car in front of me". Then the ABS light came on. By the time I got to the campground (just a few more miles away), the coach wouldn't pull forward at idle on flat ground, and the brake pedal had gone to the floor. Only the last 1/2" of travel provided any real stopping power.

I called the WH recall number, and they suggested I have it towed (at my expense) to Lazy Days RV in Tampa - only 20 miles from the campground. After completing my camping for the weekend, and the pedal having recovered, I drove it to Lazy Days.

Armed with the recall information, the previous ABS sensor failure, and having experienced all FIVE of the warning signs listed on the interim notic just a few days earlier, I figured it was a slam dunk. Today, I got the estimate email from Lazy Days:

I replied defensively, reiterating the facts - including that another dealership had replaced the ABS sensor just a year earlier. Their reply:

So, now I don't know what to do. I don't know how far I can push Lazy Days.

Should I insist they work this up the ladder with WH?
Should I simply take my MH and go elsewhere?
What keeps me from paying $1k now, and having a problem in 6-12 mo and they come up w/some other reason?
I am mechanically inclined, and wouldn't mind tackling the repair job myself, but...

I've only been at Lazy Day's service for one other issue, and the experience left me with a sour taste. I knew I shouldn't have gone there, but not knowing how serious the brake failure may be, I didn't want to push my luck taking it to a center further away.

BTW, anyone know where to get a 1 1/8" tire iron?

Nothing they have recommended you to do will solve your problems or prevent you from having another failure but if wh recommends you to do these they should pay to have it done. This is not your fault and you should not have to pay for their def brake system. Take it up the ladder or better yet contact navistar. BTW, IMO there isnt a dealer in this country that doesnt know about wh brake problems or this recall, dont let them bs you.

[Spoonman]

Everyone should be paying attention here, this is just a preview of what you are going to get from SOME service centers when this recall begins. HANG ON TO YOUR WALLETS!!!!!

[erkme73]

I've contacted the dealer who sold the MH to me a year ago. As part of the original sales order, they indicated that they changed the rotors and brake pads, and 'sucked out excess brake fluid to accommodate the new liners'. I've asked them if they changed the fluid or lubricated the calipers. So far no answer yet.

Since those pads and rotors have less than 1500 miles on them, and the first interim notice didn't come out until a few weeks after they did this work, the dealer wouldn't have known that they should have changed the fluid (or lubed the calipers). For Lazy Days to now say that "it's in the newer manual" is absolute bull. Does that imply that when I buy a 2002 vehicle, I need to monthly get a copy of the newest manuals that don't even match my build year?

I had a 1 year window of ownership - who in their right minds goes to the dealer when they don't have any pressing maintenance or repairs - just to see if the manufacturer changed recommendations?

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by Spoonman

Everyone should be paying attention here, this is just a preview of what you are going to get from SOME service centers when this recall begins. HANG ON TO YOUR WALLETS!!!!!

Spoonman, That imperitive has always been present. I have suggested that everyone shop around and do what they can in their best interests to save money.

If I were in Florida, I would take my motorhomes to Golby Motors in Orlando or the new International Dealer. Owners who have given me feedback on their service experience were pleased with the service and price they paid at Golby.

Golby Motor Corporation
485 E Donegan Ave Kissimmee, FL 34744
(407)859-9000
Fax: TBD
Mapquest | Google Maps Rate this dealer

Now here a new dealer in Orlando.

Maudlin International Trucks, Inc. (Orlando)
2300 S. Division Avenue Orlando, FL 32805
(407)849-6440
Fax: (407)423-0235
ccalhoun@maudlinintl.com
Mapquest | Google Maps Rate this dealer

There are 2 Chevrolet dealers, Courtesy in Orlando and Register in Brooksville.

ABC Bus has told owners that they don't take in out of warranty issues however I do not know how they are approaching the Interim phase of the brake recall. (800) 222-2871

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by erkme73

I've contacted the dealer who sold the MH to me a year ago. As part of the original sales order, they indicated that they changed the rotors and brake pads, and 'sucked out excess brake fluid to accommodate the new liners'. I've asked them if they changed the fluid or lubricated the calipers. So far no answer yet..

There is no way or no how that a set of Bosch 66mm calipers are going to survive a full piston reset into the caliper bores without getting stuck as the reseat themseves. Once the Genie is out of the box there's no putting him back in.

The resolution would be therefore a 4 caliper replacement IF you indeed have gotten new brake pads and rotors on all 4 sides. If the selling dealer didn't do this before he released the vehicle to you I would say that it's very unfortunate that you are left to deal with this issue however it definitely has to be addressed. I also expect that the other calipers will begin exhibiting seizures and it'll probably cascade one after the other.

We have seen here where owners have purchased calipers including new brake pads for about ~$100.00 each.

Make sure that you are listed as the owner of record so that you can get the recall information send to you in the mail. At the end of the day you will be receiving 4 new calipers and any other components that have been compromised by a seized caliper.

If all you brake components are new, then simply replacing the calipers should net you out the door with a "Zero" balance when you have the recall accomplished.

If you need further assistance with your case, please send me a PM with your VIN# and I will try to help you as best as I can.

[bsinmich]

Workhorse will do anything to avoid paying to have a repair done. Everything is the fault of the owner. Welcome!

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by bsinmich

Workhorse will do anything to avoid paying to have a repair done. Everything is the fault of the owner. Welcome!

Bill, I'm sorry but that is incorrect. Workhorse is going at this Interim repair alone and is paying for the repairs out of pocket. They will however question whether or not the defect is related to the Interim Repair Procedures. There is nothing hidden as all the items that will cause WCC to pay for the repair are listed and detailed with photographs.

We are also reading here in these threads that service centers are helping owners with the repairs and I expect that will continue until the recall begins. I can not however vouch for every center in the system but the majority will try to help their customers. Bill, if you need help just drop me a PM and I'll try to work through the issue with you.

[erkme73]

Originally Posted by DriVer

erkme73, First of all please do not use any type of vulgarity even if it is implied by underline. The moderators are not going to sustain that type of intent or language.

Sorry about that. I'm usually more reserved, but this really has gotten my goat. I tried to go back to edit, but I think it timed out already...

The selling dealer agrees that rather than spending another $1k (with him or Lazy Days), if I don't need to use the RV, I should put it in storage until the new parts come out. I'm ok with that for now.

[erkme73]

Ok, so here's the latest... Everything so far has been done via email - which is great for record keeping and jogging memories.

The dealer who sold the RV to me one year ago confirms that they only change the rotors and brake pads - not the fluid. When the changed the ABS sensor a month later (5/09) they did document that it was the right rear wheel.

He said now that they know about the recall, he detailed the process that they use - including sending photos and notes to WH. He questioned whether Lazy Days actually did anything through WH.

With that, I sent another email to Lazy Days, asking specifically if WH helped make the determination of fault due to lack of maintenance. Instead of an email reply, the Service Manager (TJ) contacted me by phone. He wanted to know which wheel's ABS sensor was replaced a year ago. Mind you, the estimate I received from Lazy Days this week did not indicate which wheel needed the sensor replaced. I looked it up, and confirmed it was the right-rear. TJ said, "Ok, it's the same one again. We'll get on the phone and ask them to replace the sensor at no charge.".

I told him I appreciated the gesture, but that was not acceptable. If the same wheel locking up and destroying an ABS sensor is grounds for a 'free sensor', then there must be something wrong with that wheel. I told him again that my manual (from 2002) has no mention of brake fluid changes, or lubing the calipers. He agreed and said he'd submit that to WH as well, but he didn't think it would work. But, he said he'd be willing to "work with me" on the cost of the maintenance.

For some reason it struck me that he recognized that I intend on not having the work done - and that perhaps my original selling dealer is willing to file all the documentation properly. TJ now owes me a call.

As I posted above, for now, I'm in no hurry, and intend on simply waiting for new parts. Of course, I welcome any and all opinions.

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by erkme73

The selling dealer agrees that rather than spending another $1k (with him or Lazy Days), if I don't need to use the RV, I should put it in storage until the new parts come out. I'm ok with that for now.

erkme73, That solution stinks BUT if you are indeed going back work and if it is convenient for you, that is one option. I would press for the repair if I needed to use the rig but only you will know what you need. Which dealer are you going to take the motorhome to to have the recall done?

Lazy Days would not be my 1st pick.